Cranbrook Census 1861 John Relf

[Heidi]

My great grandfather John Relf, father James Relf
born 1852 Cranbrook (stated on 1881/1891 census)
On 1901 Census stated born Staplehurst
John Relf wasn't registered at his birth so it hasn't be possible to get his birth certificate. All the information I have is from various census as quoted above and his marriage certificate where it states that his father was James Relf.

Perhaps a look-up on the 1861 census Cranbrook might shed light on his family. He would then have been 9 years old approximately.
On the 1871 census it seems he was living in Fulham with a German family.

Would be glad of any help

[pmmc_au]

Hello,
What is the name of the German family and their address? Maybe his family lived nearby or he was even living with them in 1861. Does it state what his father's occupation was too please, I can have a look for him on the 51 and 41 census as well.
Regards,
Paula.

[Heidi]

First of all thanks very much for your kind offer of help.

It seems that the roots of John Relf do lay in Cranbrook. He eventually grounded his family in the East End of London where my grandfather grew up. My grandfather married a girl from Sissinghurst (near Cranbrook - my grandmother). It seems he was on holiday when he met her, staying with relations, but it's now too late to find out which relations.



23 Pomona Place, Fulham
Heinrich Lekinkeel, age 36, born D - Schlieselburch, Lodger, Gas Factory Stoker
Marie Lekinkeel, age 29, born D - Ottenburg, Wife
John Relf, age 20, born Cranbrook, Kent, Bricklayers Labourer
Liese Schulze, age 28, born D - Weilburch
Ernest Schulze, age 34, born D - AnhaltEnthen, Bricklayer

The full name of John Relf is actually John George Relf, but George has never been mentioned on any of the census returns.

I have no other information concerning the origins of John Relf or his parentage. Only from 1881 things start becoming clearer when he got married and grounded his family.

Once again, many thanks
Heidi

[pmmc_au]

Hi,
I had a look at 23 Pomona Place in the 1861 census, and the people you mention weren't living there at that time.  I checked the whole enumeration district for Lekinkeel, Schulze and Relf, thinking that they might have moved up the street, and couldnt find them either. Sorry.
If I can help you with anything else, just ask.
Regards,
Paula.

[janie]

I've looked where I can but I can't find anything.
Janie from Hornchurch

[rivendale0506]

Hi

I was very interested to read your post as I too have a RELF (well a surname variant actually) RELFFE who doesn't appear to have been registered at birth.  According to his marriage certificate on July 2 1910 he was born in 1880. He gave his name as Henry RELFFE-ARNOLD and married Diana ARNOLD. He gave his father's name as Thomas, who it is possible was related to Diana's Father, James.

Family rumour has it that Diana and Henry were cousins, but we have no idea who his mother was.  We think his father died in 1883 and in the 1891 census he was listed as Henry ARNOLD living with his grandparents in Worth, Sussex. 

The appearance of the RELFFE bit of the surname was the first instance of this name in the family as far as we know.  We have surmised that his mother may have been a RELFFE, but can find no trace of her on the 1881 census with him or with Thomas.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[rivendale0506]

Hi Heidi

Don;t know if you have this info now as your post was some time ago, but have found a James RELF in Cranbrook on the 1871 census as below:

James Relf aged 54 b. Tenterden, Ag Lab
Martha Relf aged 53 b Hawkhurst, Laundress
Annie aged 9 - Granddaughter, b Cranbrook,  Scholar
Georgianna NIPER - 16, b. Hawkhurst - Servant

All listed as living at "Tanyard, Cranbrook"

Also listed as living at "Tanyard" but under a different schedule number are a family that are probably Georgianna's relatives:
Her father (Thomas) and 6 brothers
all living with her married sister Elizabeth, who is listed as Elizabeth Austen aged 25, married to Charles AUSTEN aged 21.

Hope this may help with your search

Nikki

[Heidi]

Thanks very much for your efforts . The connection with Martha and James does seem quite likely, but the problem is really that John "George" Relf just wasn't registered at birth and it's difficult to find a definite origin. I was wondering if someone would have the 1861 Cranbrook Census as he must have been living somewhere at the time.

[carol_cholsey]

Hello Heidi,
This is the 1851 entry for James and Martha,
ref HO107 1619 folio 107: Sissinghurst Castle, Cranbrook
James Relf head mar age 34 ag lab born Tenterden
Martha do wife mar age 34 born Hawkhurst
Jane do dau age 9 born Cranbrook
Martha Ann do dau age 8 born do
Henry do son age 6 born do
Esther do dau age 4 born do

and on the 1861 census:
ref RG9 507 folio 16: The Hill, Cranbrook
James Relf head mar age 43 born Tenterden
Martha do wife mar age 44 laundress born Hawkhurst
Martha Ann do dau age 18 born Cranbrook
Henry do son age 16 born do
Esther do dau age 14 born do
so no sign of a 9 year old John with this family

here is another entry from the 1861 census: (a different family)
ref RG9 507 folio 11 : Maidstone Road, Cranbrook
James Rofe head mar age 58 ag lab born Cranbrook
Martha do wife mar age 47 born do
Victor Drury son-in-law age 15 shoemakers app born do
John do do age 12 ag lab born do
Richard do do age 10 scholar born do
George Rofe son age 14 house servant born do
James do son age 2 born do
The age given for John is a bit out, but it could be a possibility.
There are a large number of entries for Relf/Rofe in Cranbrook, I'm sorry that I can't find a more suitable candidate for your John.
xx Carol.