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Messages - Pete_Wood

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1
The Common Room / Re: History of a house in Shardlow, Derbyshire
« on: Thursday 15 August 19 17:58 BST (UK)  »
I am researching PoW camps of WW2. I can confirm that this was known as Camp 570. It was known, on PoW mail as Camp 570, Shardlow Hall. I struggled for years, with Camp 570. There is a lot on the web, about PoWs at the Hall, but I have yet to find evidence of them staying there. So it was a real pleasure for me to find that your house, at the end of a track to the Hall, was the true location for Camp 570.

It was very common to call a 'Camp' by the name of a very large house, nearby. The guards, for Camp 570, were obviously housed in the grounds of the Hall - and their officers lived in the Hall itself.

Italian PoWs were generally used, for agricultural labour. But officers were exempt from doing labour.

I would be interested to hear how the PoWs spent their time, at your house. Obviously, during the day, they would have been taken to the Hall. Once the war ended, the PoWs enjoyed a fair amount of freedom (especially officers). As long as they were in bed, by a certain hour, they would have been allowed to use the Dog and Duck and gone to the cinema etc. I found that the Italian PoWs were very popular with the locals - who did not consider them to be the enemy, compared to German PoWs.

If you scour eBay - on the Italian and German versions, especially, you might get luck and pick up a letter or postcard written and sent from your house. If you are luckier still, you might even find a letter sent from Italy to your house. Once the war was over, the whole PoW address situation became more lax. In other words, Camp 570 may even have your house name on an envelope. Good luck with your search.

The last of the PoWs would have departed your house in 1948. If you contact me, I am in touch with some PoW specialists in Italy. We may be able to find out more about the war history of your property. Because it would have been inspected at some stage, for example, by the International Red Cross.

2
World War One / Re: Mystery Drawing
« on: Saturday 10 August 19 22:41 BST (UK)  »
I also think the 'tube' is probably that in which a memorial scroll was issued (to the next of kin of a soldier that was killed). It should have the address of the soldier's next of kin, on a label.

Google "memorial scroll and tube" to see some pictures

The 317 number is interesting as it is a very low number, which was issued at the beginning (if not earlier) of WW1.

3
World War One / Re: Mystery Drawing
« on: Saturday 10 August 19 22:03 BST (UK)  »
You are all getting muddled. The drawing is by someone in 203 Prisoner of War Company. This was a WW1 Labour Battalion, formed in September 1918. They dug trenches and did other manual work, as well as looking after PoWs. They were stationed in Abbeyville, France. They then moved to St Omer, France, in January 1919.

The drawing is almost certainly the hut in which they stayed (slept at night).

Many of the men, in a PoW Company were those classed as unfit (previously wounded, older, had a current medical issue etc etc) for front line duties - and previously served in an infantry unit. You should try investigating your man, as having served in one of the Guards Regiments. He would almost certainly have received his medals as serving with 203 PoW Coy - and may even have been invalided out. Look for a Silver War Badge (SWB) in his name.

4
Travelling People / Re: Kent gypsy
« on: Monday 01 April 13 09:05 BST (UK)  »


Hi,

If you go by the two spellings of the surname Bignall and Bignell, Free BMD shows the following children all born in Kent mostly Dartford, mothers surname Lee.

George Bignall 1912 Dartford
Walter Bignall 1920 Strood
Mary J Bignall 1925 Dartford

Ted Bignell 1914 Dartford
Wainess J Bignell 1916 Dartford
Phylliss Bignell 1918 Dartford
William Bignell 1923 Dartford
Jack Bignell 1927 Maidstone
Leonard Bignell 1931 Dartford
Charles Bignell 1934 Dartford

Regards
Lyne

I believe Wainess Bignell was killed by a German bomb which landed on Corkes Meadow (aka Corkes Pit), Leesons Hill, St Paul's Cray, on the night of the 4th and 5th November 1940.

He was listed at the time, by the Metropolitan Police, as Waynus Ley [typo for Lee]. These incorrect details were then passed to the Commonwealth War Graves commission which records his death at http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/3114799/

There were three other casualties, at Corkes Meadow:

Edward Ley [Lee], husband of Annie, aged 58
Benjamin Eastwood, aged 65
Charlotte Baker, aged 9, daughter of William and Phoebe Baker

I also have a number of wounded travellers, in the same incident, including:
Frank Baker, aged 16, flesh wounds
Olley Buckley, aged 55, leg wound
Henry Eastwood, aged 16, leg wound
Harry Brown, aged 39, shrapnel wound
William Brown, age not stated, cuts and bruises
Henry Friend, age not stated, lacerated thigh
William Bunn (also recorded as William Brown), aged 2, fractured skull

The above were treated at the Orpington Hospital.

I would be interested to hear if anyone knows anything more about this tragedy, which affected the Kent Gypsy community, of which I can find very little.



5
London & Middlesex Completed Lookup Requests / Re: Three Rabbits Pub
« on: Friday 02 November 12 18:25 GMT (UK)  »
You have to realise that, in the mortuary (following a raid) the Police guessed the age of the deceased, based on appearance. If the body was claimed, the authorities relied on someone (a relative/friend) to fill in any details which they had been unable to solve.

Some of the WW2 mortuary records survive, in the local records offices. The surviving paperwork includes possessions found on the body, and which undertaker was going to carry out the burial. It will also tell you who claimed the body.

6
London & Middlesex Completed Lookup Requests / Re: Three Rabbits Pub
« on: Friday 02 November 12 13:35 GMT (UK)  »
Which one is your relative? Once I know I can supply more information.

I am guessing it was Robert Hancock.

According to the Police report, he was found dead at the scene - and taken to Manor Park Cemetery ARP Mortuary (a temporary site). His address was stated to be 5 Washington Avenue E12. His aged was stated to be 45

Many of those who were injured were taken to Aldersbrook Hospital, though some were also taken to East Ham Memorial Hospital in Shrewsbury Road.

Robert Hancock's next door neighbour, Edwin Herbert Hull (Number 7 Washington Avenue), aged 70, was injured in the leg, in 1944, in another (non-related) bomb raid.

7
London & Middlesex Completed Lookup Requests / Re: Three Rabbits Pub
« on: Friday 02 November 12 13:32 GMT (UK)  »
001  BAKER  WE  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
002  BARNEY  P  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
003  BASS  ES  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
004  BASS  J  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
005  BROWN  DM  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
006  CHANT  EJ  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
007  CHANT  GF  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
008  CHANT  W  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
009  CHANT  JEG  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
010  CHANT  JJ  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
011  COLLINS  JW  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
012  DONNE  WOF  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
013  EVEREST  FEM  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
014  EVEREST  PG  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
015  FINCHAM  E  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
016  HANCOCK  R  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
017  MARTIN  FM  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
018  MARTIN  AC  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
019  MEAD  AV  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
020  PARSONS  FM  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
021  RUST  PD  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
022  RUST  VM  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
023  SHEPHERD  WF  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
024  SHEPHERD  GM  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
025  WARD  AS  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD
 
026  WARD  F  -  -   23/09/1940  CIVILIAN WAR DEAD

8
London & Middlesex Completed Lookup Requests / Re: Three Rabbits Pub
« on: Saturday 11 August 12 10:56 BST (UK)  »
The building opposite the Three Rabbits (also known as the Rabbit Hotel) was indeed hit on the 23/09/1940 with 26 fatalities (the CWGC gives the address as 742 Romford Road).

I do have some further information so feel free to contact me.

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