1851 Census lookup Scruton / Bedale

[Wrigleys]

If George and ? popped up to Gretna, ? turns her toes up, why then did my George retain his birth name ?

Two marriages in Jun 1860 seem the only possibles for George - Free BDM isn't quite complete for 1851-1861 but very close

Could they have popped up to Gretna Green?

No sign of a Kilburn on the same pages

Trish

[trish251]

I think I'm confused - but I guess my thoughts were - hope this sounds sensible -

1853 Jane Kilburn gives birth to George Kilburn

Some time after this date (but before 1861)
George Catterick marries Jane Kilburn (but no sign of the marriage)

Jane Kilburn dies before 1861 - so George Catterick is a widower 1861

George Kilburn is with Mary Catterick 1861 as a visitor (step grandchild perhaps?)

By 1871, George Kilburn living with his step father George Catterick (who may or may not be his real father as well)

This is all absolute supposition - I can make up any story to fit the facts 

Trish

[Pels.]

I've just checked FreeBMD for North Riding of Yorkshire deaths,
there is only one female Catterick death between the years 1850 to 1862 in the Bedale registration district:

Mar. qtr. 1861

Jane Catterick

Vol. 10a, page 78

Out of curiosity I checked the 1851 census and I don't seem to find a Jane Catterick living in the Bedale registration area.

I wonder therefore if this could be your Jane?

[Pels.]

Pete, this death could confirm that Trish is right .. .. the child most likely would be staying elsewhere if George was grieving.

Pels

[trish251]

the child most likely would be staying elsewhere if George was grieving.

Pels

Hi Pels

I think this is a little modern day terminology - the child was probably staying elsewhere because George had to go to work & men didn't mind young children - that was for their wives and mothers   

Thus said - the death was a very interesting find - maybe my story is not as far fetched as I thought. Perhaps the marriage is one of the very few for the time period not yet transcribed. I'll let Pete do the 10 year scroll through the full indexes. 

Trish

[Wrigleys]

Trish, Pels

OK, Jane Kilburn has George Kilburn 1853, Jane marrys's George Catterick sometime 1853-1861, Jane dies, Mary Catterick has George Kilburn as a visitor 1861, George Catterick has George K as a stepson 1871,

George K marry's Aug 1874, under fathers name it is marked Illegitimate,

If Jane had had George out of wedlock, then George C marry's her (to make her an honest woman) would George K then have had his name changed to Catterick to avoid the "bastard" tag,

A scroll through the full indexes, I am not looking forward to, but, in order to possibly solve this problem that has been bugging me for nearly 5 years, I now know what I will be doing for the next few hours,

        Pete

[Pels.]

Pete, this death could confirm that Trish is right .. .. the child most likely would be staying elsewhere if George was grieving.

Pels

 

Trish the more I look at this, the more ridiculous it appears!!  

Pete - I've just had a look through the full indexes on Ancestry - nothing! Only the ones to be found on FreeBMD - I was convinced I'd find it!
Please double check though - it doesn't take long because there are only a few Cattericks.
The only thing left now would be a wrong spelling of the name  ..  I looked for Catterick.

[trish251]

Hello Pete

Guy Etchells on rootschat would be the best person to tell you about illegitimacy in UK. I don't think it could be altered by marriage until 1920s - somewhere on here it is discussed.

Did your George Kilburn marry as George Catterick? I hadn't picked that up. I know on the census people seemed to change the surname of children - perhaps because they didn't want the enumerator to know who was illegitimate! but usually on BDM certificates the registered name was used. Do you have the birth certifcate for George Kilburn. This may resolve if his mother was married or who is the father?

Some of our folks did try hard to hide their history. I have just discovered a rather important secret the family hid for  94 years - now a few folks are saying "we were never allowed to talk about that!"

Do hope you find the relationships - Pels has more stamina than me for searching the English indexes!! If she searched Catterick, perhaps you could search for a Jane Kilburn marriage.

Trish

[Wrigleys]

Georges birth certificate has blanks for father and occupation, just Jane Kilburn for the mother and the address of 16 Carters Row Darlington, George was married as Kilburn, under fathers name and occupation illigitemate has been recorded,

Hello Pete

Guy Etchells on rootschat would be the best person to tell you about illegitimacy in UK. I don't think it could be altered by marriage until 1920s - somewhere on here it is discussed.

Did your George Kilburn marry as George Catterick? I hadn't picked that up. I know on the census people seemed to change the surname of children - perhaps because they didn't want the enumerator to know who was illegitimate! but usually on BDM certificates the registered name was used. Do you have the birth certifcate for George Kilburn. This may resolve if his mother was married or who is the father?

Some of our folks did try hard to hide their history. I have just discovered a rather important secret the family hid for  94 years - now a few folks are saying "we were never allowed to talk about that!"

Do hope you find the relationships - Pels has more stamina than me for searching the English indexes!! If she searched Catterick, perhaps you could search for a Jane Kilburn marriage.

Trish