Death in WW2 bombing raid

[Valda]

Interesting use of the surname Payne in the Sweetlove family. It might very well be a coincidence or it could indicate why the choice of the Payne alias.

Marriages Mar 1878   
Sweetlove  Simmonds John     W Ashford  2a 821
possible spouse
Buller  Alice Ann    W. Ashford  2a 821   

Births Dec 1879   
Sweetlove  Simmonds Payne      W.Ashford  2a 719

Deaths Sep 1880 
SWEETLOVE  Simmonds John  28  W. Ashford  2a 409

Simmonds junior is on the 1881 census with his mother and older sister in Charing.

Marriages Dec 1901
SWEETLOVE  Simmonds Payne      Farnham  2a 223
either 
COCKERTON  Cecilia Charlotte    Farnham  2a 223 
or
Green  Alice Louise     Farnham  2a 223   

Regards

Valda

[aghadowey]

Have been reading the above postings with great interest. It certainly is a challenge to get to the truth. Here's a few thoughts:

1. Clara Ellen J. Ehmed, daughter of William James Ehmed & Clara Jane Sweetlove, born 1878 West Ashford, Kent area.
2. Clara Ellen J. Ehmed marries 1898 Leonard Thomas S. Screve (her cousin?).
3. Leonard & Clara Screve have a daughter Rosamond Screve, born Jan-Mar.1899 West Ashford, Kent area.
4. Rosamond Screve died a few months later in July-Sept.1899.
5. At this point perhaps the marriage of Leonard & Clara Sreve breaks up. Have been unable to locate Leonard in 1901 Census.
6. Clara Ehmed, born Charing Kent 1877, is servant at Sandgate in 1901. Also found is Arthur Offley (possible father of Muriel).
7. Muriel born 27 May 1913. Father listed as Arthur Offley. Living at Handsworth, Birmingham.
8. Muriel's marriage gives father as Arthur Payne, painter & decorator. It's most likely that Muriel's mother had told her these details. Now, Clara's father was painter & plumber. Also, According to information I found posted on ancestry.com William Sweetlove from Ashford Kent (right area) married Anna Payne (is this where father's surname on marriage certificate came from?) and moved to Belgium in 1830s/1840s.

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

[Valda]

Clara Jane Sweetlove's mother would appear to be called Jane born Berwick on Tweed - see 1861 census entry in Deptford. I think the Sweetlove family were possibly in Greenwich by 1841.
I'm not sure who William Sweetlove from West Ashford was or when he married Anna Payne can you give specific details?

Regards

Valda

[Valda]

A bit far back to make a connection to at least immediately?

Kent, Surrey, London: - Canterbury Marriage Licences, 1781-1809
Volume 32 
fol 123 1786 
County: Kent 
Wm Sweetlove of Ashford grazier bach & Ann Paine of the s sp. 20 Sep 1786. 

You would need the details from Clara Sweetlove and William Edmed's marriage for Clara's father's name.

Regards

Valda

[aghadowey]

I know the connection is back a bit but it does bring the surname Payne into the Sweetlove family. The point is that maybe Muriel's mother put together a story by taking bits from here and there. What I was suggesting is only a series of possibilites.

[Valda]

The Greenwich Sweetloves also use the first name of Simmonds. The oldest Simmonds Sweetlove I can find was born Wye Kent circa 1793.

Regards

Valda

[Valda]

This might be the most likely marriage for Clara's parents.

Marriages Jun 1847 
Sweetlove  Simmons John     Bermondsey  4 15 
either
MACE  Jane     Bermondsey  4 15   
or
Paxton  Emma     Bermondsey  4 15 
or
Rossiter  Leonora     Bermondsey  4 15   
or
Taylor  Mary Ann     Bermondsey  4 15

but Clara's marriage details would be necessary to confirm or eliminate this possibility.

Regards

Valda

[Carole B]

I'm so sorry - I'm finding all these new names very confusing.

In truth, as I explained in the two page 'story and known details'   post - I can go NO further back really than my mothers marriage certificate (1936) and her birth certificate (1913).

I am - at this stage anyway - NOT looking to go further back than perhaps the birth of my grandmother who was, as explained, known to me only as Nina Edmed. I would be so pleased to know the following about her:
When she was born.
Where she was born.
Who (if anyone) did she marry.
Where/when did she marry.
When did she die.
Where did she die.

At the moment anything beyond that  I wouldn't know what to do with.

Sorry. It's just that I NEVER expected such a huge and detailed response. If I'm honest - I really didn't expect to get anywhere at all with so little information. Just shows doesn't it!

I just don't know where to go from here.....

[Valda]

'Nina' did not die between 1940-1945 in England according to the GRO indexes with a death registration in the surname Edmed whatever her first name on her death registration was.
Have you checked whether a death took place in Kent between 1940-1945 for a Nina (or a Clara) Payne or Offley?

You can check the GRO indexes here

http://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/rectype/vital/freebmd/bmd.aspx

If you find a possible/s death, the age and name at death might give the necessary to proof to connect your 'Nina' (probably a petname) to the information which has been given you, or help eliminate Clara Ellen Jane Edmed as a possibility for 'Nina'. What you know already is there is no birth registration for a Nina Edmed in England and Wales, so if she was born in England she was born with a different first name to 'Nina' and at this point the hypothesis is it was Clara Ellen J.

Regards

Valda