Smith family - Battle/Heathfield

[kerryb]

I have a challenge here for anyone with nothing to do!!!  Ha ha  I am getting very frustrated by this family and would appreciate any help anyone can give!!!  Some of this information I have posted before and this is where I am currently at:

Right my gr gr grandmother - according to her marriage cert dated 13 Oct 1889 Helena Lorraine Lovekin (she married James Harmer).  She was aged 22 therefore born 1867 and her father is named as John Lovekin, Labourer.  The witnesses were Emily and Edwin Haffenden.

Found her record on familysearch.org as Helena Lorraine Lovekin Stanford Smith. 

Found 1871, 1881 and 1891 census records for a family called Smith:

John Smith born 1832 born in Lamberhurst
Emily Smith born 1833 born Horsham
Children appear to be:
Emily born 1853 Ore (presumably she who married Edwin)
George born 1857 Rye
Mary Ann born 1860 Ashburnham
Bertha or Edith born 1863 Battle
William born 1866 Warbleton
Laura or Eleanor born 1867 Mountfield
Flora born 1870 Warbleton
Jessie born 1873 Wartling
Thomas born 1877 Mayfield

Please note this family seems to appear in the 1871 census twice with slight differences in names and father's place of birth.  Both entries in parts of Punnetts Town (red herring or why they playing silly b******s?)

I have found birth certificate for Thomas, shows his mother as Emily Stanford and father as John Smith.  This is the only birth certificate I have managed to trace.

To add to the confusion found marriage cert for Emily to Edwin, showing her father as Henry Lovekin!!!

Found Emily Stanford in Roughey, Horsham in 1841, 1851 and 1861 census records. 

I cannot find any other certs for John and Emily's marriage, any of the other children.  Have searched on ancestry.co.uk, familyhistoryonline, familysearch.org and 1837online.

If anyone can search by any other method or has any other tips for me I would be really grateful.  As one of John's professions is Pedlar I am wondering if they are a gypsy family who did not get married or any children baptised, but then why was thomas the last child registered?

Kerry

[rumbolds]

diregard  first  e - mail

emily  lovekin  was  my  great  grandmotherand  had
two  children  by  samuel  pagden  my  great
grandfather,  he  was  found  dead  in  a  chair  on
12 - 12 - 1876 I  have  his  death  certificate  and 
inquest.  samuel  was  the  son  of  james  and
sophia  pagden  nee  simmonds.

emily  lovekin  and  emily  smith  seem  to  have  had
children  by  samel  pagden  and  edwin  haffenden
there  where  nine  children  in  all.

rumbolds

[rumbolds]

Emily  lovekin  was  my  great  grandmother
and  emily  smith  was  my  step - grandmother.

both  emily's  either  lived  or  married  my 
great  grandfather  samel  pagden  and
edwin  haffenden  there  where  nine  children
in  all

samel  pagden  was  found  dead  in  a  chair
I  have  his  birth, death  and  inquest.
he  died  12 - 12 - 1876  in  mayfield,  sussex.
he  was  the  son  of  james  and  sophia  nee
simmonds  or  symonds.

rumbolds

[kerryb]

Hi Rumbolds

Thanks for the information.  Do you know the parents of either Emily's or any more information about either of them?

Funny I have some James Simmonds in another line, shall have to check that out!

Kerry

[rumbolds]

HELLO.  KERRY

I  have  research  on  pagden,  I  possibly
think  the  two  emily's  samel  pagden
could  have  lived  with  gypies  in  jarvis
brook.  sussex.  nr.  crowbrough.

emily  smith  and  emily  lovekin  had 
children  born  in  mayfield, burwash,
wartling  and  bodle  street  green
sussex.

my  grandfather was  william  samel  pagden
born  in  mayfield,  he  married  frances
isabel  marlow  from  sulhamstead  abbotts,
berkshire.  they  married  in  bexhill,  sussex.
on  their  marriage  certifcate  was  the  name
E. HAFFENDEN.  could  have  been  edwin  or
emily.

I  have  to  much  information  on  the  pagden
family  to  send  in  an  e-mail.  have 
photograph  of  my  grand parents,  but  only
copies.  and servel  birth,  marriage  and  death
certificates.  there  is  still  one  daughter  of
my  grandparents  living,  but  the  mind  has
gone.

I  don't  know  anythig  about  the  lovekin
family.

rumbolds

[Manchester Rambler]

Here are Florence and Jessie in 1891:

RG12/777/107/6 - Bodle St (Back Lane), Warbleton
Florence Lovekin  Head  22  Warbleton
Jessie Lovekin  Sister  20  Wartling
James Lovekin  Son  1  Brightling

Marriages Mar 1894 - Hailsham 2b 143
CROFT   James       
LOVEKIN   Jessie        

1901 census:
RG13/888/88/5 - Bodle St, Warbleton
James Croft  Head  37  Ag Lab  Brightling
Jessie Croft  Wife  30  Wartling
James Croft  Son  11  School Boy  Brightling       James Lovekin
Allace Croft  Dau  9  School Girl  Warbleton
Charley Croft  Son  8  School Boy  Warbleton
Nelly Croft  Dau  6  School Girl  Warbleton
William Croft  Son  3  School Boy  Warbleton
Edith Croft  Dau  1  Warbleton


If Emily Stanton was still single in 1861, whose children are Emily, George and Mary Ann?  And where are they in 1861?   


Rambler

[kerryb]

Rambler

Thanks for that, very useful.  Now if I order a copy of Jessie's marriage cert I wonder who her father will be??

Yes I noticed too the Emily Stanford in 1861, when I came back and reread, which adds to the problem I am having with this family. 

Kerry

[Manchester Rambler]

This is weird!  All the girls marry as Lovekin....

Marriages Dec 1884 - Battle 2b 97
ATKIN   Thomas       
LOVEKIN    Edith Bertha        

Rambler

[kerryb]

Rambler

Another one, you are a marvel.  Yes it is weird, why did they change their name.  If you search on Ancestry for John Lovekin you can't find anything at all, no census returns certainly.  Also if the census returns I have are correct up to 1891 they are known as Smith!!!!

Do you see my problem?

Kerry