Baker family from Hastings

[VAL IN NEWPORT]

Trying to find out information about my family from Hastings. All I know is that my Paternal Great Great Grandfather Frederick Baker was born in 1835 in Hastings and married Mary? who was born in 1842. I know that in 1871 they were on the census for Wales and lived in Newport with their children Sarah, Ellen and John but have no record of them before that in England or Wales. I would be very grateful if anyone can find them for me in the census, birth or marriage records for the area.

Thanks in advance, Val

[VAL IN NEWPORT]

Sorry but I think I posted this in the wrong section. Sorry for the confusion. Val

[AMBLY]

Hi Val

What was Birthplace of Mary and the birthplace/years of the children?
Perhaps if you post the details of the 1871 which you already have  - and also from later Census if you also already  have those? Helps build up a picture of the quarry 

Cheers
AMBLY

[VAL IN NEWPORT]

Hi Ambly,

Details I have are that Mary was born in 1842 in Hastings, Sussex, the children were born in Newport, Monmouthshire and their names were Sarah,born 1867, Ellen or Mary Ellen born 1869, and John , born 1870. I 1871, 1881 and 1891  they lived in 23 Castle Street Newport, then in 1901 they lied in Dock Parade Newport. In 1881,4 more children appear. There names were Frederick, born 1872, George, born 1874, Michael Thomas (my Great Grandfather), born 1877, and Sarah Ann, born in 1879 all in Newport. 1891 Elizabeth was born and in 1901 Gertrude was born.

Hope this helps, Val

[AMBLY]

Hi Val

1891 Elizabeth was born and in 1901 Gertrude was born

Oops  I think? The 1901 Census shows Elizabeth born 1886 and Gertrude 1891 - I was getting worried since surely Mary wouldn't have a child in 1901 when she was around 58 yrs old! She was pushing it in 1891 as it was!

In  the FULL details of the Census 1871 & 1881  there are clues which I think you may have missed, or not seen or at least not stated above -  In those 2 Census, there are other people living at 23 Castle Street: besides the BAKER family:-

1871:  St Woollos, Newport, Monm.
23 Castle Street
Lodger: Frederick BAKER, 37, Labourer, b Hastings, Sussex
Wife: Mary BAKER, 27, b Hastings Sussex
Dau:: Sarah BAKER, 4, Scholar, b Newport, Mon
Dau: Ellen BAKER, 2 , b Newport Mon
Son: John, 1, b Newport 1
Head: Robert CAREY, 50, Labourer, b Ireland
Wife Bridget CAREY, 49, b Ireland
Son: Robert CAREY, 16, Labourer, b Ireland
Dau: Elizabeth CAREY, 14. Laundress, b Ireland


1881: St Woollos, Newport, Monm.
23 Castle Street
Head: Bridget CAREY 60, widow , b Ireland
Son: Robert CAREY, unm, 25, Coal Shipper (Dock), b Newport Monm.
Head: Frederick BAKER, 46, marr. Coal Shipper, Dock , b Sussex Hastings
Wife: Mary BAKER, 35, b Newport Mon.
Dau: Mary E BAKER 13, Scholar, b Newport Mon.
Son: John BAKER11, Scholar, b Newport Mon.
Son: Frederick BAKER 9, Scholar, b Newport Mon.
Son: George BAKER, 7, Scholar, b Newport Mon.
Son: Thomas BAKER, 4, b Newport Mon.
Dau: Sarah A BAKER, 2, b Newport Mon.
Servant: Bridget FRAZER, 29, Washerwoman, b Ireland.

In 1891
It's just Fred , Mary & the children at 23 Castle Street.
Children listed (boys first!) Fred 18, George 16, Michael 14, Mary E 22, Sarah Ann 12, Elizabeth 5.  Mary is again enumerated as being borth Newport Monmouthshire, and Fred is a Dock Labourer.

In 1901,
at 10 Dock Parade there are three families enumerated there:
1) Head: Charles BROWN his wife Sarah A, 22 and son Chas M, 2months (Charles born Stockholm Sweden but a British Subject)
2) Head: Fred & Mary BAKER with daughters Elizabeth & Gertrude (Fred is enumerated as born 1831 here but in Hastings, and Mary - again as Newport.)
2) Head: Reginald GRIFFITH 23 with Wife Sarah 21.

