Need suggestions for breaking my brick wall!

[Kate Riley]

I am trying to figure out where my William Sharp b.1792-1796 is from.  He's married in Irvine, Ayrshire in 1820 to Janet Banks.  They have several children in Irvine baptised in the Burgher Church (so not in the PRs).  He marries again in 1829 in Irvine to Catherine Glen.  They have 3 more children born Irvine, Kilmarnock and Kilmaurs (these do show up in the PRs). 

In the 1841 they are in Galston, Ayrshire.  In the 1841 census he says he is born out of county.  So how do I figure out where he's from?  I think he's dead by 1851- at least I can't find him in Ayrshire or in Lanarkshire (where his son Joseph is in 1851).  In the 1841 census he's listed as a collier.  When son Joseph get married he says that his father was a grocer. 

His children's names aren't much help.  They are: John Lermouth, Jean, Charles, Susan, Margaret, William Glen,  Joseph and James.


Any hints on how to find his birth place or even birth county? 

Thanks!

[DeniseA]

Hi Kate,
Have you checked the actual marriage document/microfilm between William and Janet?  Depending on where you found the date/place of marriage, the original documentation sometimes has more information. I found an ancestor of mine married in Kent, 1763 at IGI with just the date and place of marriage but the microfilm has him down as 'Of Istead, Essex'
~Denise

[Kate Riley]

Thanks for the suggestion.  Unfortunately, we do have copies of the original marriage records and they just indicate that William was "of Irvine" at the time of him marriages.

[sillgen]

If he is Scottish he may have followed a strict naming pattern for the children.  Can you prove that from the wife's parents?
Eldest son after  paternal gfather
second son afer maternal gfather
third son after father
eldest daughter after maternal gmother
second dau after paternal gmother
third dau after mother
May help a bit.
Andrea

[DeniseA]

If his marriage records says 'Of Irvine' I would tend to think that means he was born in Irvine
~Denise

oops, just re-read the first post, out of county in 1841 would rule that out 

[sillgen]

It may only mean he was living in Irvine at that time.   I married miles away from the town of my birth but I had been living there for several years so I qualified by residence.   He could be from anywhere!
Andrea

[throckenholt]

where does the name Lermouth come from ?  Maybe that could be a clue - possibly a mothers maiden name (hopefully from his side and not his wife's)

Julie

[Kate Riley]

We don't know where Lermouth came from.  It's a pretty rare name as far as I can tell but I have yet to find any Sharp/Lermouth marriages.

[Kate Riley]

The birth order for William's children is: John Lermouth, Charles, Jean, Susan, Margaret, William Glen, Joseph and James. 

Charles and Jean works as Janet Bank's parents so if the naming pattern held true William's parents would be John Sharp and Susan______.  Unfortunately,  I don't find any John Sharp's marrying Susan's in the IGI or do are any of the Williams born 1792-1796 on Scotlandspeople have parents John and Susan.   I haven't found any John Sharps marrying Lermouths either.
 Also if they were sticking to the naming pattern their third daughter should have been Janet instead of Margaret.