Penfold in Plaxtol, Kent

[coopers pup]

To FIFI
it is still S.Saviours Church I was christened there by the Rev Field it used to have a school next door now demolished the head was a skilled artist
quote author=FIFI link=topic=159598.msg754923#msg754923 date=1149715554]
Hi
Not sure if this will help or if you have this info

marriage of Robert Penfold & Mary Ann Saunders

10th May 1881 at Holy Saviours Church Croydon know then as St.Saviours
Roberts  was 21 his farther John Penfold was decd living at 4 Holly Cottages, Pawsons Road.
Mary Ann Saunders age 18 farther William Saunders Hawker also at Holly Cottages Wittiness Noah & Janet Warne also it was bans not license.
(Janet would be trainet)

I have other Penfold marriage details i.e Rose Roberts daughter  and a couple of others if you would like then let me know.

[chellin2]

Hi Coopers

Noah Warne was my great great uncle, his sister Mary Ann was my great great grandmother.

His Wife Janet was sometimes Arienet, Trancett and Trainett.

I have a few Penfolds in my tree and I found a site with a lot of them in giving their baptisms, marriages and deaths.

Its http://Romany.rootschat.net/

Hope this helps.

Does anyone know if the name Warne is Romany or would it be Warren/Warn/Warne as I am getting different spellings.

Chellin2

[vimira]

Hi everyone

Mention of the Coopers & the Croyden area makes me ask if anyone knows of the Mills family who married a number of Cooper girls.

I am trying to trace my 3 x gt grandfather Robert Mills who married Susannah Harwood/Haywood/Orwood/Allwood. He was the son of Thomas Mills, potter, & he & Susannah m in Newark, Notts in 1838. sadly, Susannah & their son both died in 1842 in Newark, leaving daughter Sarah b 1839 Newark, my 2 x gt grandmother the only survivor it seems of the family. No trace of them in the 1841 census or of Robert afterwards. I have so little to go on that I have been trying to go backwards in time from the census.

Aaron Mills hawker  b c 1849 m Flora Cooper d/o Robert & Sylvia Cooper; William Mills m Sophia Cooper, & Moses Mills m Margaret Cooper, & in 1871 & later censuses they are in the Croydon area.

Does anyone know anything of this Mills family thru their research on the Coopers. I am having such great diffs with finding Robert & his family, that I would be intersted in any connections which might help.

Vimira

[Lemmey]

Hi

Not sure if you already have this information.

1881 census - Half Acre Row, Mitchum Surrey

PRO Ref RGll Piece 827 Folio 66? Page 8

Aaron MILLS  1831 Hawker     
Mary A MILLS 1833 wife
George MILLS1861 son
William MILLS 1863 s
Aaron MILLS 1870 s
Susan MILLS 1873 daughter

Eli MILLS 1854 Hawker
Jane MILLS 1853 wife
Jane MILLS 1874 d
Eli MILLS 1877 s
John A MILLS 1879 s
Aaron MILLS s

PRO Ref RGll Piece 827 Folio 67 Page 11

Joseph MILLS 1818 Widow
Eliza MILLS 1857 Daughter
Susan MILLS 1858 D
Louisa MILLS 1861  D              All of the above Hawkers
Divino MILLS 1867 Son
Henry MILLS 1871 S


(copied from my 1881 spreadsheet compiling other Romanies living where I've found my Gardners/Penfolds etc)

[vimira]

Yes thanks - I did have them. I think Joseph m twice; first to Rose ?, secondly to Naomi Franklin. Can't seem to get further back with Joseph, can't find marr certifs - he may have been baptised 1822 Iden Sussex, which seems to fit; and his parents Thomas Mills & Henrietta would fit ok with my Robert whose father is Thomas on his marriage cert.

I think I have to check the orig parish record to see if they were travellers. There are very few entries in IGI for Robert - I'm beginning to think he may have changed his first name, or used Mills as his mother's maiden name. I have seen in some records that they also used Smith.

Does anyone have any early records of the Mills families, I wonder. Robert would have been born c1815 - 1820. He & Susannah's daughter Sarah m my 3 x gt grandfather Francis Elliott who were well estab Gypsies. 2 of Susannah's
siblings also went on to marry Newberrys.

Thanks for your help
Vimira

[chellin2]

Hi Vimira

The Smiths that are in the Half Acre Row are my family, did any of your Mills marry any of them.

Phoebe Smith was was grandmother.

Chellin2

[vimira]

Hi

I don't know, but I was trying to follow up an Ambrose Mills b 1862 in the 1881 census in Woodford essex, with a brother Galouse Mills, cousin? John Mills, aunt Fambridge Smith, & grandparents Moses & Fanny Smith (RG11/1733 fol 99 p44. Moses & Fanny are with a William Mills & family in Chipping Barnet in 1861 census RG9/788 fol 96 p69. And in 1891 RG12/1362 fol 76 p29 a Golie Smith (same age as Galouse Mills) appears as Moses & Fanny's son.

A birth cert I rec for the right name & age of Ambrose in Hitchin has his parents as John Mills & Selina Draper. So either Fanny was a Mills, or Moses was a Mills, or Selina Draper is d/o Fanny nee Draper?

Vimira

[chellin2]

Hi Vimira

I will look into this and if I find any of the Smiths married into your family I will let you know.  I would appreciate it if you would do the same - thanks

Good Luck

Chellin2

[vimira]

Hi

In 18901 Phoebe Cooper is with husband David & family, & her father Moses Mills. FG12/1475 fol 14 p22. I presume they are not in your family - I don't see them om your site. But again another marriage bet Mills & Coopers.

When was your Phoebe Smith born?  Are you certain she was'nt a Mills?

Thanks for looking out for Mills/Smiths connections for me. I will let you know if I turn anything up

Vimira