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Messages - Ashley12

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1
Yorkshire (West Riding) / Re: The Fleece Inn - Elland
« on: Sunday 24 January 21 18:02 GMT (UK)  »
The exact location of Mount Pleasant and the Fleece Inn in the late 1800s in Greetland has been a puzzle for me for quite a while.  I could not find it on the OS 6-inch map of 1888-1913.  However, the more detailed 1:2500 OS plans of 1893 and 1907 in fact do show Mount Pleasant, a collection of terraces and cottages on the south side of Rochdale Road, east of St Thomas’s church, between what is now Haigh Street and Cross Hills Methodist Church.  “Greetland Edge” is clearly marked to the north of Rochdale Road, and “Mount Pleasant” to the south.   “Fleece Inn” is also marked, but on the north side of Rochdale Road (in the position of the first house on the left in Springfields View, 193 Rochdale Rd, HX4 8EN).  In the 1861 census for Greetland, the Fleece Inn seems to be run by George and Martha Taylor.  However, White’s Directory for Halifax in 1866 and 1870 records a Thomas Parr running “The Fleece” or “Golden Fleece”, so I assume there were two inns of a similar name in the district. The one in question is clearly differentiated as Fleece Inn, Mount Pleasant.  There are two versions of the 1871 census, both recording James and Hannah Thwaite, with their 7 children (John, Eli, Ben, Alice, Mary Hannah, Jessica and Ernest).  In the second version Jessica is recorded as Celina (and in the 1891 census she appears curiously as Sabrina). So, Jessica aka Celina aka Sabrina?  In 1881 Fleece Inn is being run by John and Margaret Radcliffe.  I have not found Fleece Inn in the 1891 census, but the Thwaite family (James, Hannah, John, Ben, Ernest, Mary and Sabrina) are still living in the village, at Cross Hill.

My particular interest in this area has been to locate William and Mary Shaw, who ran a successful grocery business at Mount Pleasant for at least 30 years (1840-1870). They were, like most of the village I imagine, committed Methodists; Methodism was well established in the village with Wesleyan, Primitive and Connexion Methodist chapels, and also Independents and Unitarians.  The 1871 census records 22 households in the properties comprising “Mount Pleasant”. Occupants included farmers, a nail-maker, clog maker, milliner, the innkeeper (James Thwaite), labourers, a weaver, coal merchant, stonemason, spinner and a schoolmaster. The list of properties making up Mount Pleasant included the Chapel House, the Fleece Inn and (in 1881) “Shaw’s Buildings”.  I would be interested to hear from any Rootschat members who might have any information on the Shaw family. 

2
Canada Lookup Request / Green family
« on: Saturday 07 November 20 15:16 GMT (UK)  »
Somehow I knew *Sandra* would come to the rescue!
 
So Theodore (b. in Worcestershire, England in 1869, d.1934) emigrated with his family to Canada in 1870, and in 1892 married Minnie (Beatrice) Robinson (b.1871, d.1968); they had seven children (Ruth, Samuel, Robert, Violet, Walter, Grandvill and Theodore) of which Samuel Morris (b.1901, d.1985) was the second. Samuel married Evelyn Joyce Baker in 1927.

Thanks so much, Sandra!  You are a star!

3
Canada Lookup Request / Canada Lookup Request: a Green family in Montreal
« on: Saturday 07 November 20 12:46 GMT (UK)  »
Arising from my exploration of the Baker-Fincham-Healy connection in early 20th century Montreal, I am now pursuing a Green family.  Evelyn Joyce Baker (a nurse, b.1900, d.1975) accompanied her parents (Ernest and Catherine Baker) arriving in Montreal in 1922.  It appears that she returned briefly to England in 1923, only to return a second time to Canada in 1924.  In 1927 she married Samuel Morris Green (b.1901, d.1985), an employee of CNR (Canadian National Railways) at the Pointe-Sainte-Charles assembly facility in Montreal.  They had five children – Joan (m. Frank Mitchell), Frances (m. Ray Barbeau), Raymond (m. Frances), Edward and Gregory (m. Bonnie).  So far I have been unable to pinpoint Samuel’s entry into Canada, or indeed his (assumed) background in England. Can anyone shed light on this?

