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Messages - Andy J2022

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1
Technical Help / Re: Family Trees on Publisher
« on: Yesterday at 19:10 »
Another free publishing program which will run on a Mac is called Scribus.

2
Armed Forces / Re: How were the wounded/dead dealt with?
« on: Yesterday at 16:14 »
Audrey,

Rather than contacting the CWGC as I suggested earlier, you might be better raising the issue with the MOD Joint Casualty and Commpassionate Team who are based in York. They may already have an open file relating to your uncle and can tell you if any progress has been made in trying to locate his body. If they don't, you can start the process in which they will actively investigate the matter. It won't be quick, but you will at least have the satisfaction of having done something to ensure that your uncle is appropriately remembered outside his immediate family.

Also, for an idea about how slow the process of identifying unknown remains can be, take a look at this thread: https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=886696.0

3
Armed Forces / Re: How were the wounded/dead dealt with?
« on: Yesterday at 12:29 »
If anyone knows the answer to your question it would be the CWGC. Otherwise it is not possible to generalise about what happened to individual soldiers. Every effort was made to recover the wounded, but often the only practical solution for the dead was a quick burial with the hope that it would later be possible to recover the bodies for a proper burial later.  Soldiers were supposed to record the locations of burials, but in the desert it would be more difficult to record a precise grid reference due to the lack of geographical features.  The Germans would also bury any dead they came across and then there was the problem of transmitting these details to the British. Sometimes this was done via the Red Cross, but in the heat of battle there was considerable room for error and for individuals to be missed.

One of the main reasons for burying the dead in temporary graves was to reduce the chance of the bodies being disturbed by wild animals. However a shallow grave did not offer that much protection against a determined animal like a desert fox, and so, gruesome though it sounds. it is quite possible there were no identifiable remains to be found later after the battle had moved on.

Not knowing the exact details of the attack involving your uncles, it's impossible to offer an explanation for what happened. Perhaps the vehicle they were in caught fire and so the dead brother was effectively cremated at the scene. If the surviving brother had to return to his unit on foot, he wouldn't have been able to carry his brother's body back with him, especially if he himself was wounded.

4
Armed Forces / Re: More help needed with army records
« on: Tuesday 16 September 25 21:49 BST (UK)  »
Image 1582 is all about calculating his entitlement to a war service gratuity. The date of 15 Aug 1946 was the end of the qualifying period (the start date was 3 Sep 1939) for the war service gratuity. The gratuity was paid as a tax-free lump sum. The figure in red represents his reckonable service date, ie his last day of service. His reckonable service would have been used to calculate any pension he might have been eligible for, although with only 2 years and 227 days service, any pension would have been negligible.

Turning to image 1583, the reckonable service mentioned there is for the war gratuity, rather than his overall reckonable service  He doesn't have any non-reckonable service, but if he had, this would cover time spent in military detention or imprisonment.  The final sentence refers to the transfer of the relevant details to the Regimental Payoffice (RP), who would be responsible for making the payment, possibly to the man's bank account or Post Office Savings account if he had one.  He wasn't being sent anywhere.

As I say, I haven't identified what CRS stands for, but I doubt if it was just a medical facility, although there may have been medical treatment available there.

5
Armed Forces / Re: More help needed with army records
« on: Tuesday 16 September 25 14:44 BST (UK)  »
OK I've made a bit of progress on the ODT issue. It stands for Occupational Divisional Transport. I think that just means general transport in support of a Division, with the Occupational referring to the fact that the British Army of the Rhine was occupying Germany.

Details of his units, and where they were stationed, along with their parent Divisional Headquarters shown below. Also the location of 6 (BR) General Hospital (at Iserlohn) where he was in Jun 1946.

503 Company (Occupational Divisional Transport) – 49 (West Riding) Infantry Division 23 Feb 46 – 53 (Welsh) Infantry Division 21 Oct 46 – disbanded 15 Nov 46
507 Company (Armoured Divisional Troop Carrying) – 7 Armoured Division – British Troops Berlin 4 Jul 45 to 19 Mar 46 – 52 (Lowland) Infantry Division (Occupational Divisional Transport) 15 Jun 46 – 7 Armoured Division 15 Jul 46
951 Company (Occupational Divisional Transport) formerly 507 Company (Armoured Division Troop Carrying) – 7 Armoured Division 1 Jan 47 – Hannover District (Mixed) 15 Jan 48


6 (British) General Hospital
(600 beds) – L of C – Oostakker north-east of Ghent-B
16 Jul 45 – Panzer Kaserne later Argonne Barracks Iserlohn – 1 Corps District for admin
Detachment – Hemer east of Iserlohn 1 Jan 46
Detachment – Letmathe west of Iserlohn 1 Jan 46
5 Jun 46 – 6 (Iserlohn) British General Hospital – 1 Corps District
6 Nov 46 – 6 (Iserlohn) British Military Hospital
1 Jul 47 – BAOR: Lieutenant Colonel l EM Hennessy
1 Apr 48 – Families Wing (30 Beds)
16 Feb 49 – Families Wing (60 Beds)


