1861 Census - FARRANT

[gingerslf]

Hi Kris....I wonder if you can confirm something for me  re James b 1846!

My James was married 8/7/1877 to Kezia(h) nee Watts b 1855....d 1886.

Have we definetely got the right man?

And how is this relevant as posted earlier?

In 1891 his birthplace is given as Stoke by Clare and here in 1851

FARRANT

Phebey - 26 - head of family - plaiter - looks like unmarried
Susan - 7 - plaiter
James - 5
John - 3
George - 10 months

all born Stoke by Clare

HO107/1787 - Stoke by Clare
Folio 587, Page 34

As Phoebe is given as head of family, is it her family..ie brothers and sisters and she is head because her parents have died?
Thanks.

Steve
Sorry for being a bit of a div and dragging this one out...

[krisesjoint]

Hi again Steve,

Phoebe is the head of the household an her husband was not about on Census night. Thomas and Phoebe were married in 1842 - Ref provided by Sue earlier) and in the 51 census I see Phoebe is Married (Though I understand Sue wondering about her status it does say Md - just not a lot of difference between the enumerators writing of Md or Un, I am quite certain it does say  Md). We then have 4 children listed as Phoebe's children - listed as Susan Dau 7, James son 5, George Son 3 and John Son 10 months. These are certainly Phoebe's children, not her siblings. Age of the eldest Susan fits perfectly with the marriage in 1842. You can purchase James birth certificate with the reference details I provided earlier which will prove this. You may purchase the certificate from

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/

I have been back looking about for Thomas and have located him. He has been a naughty boy and is in prison in Bury St Ed! So this explains Phoebe alone with the children working as a Plaiter and little 7 year old Susan at work also.   

HO107/1792 Folio 65 Page 58
County Prison
Bury St Edmunds St Mary

FARRANT Thomas Prisoner 28 Mar b Stoke by Clare ag Lab

I am convinced that this is your James but if you also purchase the 1877 marriage cert that will list his fathers name and occupation to be sure.

Kris 

[gingerslf]

Gotcha... ...bet you think I'm a real dip head...LOL...
So he was in prison when the census was taken.....
And Susan died before 1852 census...

Now...how do I find out about why he was in prison...

It seems it runs in the family cos I think this may be one of my mob as well...the George may well be Thomas father! He was a labourer!

"The Bury & Norwich Post
July 31st 1816

For breaking a threshing machine at Stoke by Clare, 12 months each to Thomas Meers, George Farrant senior, Mary Jackson, Richard Rogers. George Farrant junior and W. Farrant 6 months, George Frost, three months, C.Meers, T.Swallow, William Turner, John Deeks, Sarah Jackson, J.Angel were discharged.


LUDDITES

Thanks for all your help....
Steve

If I'm not allowed to post the above bit from Bury and Norwich Post then please feel free to remove.

[gingerslf]

Kris..re Elizabeth..Thomas's mother, husband of George...

You mentioned Elizabeth died/burial 22/2/1856 aged 74....so she would have been born c 1782....roughly the same age as her hubby, George b 1786....

BUT on 1841 census George b 1786 is aged 55, son Thomas is aged 20 and his mother Elizabeth just 35 years old!!!!!!!!!!!!..so this would make her born c 1806... and 20 years younger than hubby!

I hope that makes sense.

Are these different people?

Steve

[krisesjoint]

Ooh Steve,

A criminal past - exciting stuff. Sorry for the delay. I have a lot on  at the moment, and am not the right person to assist with that side of it. Good on you for finding the record you found. Well done. 

There is a bit of a George overload in Stoke by the looks of it. Besides the death of your George I also see there are two other burials of George's in the parish -  one on the  8 Jul 1835 aged 64 and the other on the 23 Jun 1847 aged 70. We don't know if all were born in Stoke at this stage. Rick provided you with a link to Suffolk Surnames List. They do have a volunteer offering Lookups for Stoke by Clare, hopefully you may be able to get some earlier information. 

Yes Susan was buried 17 May 1855 aged 11 Years. Re Elizabeth's age I can't say I am afraid. The 1841 census does clearly say aged 35. No relationships are provided in the 1841 census so impossible to tell if this is an enumerators error or if perhaps this is a daughter. If you can locate the marriage that may give a clue as to this. By George and Elizabeth's ages they do seem old enough to have older children we have not located. Without locating just when the marriage occurred we just can't say. A lot of errors occurred in these census entries so my gut feeling is that this age is an error, but just a feeling. All we can say is the entry clearly lists George as 55 Elizabeth as 35. 1851 entry agrees with the burial dates

HO107/1787 Folio 576 Page 12
45 Stoke

FARRANT George Head 71 b Stoke Labourer
FARRANT Elizabeth Wife 68 b (Hunion)?

I did try looking for the second George buried in 1847 in the 1841 census. I don't see another possible in Stoke by Clare. There is one in Haverhill George  55 wife Elizabeth 50 and children. I will have to leave you to it as my young charge has just arrisen so must away. I was going to go check the distance between Stoke by Clare and Haverhill. Both are in Risbridge Reg District. The actual microfiche may give some idea of an address for these burials. (All St John the Baptist - Stoke by Clare)

Sorry I can't be of any more assistance. All the best.......Kris 

[familytrees]

Joshua clark and Mary Ince were my grgrgrgrandparents.

Thanks James