4
Canada Lookup Request / Ada Fincham and Alfred John Baker - a speculation
« on: Friday 16 October 20 23:37 BST (UK)  »
Under the topic "England to Canada 1940s" Cosmac replied to Blue-Spirit regarding the likely arrival in Canada of Ada Elizabeth Fincham in the passenger list of the Tunisian for November 7th 1903.  Under "Ross Healy" *Sandra* confirmed her interpretation.  Both agreed that the hand-written entry for page 3, line 10, reads:  Miss A.E.Fincham, 25, born Norfolk, occupation cook, destination Montreal. (She was born in 1879 in Attleborough, Norfolk.)  She thus sailed from Liverpool to Montreal, arriving November 7th 1903 on the Tunisian. Did she travel alone as a single lady, unaccompanied?  Travel arrangements for Alfred John Baker are not recorded in passenger lists for either 1902 or 1903, though he was thought to have left England in 1902.  He was born in Chelmsford, Essex, in 1865 (although he gives his age as 52 in the 1921 census, hence 1869, making himself 10 years older than Ada; he also declares that they both entered Canada in the same year, 1900, an error of 3 years).  AJB was a leather finisher by trade (1891 census, Wimbledon, and 1901 census, Wandsworth).  In Montreal he continued this trade as a glove cutter (probably with the Hudson Bay Co.) as recorded in both 1911 and 1921 censuses (St Laurent/Laurier Ward Montreal).  In England, Ada had been a servant girl living with the Carlton family in Attleborough, Norfolk, in 1891, aged 12; and a servant with the Lacks family in Wimbledon, Surrey, in 1901, aged 22.  Note, Wimbledon.

Back to the Tunisian passenger list. We have this interesting conjunction of names in lines 10 and 11:

10. Miss A.E.Fincham   25    Cook                    England     Norfolk      Montreal
11. Geo. Foster           35    Leather finisher     England     Essex        Montreal

The most parsimonious interpretation of this circumstantial evidence is this: 

Alfred John Baker in fact arrived in Canada in 1903 on the same ship.  He travelled under an assumed name, George Foster, accompanying a single lady, Ada Elizabeth Fincham, 10 years his junior, whom he may have known in Wimbledon.  He gives the game away by declaring himself a leather finisher, originating from Essex! Is this pure coincidence?  Can anyone shed further light on this speculation?

5
Canada Lookup Request / Re: Ross Healy, Fincham connection
« on: Friday 16 October 20 21:02 BST (UK)  »
Did you intend to send an attachment of your Fincham connection?  I would like to see how your grandfather, Horace, was related to Ada Elizabeth Fincham.  Do you therefore have any distant relatives in Montreal?  Thank you.

6
Canada Lookup Request / Re: Ross Healy
« on: Thursday 15 October 20 17:31 BST (UK)  »
Brilliant detective work, Sandra!  The post-1921 family network is coming together so well.

7
Canada Lookup Request / Re: Ross Healy, Ada Fincham, Alfred John Baker and Ernest Baker
« on: Thursday 15 October 20 15:16 BST (UK)  »
Thank you, Sandra. I am delighted to have all these details of the Bakers in Montreal - Ernest Baker, his wife Catherine (Kate), daughter Evelyn Joyce Baker (a younger daughter, Gladys, born 1902, sadly died in Chelmsford in 1915), his grandchildren (Joan, Francis, Raymond, Edward, Gregory), and 14 great-grandchildren according to an obituary.  Evelyn appears to have entered Canada twice (1922 and 1924).  She was a nurse; she married Samuel Morris Green in 1927 in York Toronto, and died in City of Two Mountains, Quebec, in 1975.  Ernest was one of 11 children born to Alfred and Mary Ann Baker of Chelmsford, Essex, England between the years 1862 and 1884.  It is interesting to note that, on arrival in Montreal in 1922, Ernest initially went to stay with his older brother, Alfred John and family, in Dorlet Street, St Denis Boulevard, Montreal.  In 1921 the family residing here consisted of AJB, Ada Elizabeth Fincham, and six children (Russell, Beatrice, Florence, Idah, Stanley and Clarence).  There are photographs of Alfred John, Ernest and Kate, and Evelyn and Gladys. I am hoping to locate further photographs of the extended Baker family in Montreal, and to trace the whereabouts of Alfred and Ada's children and grandchildren.  Details of AJB's arrival in Montreal (1902) are yet to be confirmed.  He was the first of a number of Chelmsford Bakers to cross the pond in the early 1900s.

8
Canada Lookup Request / Re: Ross Healy, Ada Fincham and Alfred John Baker
« on: Wednesday 14 October 20 23:06 BST (UK)  »
Hugely impressed with this mass of detailed information, and extremely grateful! 
My next lines of enquiry -
(1)  Was Ada still working for the Lacks family in Kingston (Wimbledon?) Surrey in the 1901 census?  Meanwhile AJB was in Wimbledon in 1891 and Wandsworth in 1901
(2)  Track down Alfred John's passage to Canada, thought to be 1902, Liverpool to Montreal.  How do I pinpoint his entry on the Canadian Passenger List with only name, year, and ports of departure and arrival?
(3)  Follow up the movements of the Montreal children (Russell, Beatrice, Florence, Idah, Stanley, Clarence) after 1921.  The 1931 census is not available until 2023.  What is the best line of approach?

9
Canada Lookup Request / Re: Ross Healy
« on: Wednesday 14 October 20 19:14 BST (UK)  »
Thank you, Sandra

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