Either one of the 2 Sarah's could be Fred & Mary's daughter - picking Mrs BROWN becasue of the middle initial - and because on FREEBMD:-
Marriages Jun 1900 Newport Monmouthshire, Ref 11a 439   
A Charles BROWN was married - and one of his possible brides was:
Sarah Ann BAKER
 
Mary's age :- you have stated abt 1842 - but from Census I am going to say it's more likely 1843/1844. And - on all Census 1881 to 1901   she is listed as born Newport Monmouthshire -not Hastings, Sussex.
The 1871 is the only one which says Hastings, Sussex and is probably an error.

I think she is the daughter of Robert CAREY & Bridget - or if not, at least closely related.

A Search of FREEBMD (which is incomplete, I know) for a marriage 1860-1868 Sussex reports none, but in Monmouthshire there is but one:
Newport, Monmouthshire - Marriages Dec Quarter  1863
Ref: , Volume: 11a, Page: 315
Grooms:
Baker  Frederick   
Vaughan  Thomas     
Brides:Carey  Mary   
-----? ---------?

There is a bride missed off the page - but given that your Fred & Mary  were lodging with the CAREY family in 1871 - I think this one is very worth following up - ie: I think your Mary was the rather lovely named Mary CAREY!

Will now look for 1861 CAREY's

Cheers
AMBLY

[AMBLY]

Hi Val

1861 - St Woollos, Newport, Monmouthshire
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul , ED 18
Ref: : RG9/4020 , Folio 65, Page 30
18 New Dock - Tavern Bur(tt?)e
Head: Robert CAREY, 40, Labourer, B Ireland
Wife: Bridget CAREY, 40, b Ireland
Son: John CAREY, 18, unm, Labourer, b Ireland
Son: Michael CAREY, 16, Labourer, b Ireland
Dau: Eliza CAREY, 13, b Ireland
Son: Robert CAREY. 6, b Newport, Mon.

No daughter named Mary born around 1842/43/44 there!

There is a Mary A CARNEY right age, place of birth with her mother, and she is also so named in 1851 with her parents.

In 1851 There is a Mary Carthy b 1841 Ireland, and a lot of other possibles if one considers how CAREY could be mis-heard or mis-transcribed.

In 1851 - Cannot locate anywhere Wales -  a Robert & Bridget CAREY born 1821 Ireland. But in St Woollos is 1 CAREY family, plus 2 CAREY  individuals, which I'll list... in case:

1) Julia CAREY, wido, 50, Fishmonger, b Ireland
She is  lodging (as are others ) with a family of Edward BRICKLEY at Castle Street (no number). Other Lodgers are named BACH (1) & SULLIVAN (family)

2) Martin CAREY age 22, b Dongle, Kerry Ireland, Private 77th Reg in Newport Military Barracks

3) Family: Address; Canal P-----?
Head: Thomas CAREY 32, Labourer, b Ireland
Wife: Johanna CAREY, 34, Hawker; ?Washer? Woman, b Ireland
Stepson: William HARDAWAY 15, Errand Boy, b Newport Mon
Son Thomas CAREY, 11, Scholar, b Newport Mon
Son: Michael CAREY, 9, At Home, b Newport Mon
Son: John CAREY, 5, b Newport Mon
Son: James CAREY,1 b Newport Mon

On FREEBMD is a birth in Newport M right time for a Michael Thomas BAKER, probably your Gt Grandad.

His birth Cert will give mother's maiden name. If it turns out to be CAREY, then the the marriage listed earlier for Frederick BAKER to possible Mary CAREY would name her father - and an address & witness'  which may be useful in finding Mary in 1861, 1851.
And again, if ou do have the right marriage, it should have Fred's father's name to help pin him down pre 1871.

Cheers
AMBLY

[VAL IN NEWPORT]

Hi Ambly, thank you so much for the information you sent me about Frederick Baker and his family. I was so pleased when I got your reply. I have already sent for Michael Thomas Bakers birth certificate but it won't be dispatched until the 14th July at the earliest. Hopefully it will contan all the information I need to further my search. Thank you once again and hope to hear from you again sometime. Bye for now, Val

[VAL IN NEWPORT]

Hi Ambly, just received birth certificate for Michael Thomas Baker and on it was his mother and fathers names. His mother Mary's maiden name was Carey so the information you gave me was relevant and will enable me to find more info on the Carey family prior to 1861. Thanks for your help. Will need to get Frederick and Mary's marriage certificate now to find out Fredericks parents names. Look forward to hearing from you again sometime, bye for now, Val