Celia's Rake Lane + burial.look up

[celia]

Hi Chris
I went to the library  today to see if i find the whereabouts of Frederick through the directories so i could help locate his death.He might have been in Wirral in Person but he is another invisable in print I also checked the newspaper orbit colume index again no finds
Firstly though I had a look in The M.I's for Rake lane there is only one Woodburn mentioned that is George woodburn who died  12th July 1955 and his wife Edith Ann woodburn died 7th October 1974.Thats not to say they are not in the cem though.I also looked in St Hilary 1917-1946 non at all there. I get the feeling something is not right like there is a inportant piece of information missing somewhere.If Frederick was in wirral in 1918 and was the one that paid the rent he should be in the directories.If he wasnt and i knew his occupation i could have looked under that,but i dont. I have looked at your cousins tree,do you know what that bit that says Husband addopted means.Also do you know if Frederick was born before the parent married.
Here is what i found in the directories

1897 a stockbroker lived in 14 Rappart Road
Gores 1900. Alfred Woodburn Res Secretary Imperial Life insurance 9 Grafton Road/Field road N/Brighton
Mary Woodburn. Chandler 54 Market Street Hoylake
William Woodburn 1, Burnasby Street Egremont
1902. Mrs Mary Woodburn Chandler of Market Street.

1912   Gores Directory Frederick Woodburn Asst Grocer 14 Rappart Road Seacome
Nothing found in 1917/18 Directory
1914 Gores George Woodburn Madders. 8 Southbank Oxton
Mrs Woodburn Fletcher Wimslow Park Wimslow Manchester

Not sure if this was in the same directory or not as I have a small line between.
The library doesn’t have the full set of directories for the 1900’s and I couldn’t find the  1920/21
I didnt take the ones in Liverpool.
Celia

[celia]

Just seen Frederick was a chandler by 1901 so will follow that up next week.

[chrisaw]

Wow!  

Thank you for all this hard work you're putting in.  I can shed some light on Frederick's "adoption".  Frederick has his mother's maiden name, but his first appearance in 1861 is after his mother's marriage to Benson Atkinson.  My cousin has a copy of Frederick's birth certificate and apparently Benson was Frederick's father.

The Woodburns at 14 Rappart Road are the one's we're interested in.  I wonder whether the Frederick Woodburn listed in Gores might be Frederick Winstanley Woodburn (Frederick Jr, aged 20), given that by 1912 Frederick senior would have been nearly 60 years old.  Possibly Frederick Winstanley Woodburn was keeping his parents?  By the time Frederick jr died in Belgium in 1918, his father would have been 62.  If his son had been paying the rent, then possibly Frederick and Mary might have had to find somewhere else to live fairly soon afterwards.  I do hope they haven't disappeared on us.
I've emailed my cousin again today to see if he can provide any further information, and I'll let you know whether he comes back with anything new.

All the best
Chris

[celia]

Morning Chris
The reason i asked about Husband addopted-is as is known,if a couple are not married .The child has to take the name of the mother,even if they live together.If the couple get married later.I would think that the child would be known under his rightfull name, his Fathers .(You will have to start a another topic and ask about this)the other thing you need to ask is,is it possible for a father to addopt his own son? The reason i ask is because after going on your cousins webpage and finding that his fathers name was Atkinson. I did a some calculations and found a Frederick Atkinson died age 74 April 1/4 of 1931 Reg McField 8a 168.
I disregarded this at first,but now i am beginning to wonder ,because there are no deaths registered  in wirral for any Woodburns over many years of searching.I am not sure if on a death, the registrar checks the birth. Has your cousin got the marriage cert of any of the children.That will give if Frederick was deceased or not,i know we are going round in circles here but at the moment i am doing a blind search not knowing when he died or why he isn't showing up in the directories,and why there are no Woodburn deaths registered in wirral.Mind you the girls names would have changed on Marriage.

Celia

[chrisaw]

Hello Celia,

It's an interesting thought about whether Frederick would have been a Woodburn or an Atkinson.  What I do know is that he appeared in every census from 1861 onwards as a Woodburn and was named in the CWGM details for Frederick Winstanley Woodburn as Woodburn.  All of his male descendents have been Woodburns as well.  So, looking for Atkinsons is probably a non-starter. 

I've heard back from South Africa today.  My cousin says that he's hit a brick wall when it comes to finding the date of death for Frederick and Mary.  He says that the only thing he's been able to find is that it was post WW1 and that this is from the CWGM entry for Frederick Winstanley Woodburn which has under additional details

'Son of Frederick and Mary Woodburn, of 14, Rappart Road, Seacombe, Wallasey, Cheshire'

But looking at this again, I wonder whether it could equally be read as two separate facts - ie.  He was the son of Frederick and Mary, and he (but not necessarily his parents) lived at 14 Rappart Road.  In which case, everything concerning Frederick and Mary post 1901 - address, date of death, place of death becomes an unknown.  They may even have been dead before 1918.  Oh dear... I think I might have to do some more digging around, but at the moment it's looking like they might have dropped off the radar.  It's a pain the the death records for Cheshire aren't online beyond 1900.  I'm going to see whether I can get anywhere finding out whether either of them were witnesses at their children's weddings post 1901.  In the meantime, you're probably best to hold fire on any searches for me, and I'll come back to you with any useful information that may kick-start the look up again.  Thanks for your hard work so far.

Best wishes
Chris

[celia]

Hello Chris
How are getting on with your Woodburn reseach,

Celia

[chrisaw]

Hi Celia,

I've just heard from my mum today.  She spent some time in Earlston Road library looking through their records with no success, then someone suggested she contact Landican Cemetery.  They've come back to her today with a Fred Woodburn who was married to a Mary and who died in 1929.  So it looks like at long last we've found them.  They are buried in Rake Lane Cemetery (she's been given the plot number etc) and one reason for the difficulties in finding them is that they turn out to have been non-Conformists rather than Church of England.

I've also heard from my South African cousin who emailed to say that he was going to be setting out for his visit to this country in the next few days, so the information from Landican couldn't have been better timed.  Hopefully he should be able to see the headstone of Frederick and Mary (assuming that it wasn't one of the ones that was vandalised last year).

Thanks for all your efforts with the look-up, especially given the relatively small amount of information you had to go on.   

Chris

[celia]

Thats great news Chris i am so pleased
Just in time as well,Landican I think holds all the original records, they used to be all in the books.So probably still are
with a book for each religion.So much quicker to look up,it's amazingly good luck on your mums part as well. Getting that information from landican because i don't think they do that often.The reason for wanting to find the grave,might have helped though Have a happy reunion and all the best.

Celia

[celia]

Chris
I just checked the Mary Woodburn died in 1929 she was 72 and was registered In Manchester in the January 1/4. There is also in January  a registration in B/Head for a Frederick Woodburn age 72.

Celia