1851/61/71 - Smith - Towcester

[seahall]

Hi again

From the 1851 Census Samuels' wife seems to be Sarah.

H.O.107/1736/1 Cold Higham Pg 16? F. (can not read)

Samuel Smith Head Mar 26 Ag Lab Cold Higham
Sarah Wife Mar 25 Pattishall
Mary Ann Daur 2 Cold Higham
John Son 4mo Cold Higham

Cheers Sandy

[seahall]

Hi again Anthony

From the same marriages indexes. Lucys' 1st marriage.

Maidford BT's 25-Jan 1852
John DAVIS of Grimscote in the parish of Cold Higham, bachelor, of full age, labourer, father George, labourer to   
Lucy MOORE otp, spinster, of full age, servant, father James, labourer

Cheers Sandy   

[wamwig]

Thanks Sandy

That looks like a blind alley and is obviously not the Samuel (or John) Smith I am after, still it was worth a try. At least its one eliminated.

Regards

Anthony

[seahall]

Never mind Anthony

They are out there somewhere.

Cheers Sandy

[wamwig]

Hi all

Been trying to find Samuel John West Smith's first marriage sometime between 1857 and 1877 but not really had any luck so I have emailed Alan Clark for a look up of his Northants marriage database, unless anyone has any other ideas?

Regards

Anthony

[wamwig]

Hi Rootschatters

Well in the immortal words of Donald Rumsfeld “There are some things we know and there are some things we don’t know……..”  So before we lose track and this becomes the longest thread on here, this is how I see where we are.

I started this thread to find out more about my Gt Gt Grandfather, who had been identified on the 1891 census as John Smith (aged about 40 and b in Towcester) living with his wife Kate and family in Hertford. He was later identified on the 1901 census as Samuel John West Smith, and this name was given as the father on my Grans birth certificate.

It appears he may have been ‘married’ three times

Firstly to an unknown probably either in Towcester or Northampton, it is believed she died.

He then married Emma Halford (Tooms), both aged 36, in Northampton in 1877.  The marriage cert says both were widowed.  The 1881 census shows them living in Northampton with five children, 3 of whom are 4,3 and 1, the other two Charlotte and Charles Smith being 15 and 13 and probably from one of their previous relationships.  Sometime between 1881 and 1883 he appears to have left Emma and

Possibly married Kate Marriott after before moving to Braintree and then Hertford, where they had several more children, including my gran in 1904.

He died in Hertford in 1905, aged 55 it says although the one photo I have seen appears to indicate a much older man, probably in his 70’s, so the original age on the Emma Halford cert seems more reasonable and he probably lowered his age to more closely match that of Kate.

So still to be found is any reference to Samuel John West Smith on pre 1861 census (in 1861 he was an apprentice shoemaker in Northampton),  his first marriage and a marriage to Kate Marriott.  In regard to his first marriage I have made a request to Alan Clark and I have also looked for the children and there were no Charlotte Halford, Holford or Tooms born in Northampton 1865-1867, but there was a Charlotte Smith (Mar qtr 1867 vol 3b 80) so I will probably order this as well, or perhaps someone could find Charlotte and Charles Smith aged about 5 and 3 on the 1871 census?.  The marriage to Emma gives his father as Samuel West Smith if that helps anybody.

Regards

Anthony

[wamwig]

Hi all

Have now received the other marriage cert to Kate Clarke and the bad news is it is not my John or Samuel Smith. I did find a birth record for a Kate Marriott in Northampton in 1865, which would tie up with the age in the 1891 census, although having spent the last hour or so looking on Ancestry.co.uk I cannot find any record of a marriage. There are several Kate Marriots married in the time period although none seem to be in Northampton (or even Braintree) the nearest being Market Bosworth in the Dec qtr 1882. The possiblity may be that Samuel Smith and Kate Marriot never got married. As an aside on my grans birth cert she gives her mothers name as Kate Marriott and then it is crossed out.  I have modified the post above to reflect this.

Anybody got any ideas?

Regards

Anthony

[Tati]

Hi Anthony,

Err... I mentioned this 1871 census somewhere but I can't see it posted:
1871
Northampton St Giles
RG10/148182 43
25 Brunswick Street
John Smith, head, 30, Shoe riveter, b. Towcester
Emma, wife, 30, b. Northampton All Saints
Charlotte A, dau, 5, scholar, b. St Giles
John C, son, 2, b. St Giles

Wonder if John C is John Charles 

Tanja 

[wamwig]

Tanja

Thanks for that, I definately have a marriage cert for Samuel John West Smith and Emma Halford dated 1877, perhaps his first wife was also called Emma, which would be possible? Crikey this isnt easy is it.  Does it give an age for this Emma here?

Regards

Anthony