Graham

[CaroleW]

Message for continuity purposes only

In a PM to me, Julie wrote:

I found the birth 1837.com on the original certificate it says that Walter was born 1880 but registered 1883 ,so I thought that sounded wrong and checked the 1837 and he was registered 4th quarter  1883


My reply in a PM as follows:

I have to confess that I am puzzled - the only Walter Graham registed in the december (4th) quarter of 1883 was Walter only - not Walter Jack - and he was in Holborn which is London.  That is from the full GRO index on both 1837 and Ancestry

"on the original certificate"  what original certificate do you mean.

[Julie5]

The original birth certificate

Julie

[CaroleW]

Hi

Now I really am puzzled.  Are you saying you already have a birth certificate for him showing that he was born in 1880 but registered in 1883 but no parents shown on it? 

If so - where does the 4th August 1883 birth date come from?

Do you know who he married as it may be better to get a copy of his marriage certificate which will at least show his fathers name and occupation and also his age on marriage

Are you absolutely sure that the 1901 entry for Walter is the right one  as that Walter was 19 years old which is consistent with an earlier birth year than 1883

[heywood]

Julie,
Carole- got me thinking. I have checked and the Walter from Padiham is still in Padiham in 1901- so is not yours.
There is a Walter Graham b 1881 in Birkenhead in Bury.
Is it the Seaforth one you are interested in. If so I would follow Carole's advice and go for a marriage certificate.
Best wishes
If there is any other information I will gladly look and be a bit more eagle eyed perhaps!
Heywood

[Julie5]

Hi

I have Recieved a new Birth certificate for Walter Graham He was Born 4th August 1883 Manchester Father James,Mother Ann
James was a Shoemaker and the address is Brierley Street,London Road

Any help Please
Thanks
Julie

[CaroleW]

Hi Julie

1891 census - It looks like he was the Walter Graham aged 8 b Manchester who was a pupil at the Swinton Industrial school

I will have a look for his parents on the 1891

[heywood]

Hi Julie,
glad you have a bit more information. I thought that if he was in an industrial school he was orphaned- or at least one parent had died. I have had a quick look on free bmd (ancestry) to no avail. I have had a quick look but cannot find anything to match 1881. Hope Carole is more successful.
Apologies if you have already answered this - is it the older Walter you are following - this one might not be him.
best wishes
heywood

[CaroleW]

This is the only possibility for his parents on the 1881 census but they are not on the 1891 (? deceased).  I found a John Graham aged 13 b Manchester in Salford Workhouse and the entry below was William Graham aged 9 b Manchester.  The entries are not in alphabetical order so William may have been John's brother.  Given Ann's age, she cannot be the mother of the 2 elder children so James must have been married before

A cordwainer was an old term for a shoemaker

22 Shepley St  Manchester
   
James GRAHAM       33        Ireland
       Head
       Cordwainer & Lodging
Ann GRAHAM       23        London
       Wife
   
James GRAHAM       13        Manchester
       Son
       Cordwainers Assistt
Mary J. GRAHAM       9        Manchester
       Daur
       Scholar
Ann Elizth. GRAHAM       4    Manchester
       Daur
John GRAHAM       3        Manchester
       Son
Thomas GRAHAM       2        Manchester
       Son
Margaret GRAHAM       1        Manchester
       Daur
Mary PIDCOCK       29        Buxton  Derby
       Serv
       
Martha TAYLOR       23        London
       Lodger
   
Ellen MELBOURNE       19        Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England
       Lodger
   

[heywood]

Hi you two- there is a John Graham in Swinton Industrial achool- aged 11 yrs so age is not quite the same as 1881 but could be older brother. The entry is a few above Walter.
best wishes
Heywood