1891 Census,Liverpool,Michael Harloe(Harlow)

[AMBLY]

Hah!!
Found her in 1881 - living with her son Edwin CHAMBERLAIN and his wife Eliza E CHAMBERLAIN in West Derby .....

Can you access this via LDS site? If not give a yell!
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/frameset_search.asp?PAGE=census/search_census.asp

Mum has been indexed as HARLVE!! And  looking at the actual, it does look like that but also could be (is?)  a messily written HARLOE where the top of the "o" has not been closed off - this enumerator has done that on a few "Do" (ditto) and "a"s also.

Cheers   
AMBLY

[kiwi]

Now how impressive is that! 
Thank you.

It explains the two Edwards in 1871, turns out one is an Edwin, much more sensible!
I think you must be right about the money , the Harloes weren't well off in the grand scheme of things but they don't appear to have been that poor either, their father John worked as a Customs Officer all his life from what I can see. I was a bit stunned when I found Michael in the workhouse in 1881, but the link you gave me explained things a bit better, especially when he seems to have died the next year.
I found Ann's death on the FreeBMD in 1902

All Ann's previous children too, an unexpected surprise, will look for her marriage on FreeBMD, maybe with the maiden name of Norman.

Now looks as though I will have to brave the Irish system to find John Harloe somewhere in Ireland born abt 1799.

I can't thank you enough Ambly, you have been terrific.
Regards,
kiwi

[AMBLY]

Hi Kiwi

I know ! the thought of having to tackle Irish rersearch  - I've few there too all from the same place  "Somewhere" !!    My dear Grandad was Liverpool Irish stock himself and fond of an Irish joke, he started them all off the same, and they all had a Murphy in them (if there wasn't a Murphy in the the original version, he popped one in)  one of them was about Murphy who owned a spaghetti farm 2 inches wide and 20 miles long.............

But I digress ...........I noticed the brother Charles HARLOE on the Census too for 1851 & 1861.  In one of them it states he was from Dublin.  Do you want these 2?

Cheers
AMBLY

[kiwi]

Good morning Ambly,

Yes please I would like the 1851 for Charles, I have him in 1861, married  with wife and child in Toxteth. 

Haven't been able to pin point Charles's death yet, sometime between 1861 and 1871/74.  He is on his son John's wedding cert in 1874 as a shipwright, however that may not mean he was still alive then, simply that John did not read the question as being asked if he was alive, merely asking for his occupation, if you get my drift.

I can't find Charles anywhere on the 1871 census.  Family history doesn't seem to think he returned to Ireland in his old age.  I think the freebmd hasn't got him transcribed as yet.

Dublin ? now that might be a starting point, only to find the name Harloe is like Smith I expect

Regards,
kiwi

[AMBLY]

Hi Kiwi

1851 - Toxteth Park ; Lancashire 
Eccl'l parish: St John the Baptist 
RD : West Derby   Sub-RD: Toxteth Park
Ref: Class: HO107; Piece: 2188; Folio: 281; Page: 31
1 Catherine Street
Head: Charles HARLOE 27 Carpenter b Ireland
Wife: Fanny HARLOE 27 b Ireland
Son: John HARLOE 1, b Liverpool Lanc

This Census makes Fanny more of an age with her husband - as opposed to the 1861 where she is clearly enumerated as age 57 ( born Belfast)  to his 36 (born Dublin)

In 1871, I'm sure this is Fanny, a widow living in Toxteth Park with John,  on the same road as they were  on in  1861, but in a different house.

1871 - Toxteth Park Lancashire 
Eccl'l parish: St John the Baptist
REF:  Class: RG10; Piece: 3800; Folio: 13; Page: 20
RD : West Derby   Sub-RD: Toxteth Park   
43 Essex Street
Head: Fanny HARLOW age 47, widow, Dressmaker b Belfast Ireland
Son: John HARLOW age 21, single, Moulder, b Liverpool Lanc

FREEBMD has a death 1892 that fits this younger Fanny.

Cheers
AMBLY

[kiwi]

Hi Ambly,

 You are quite right, a slip up with the enumerator regarding the ages, I think, mind you I sometimes feel an additional 20years older at times !
Thank you for all your help, it has been marvelous, I shall now enter data furiously and ponder the next step regarding Ireland 

Regards,
kiwi

[kiwi]

Ambly

P.S.

Forgot to add, you were right about Fanny's death date, family in Liverpool knew about her  (and her son John) from their parents and grandparents talk when they were small, I have a photo of her gravestone.

kiwi

[kiwi]

Thank you.
kiwi.

[Gunneroneday]

Hi Kiwi

I see that this correspondence is 12 months old & this is probably of no use to you.
I believe we have been in contact previously - probably about the same thing.

I don't know if I have sent you this info re Ann Chamberlin - Harlow -

Ann Georgiana Norman was born c 1821 Chichester, West Sussex - Daughter of William & Catherine Norman.
Married Denham Chamberlin 28/12/1841 - Saint Bartholomew - Chichester - Sussex - England.

Regards

Grahame