53rd (Welsh) Infantry Division under command 12th Corps
Jun 45 – Main Headquarters Hilden (Wehrmacht) Kaserne later St David’s Barracks relieving XXII Corps United States Army
Responsibility for Regierungsbezirk Dόsseldorf
24 May 46 – redeployment to form X Division commences
4 Jun 46 – responsibility for Stadtkreis Bottrop from 49th (West Riding) Infantry Division
15 Jul 46 – responsibility for Stadtkreis Dortmund from 49th (West Riding) Infantry Division
1 Oct 46 – redesignated X Division
Responsibility for Regierungsbezirk Dόsseldorf now less Rhein-Wupper-Kreis and Stadtkreis Solingen – Stadtkreis Remscheid – now to include – south-west portion known as Recklinghausen area (south of a line of river Lippe – canals Dortmund-Ems – Lippe-Datteln) and north-west Arnsberg – Ennepe-Ruhrkreis-Kreis – west portion Landkreis Iserlohn – Stadtkreis Lόnen – Stadtkreis Dortmund – Stadtkreis Castrop-Rauxel – Stadtkreis Herne – Stadtkreis Wanne-Eickel – Stadtkreis Bochum – Stadtkreis Witten – Stadtkreis Wattenscheid – Stadtkreis Hagen – Stadtkreis Iserlohn
15 Oct 46 – responsibility for the remainder of Landkreis Iserlohn and portion of Landkreis Soest, Landkreis Unna from 49th (West Riding) Infantry Division
1 Feb 47 – redesignated 2nd Infantry Division

7th Armoured Division under command 12th Corps
21 Oct 46 – responsibility for British Army of the Rhine Training Centre and Landkreis Paderborn – Landkreis Bόren from 49th (West Riding) Infantry Division
1 Nov 46 – Land Schaumburg-Lippe dissolved – Landkreis Buckeburg – Landkreis Stadthagen to Province Niedersachsen (Lower Saxony)
31 Dec 46 – personnel strength = 626 Officers + 11977 Other Ranks
21 Jan 47 – Regierungsbezirk Minden dissolved former Landkreise to the new Regierungsbezirk Detmold
15 Mar 47 – responsibility for Landkreis Hoxter (excluding Stadtkreis Hoxter) – Landkreis Warburg from 1st Belgian Corps District
1 May 47 – relieved 1st Polish Armoured Division – 4th (British) Liaison Headquarters disbanded
Responsibility for Landkreis Leer – Landkreis Aschendorf-Hummling – Landkreis Cloppenburg – Landkreis Meppen – Landkreis Bersenbrόck – Landkreis Lingen – Landkreis Grafschaft Bentheim
1 Jun 47 – Headquarters British Army of the Rhine on disbandment of 1st Corps District
28 Jul 47 – administration responsibility for minor units in Mόnster and Osnabrόck Garrisons to 7th Armoured Brigade
15 Jan 48 – Hannover District formed from 7th Armoured Division and 5th Infantry Division

I have not been able to identify 1091 CRS. It's obviously a reception and holding unit of some sort which processed soldiers returning to the UK for discharge. CRS may possibly refer to the Corps Reception Centre (Sennelager), but I can't find the 1091 used in that context.

As you probably know the X list to which he was posted on 29.4.47 is for soldiers not on the strength of a unit. Sub category 8a refers to "All non-effective held at Base Reinforcement Units whose return to the UK has been authorized"

The LOCAT stamp just refers to a locations index, but it hasn't been filled in so it doesn't really tell us anything. Obviously the image you posted doesn't cover the dates where you say there is a gap.

Some information on the various locations mentioned here.

6
Armed Forces / Re: More help needed with army records
« on: Monday 15 September 25 22:24 BST (UK)  »
I can't help with the sticker question.  What are the questions immediately before question 8, which might at least give a clue?

As for your other queries, I think it would be helpful to have images of the entries. Context is everything when trying to decipher these entries.

7
World War Two / Re: Royal Artillery Attestation c 1940
« on: Monday 15 September 25 22:18 BST (UK)  »
Class W Army Reserve was introduced in June 1916 by Army Order 203/16 and was "for all those soldiers whose services are deemed to be more valuable to the country in civil rather than military employment". I assume that it fulfilled the same purpose in WW2.

I cannot help with your other question. I suspect it relates to a specific paragraph in the Reserve Regulations concerning his final discharge having completed his reserve liability. Para 234 does not appear to be a reference to King's Regulations for the Army. In KRs 1940 discharges are covered in paragraph 390.

8
The Common Room / Re: 1939 Register
« on: Sunday 14 September 25 20:25 BST (UK)  »
I believe that Find My Past unredact entries on a monthly basis, but Ancestry only do so annually. However if you have your uncle's death certificate you may be able to accelerate the process on FindMyPast. I provided proof of death for someone and they removed the redaction within 24 hours. However it sounds as if you don't have a subscription for FindMyPast so that may not be much help to you.

9
Armed Forces / Re: Help with WW2 records
« on: Sunday 14 September 25 19:57 BST (UK)  »
ODT is  certainly non-standard. If you are right about it being an Ordnance Depot, then I suggest T might stand for a location in Germany located within the British zone of occupation or the Line of Communication through the Low Countries.. Nowhere comes to mind.

However Ordnance Depots were run by the RAOC, not RASC. RASC had their own depots. That is not to say that there couldn't have been a detachment of RASC drivers working from an Ordnance depot to move stocks forward.

You can find a list of post-1945 RASC units here: http://british-army-units1945on.co.uk/royal-army-service-corps/major-units.html
It includes an entry "951 Company. Early 1947. Formed in Germany from personnel of disbanded 507 Coy" This accords with your man's record of postings.

The text is reclassified [as] 2 stars soldier.

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