Thanks Arranroots/Tanja
One of these days I will get a breakthrough on this, looks like I can elimate that Sam Smith, again worth a try though, so I guess my mans father probably died before 1851. The John Smith in the workhouse could be interesting as he is the right age and that could explain why he went off to Northampton. Thanks again, I'm sure I'll solve all this one day, in the meantime we probably arent that far off the longest thread on this board!
Regards
Anthony