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Messages - JLo

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1
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Monday 21 April 25 19:27 BST (UK)  »
The mother's name is what piqued my interest - 'My' Morris Lowenthal has also been known as Marcus Samuel Lowenthal at some points. I have always thought that that was his actual official name.

I have had a busy few hours studying German documents (with the help of Google Translate as sadly my German is non-existent), I may be on a wild goose chase but I haven't lost hope! This is what I have so far:

In 1821 in Friesack there is Liebmann Abraham Lowenthal b 15/5/1781 (possibly in Syndow) with his wife Jette Samuel Marcus b 10/04/1784. They married on 24 Feb 1813
Their children are:
Rickel/Rieckel (female) b 21/08/1811
Hanne/Hanehin  (female) b 12/08/1813
Abraham b 17/08/1816
Amalie/Amalia  (female) b 18/08/1818
Jette  (female)  b 14/03/1820

They were described as "Mosaic Jews"
In 1834 they are listed as a family of 7 with Liebmann listed as the head of household. He is described as poor and being supported by his relatives and the Jewish community.

The fact that there are 7 of them could mean that they had no more children after 1820 or it could be that some of the older ones have left home... (obviously I'm hoping the latter!!) 'My' Morris was born circa 1831 which would make Jette (the possible mother) in her late 40s. Hmmm...

My brain is now addled from looking at lots of German. I will follow up on the newspaper article on A E Lowenthal and The Leatheries tomorrow to try things from a different angle. That is definitely on safer ground, as I know they are 'mine' and it is all in English!

Thanks again for your help PatLac

2
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Monday 21 April 25 16:22 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: PatLac on Friday 04 April 25 00:59 BST (UK)
One Löwenthal family of Friesack:

"Der Vater des Kindes, Abraham Löwenthal ist am 17t.April 1816 als Sohn des Liebmann Löwenthal und der Jette Samuel in Friesack geboren. (BLHA Rep.8 Friesack 2005) Er findet sich auch in den Listen der Wahlberechtigten zur Repräsentantenwahl für die Jahre 1860 / 1861 und wird dort als Kaufmann angegeben. Danach gibt es keinen weiteren Nachweis von ihm.

Aus der Familie Löwenthal stammt auch der Maler des Familienbildes der Salomons, welches um 1845 entstand. Dabei dürfte es sich um  Samuel Löwenthal (3.11.1825 – 5.10.1900) handeln, welcher als Zeichenlehrer an der Berliner Knabenschule der jüdischen Gemeinde tätig war."


https://quitzow-kurier.de/Friedhof.htm

Google translation:

The child's father, Abraham Löwenthal, was born on April 17, 1816, the son of Liebmann Löwenthal and Jette Samuel in Friesack. (BLHA Rep. 8 Friesack 2005) He also appears on the lists of eligible voters for the representative elections for the years 1860/1861 and is listed there as a merchant. There is no further evidence of him after that.

The painter of the Salomons' family portrait, created around 1845, also comes from the Löwenthal family. He is likely Samuel Löwenthal (November 3, 1825 – October 5, 1900), who worked as an art teacher at the Berlin boys' school of the Jewish community.

This is quite an interesting family and is a good possibility for my family. I had a good look at BLHA Rep. 8 Friesack 2005 and Liebmann Lowenthal seems to be a haberdasher/textiles merchant who had 5 children up to the year 1820. I will have to have a look and see if I can find anything else about this family. It would be really good to find if they had anymore children after 1820.

Goodness knows where you found this, but thank you!

3
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Thursday 03 April 25 11:31 BST (UK)  »
This is the signature on the arrivals doc

4
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Thursday 03 April 25 11:28 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: manukarik on Wednesday 02 April 25 13:14 BST (UK)
Following on from PatLac's post there is a Certificate of Arrival on 3 November 1857 for a Moritz Loewenthal arriving in Dover from Germany via Calais. Doesn't specify where in Germany he came from, just that he had a German Passport. Moritz is, of course, German for Maurice or Morris.

Have you looked for any Naturalisation Papers?

Link for those who have access to Ancestry:

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tql/

I have looked for naturalisation papers. I did find a Moses Loewenthal and got very excited (!) but it wasn't him. This arrival is quite interesting, particularly as it has a signature. The only other signature I have is this one. It is similar but does not have the squiggle at the end, but goes back and crosses over the 't' so I don't think it's the same person. What do you think?

5
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Wednesday 02 April 25 12:57 BST (UK)  »
He's right at  the bottom of the page. His native country says Preuben (Prussia) but I have no clue what the occupation says or even if it's the right M. Loewenthal!

6
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Saturday 29 March 25 14:55 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: PatLac on Friday 28 March 25 19:37 GMT (UK)
Have you checked his business partner?

"Henry Pallash and Morris Loewenthal, Aldermanbury. manufacturers of leather goods"

Published: Wednesday 17 January 1866
Newspaper: Globe
County: London, England

I have looked at him in the past, but without knowing his age it is tricky to know for sure whether you have the right one. The most likely one I found comes from Prussia/Poland

7
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Saturday 29 March 25 14:38 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: PatLac on Friday 28 March 25 19:01 GMT (UK)
I suppose you have already checked Ancestry's All England, Alien Arrivals, 1826-1869? I don't have a subscription, but i can see a M. Loewenthal arriving in London.

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/1587/?name=_löwenthal&arrival=1859&arrival_x=2-0-0&name_x=i

And this family tree?

Yes that is the possible arrival I have in 1859 from Prussia. No way of proving that it is him though and the profession is completely unreadable (worse than the 1861 census!)

The family tree is his wife Elizabeth's (her mother's maiden name was Cohen) and does not have anything significant on him.

8
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Friday 28 March 25 18:39 GMT (UK)  »
An interesting spot but I think that one is a red herring. Loewenthal is a relatively common name in Germany and Morris's wife Elizabeth was born in Manchester but had moved away by 1841. I wonder if they knew each other...

9
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Handwriting help - Birth place
« on: Friday 28 March 25 17:14 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: JenB on Friday 28 March 25 11:50 GMT (UK)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=48374.msg191606#msg191606
Previous thread, same topic.

Opinions were divided there as to whether is was Russia or Prussia, but the feeling was that the second word could well begin with the letter 'F'.

Time flies when you're stuck at a brick wall. 20 years ago!!! I came to Friesack at the end then, I hope there is more available now than there was then.

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