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Messages - battista

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1
Northumberland / Re: Missing death index and certificate [Brickwall]
« on: Tuesday 13 December 22 23:39 GMT (UK)  »
Wow, fantastic work as always RTL! Yes, thank you so much for going to the archives. Above and beyond, never would I have imagined all the amazing folk here uncovering so much about our family. And how many distant family members have found this thread and come into contact with us, this the thread that keeps on giving.

What a journey, 4 1/2 years later. Thank you to everyone who has lent their time and effort, I am forever grateful.

I'm fairly poor using the Italian records site Antenati, quick search yielded nothing of value unfortunately. Was hoping maybe more records had been indexed. I recall going through the death records for his hometown of Cassino, trying to find his name in all the pages. Trouble is, he might not have died there, could've been many other places in Italy. Or, like the workhouse suspects, maybe a lot closer to home.

2
The Common Room / Re: FamilySearch "Legacy NFS Source" accuracy - Italy
« on: Wednesday 27 May 20 06:47 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: bungey on Tuesday 26 May 20 23:40 BST (UK)
I would like to say that I believe that your initial answer is the most coherent explanation that i have seen to date for certain family trees on the familysearch.org website. That most family trees there in the early days seemed to be works of fiction. That even today we are plagued by so called Legacy record family trees.

Yes, so it turned out the record listed from Rocca D'Arce was correct in its information. I have the original birth certificate from the region, however, this is the wrong person. Whoever added the information simply placed it onto my ancestor who had the same name and lived in the city nearby.

I now have my ancestor's real birth certificate, which is from Cassino not Rocca D'Arce. The Cassino record completely matches with all my other records fortunately.

3
Ireland / Re: St Aubyn Burke - Where to start?
« on: Thursday 27 February 20 02:26 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: ShaneNZ on Saturday 08 February 20 08:09 GMT (UK)
Battista I realise this is 2019 post. I research names from an old Irish Surgeon/ Dr's Shakespeare's Birthday Book who arrived in NZ on 1899.
Among some 800-900 Autographs is a
Stella Frances Eileen Murray Jun 14 1887-1965 Contralto Singer
and an E G Murray (Eileen Gertrude) nee Burke born Oct 26 who married Henry John Murray (born NZ) 23rd December 1884 NSW Australia.
This may be of interest to you. Thanks Shane CHCH NZ.

Hi Shane, sorry for the late reply. That's very interesting, I never had a birth day or month for Eileen, only a rough year before. Is there any way I can get a photo of the original page/section where this information is written?

What's the nature of this book, do you know why there are so many autographs?

4
Northumberland / Re: Missing death index and certificate [Brickwall]
« on: Thursday 02 January 20 21:20 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: River Tyne Lass on Thursday 02 January 20 15:27 GMT (UK)
battista, perhaps you were right after all that Giovanni may have gone back to Italy!! :o  If the following record is true .. it looks as if Elizabeth might have told someone her Father was in Italy.

I have just found this record in the creed register of Newcastle Workhouse.

Reference: HO.NGH.88/2 

It looks like Elizabeth and son next went to the Newcastle Workhouse.  Son's date of birth seems to be a year out but I do think these are them.  I have kept to the spelling shown in the volume as it appears Battiste/Battista.

'All Saints
Date of Admission: 1.10.14
Battiste, Elizabeth  Year of birth 1887
Clothing No: 435
Relatives: Fa - Battista    Italy
Occupation: Single
Church of England
Battiste, John George   Year of birth 1911
Clothing No: 30
Relatives: Mo. in Hospital
Both: From whence admitted: Silver Street
Both discharged: 3.11.14

https://www.flickr.com/photos/newcastlelibraries/4080814072

https://co-curate.ncl.ac.uk/silver-street-medieval-newcastle/

Wow! Great work RTL  ;D Thank you very much! I did not get any notifications from this thread, so had no idea there were all these new posts from Sep - now :) Brilliant work everyone, unfortunately, it's been so so long I have a hard time figuring out who all these people were...

It was a while ago now, but I believe when I checked his home town of Cassino's records, I was not able to find a death record there. Perhaps he lived in another town, it's worth a recheck as I'm not 100% sure I went through all the death records. There's a lot of Italian records continually becoming available online, so I do believe eventually it'll be trivial to access this info.

RE: Matthews family, I wrote a letter to all the family members I could find in April of last year, part of this letter is on Google Docs here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/12mk_A3Emk6yr5EJKDpRRfZ_pYfJXUlFzhiDHxP41RWI/edit?usp=sharing

Known aliases of James Battista:
  • Thomas G. Matthews
  • Jacobus Battista
  • George J Battista
  • George J Matthews
  • George Marshall

5
Australia / Re: St Aubyn Burke family from Cork, Ireland
« on: Tuesday 07 May 19 00:02 BST (UK)  »
Thanks for the information on "Ne Temere" @Maiden Stone, really unfortunate that wasn't in place for their marriage.

@majm Thanks for pointing me to the thread, very interesting read  ;D

Quote from: Dundee on Sunday 05 May 19 15:22 BST (UK)
Quote from: battista on Friday 03 May 19 03:46 BST (UK)
Are there any other printouts in NZ that might be useful in finding further information about Eileen?



The births certs for any of her children should give her age and birthplace and are probably important to see as both are unclear.

Debra  :)

I got two of her children's birth printouts (she has 3 children). The father was the informant for both and only lists "Ireland" as her birthplace  :(

Eileen's death printout: https://i.imgur.com/QDH4x3R.png

Bernard Percival Murray's birth printout: https://i.imgur.com/MpI1DY3.png

Henry St. Aubyn Murray's birth printout: https://i.imgur.com/GtMUsaJ.png

Kind of frustrating the father was the informant. All other birth records I've ordered (from England) the mother was always the informant. Perhaps if she filled them out, she may have given more details.

The informant for Eileen's death was the undertaker. So, I suppose that makes the information less reliable than if it were a close family member?

6
Australia / Re: St Aubyn Burke family from Cork, Ireland
« on: Friday 03 May 19 11:07 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: majm on Friday 03 May 19 05:59 BST (UK)
I wonder    ....  1858 v 1851 ...

I wonder if 1858 would be possible year of migration with the military etc  ... and thus a reissued set  of church records were organised by Eileen's dad at that time,  thus when she married,  the clergy took the year of issue to be the  year of the actual event .... speculations of course do not solve the dilemma ....  and of course 19th century seamail to and from NSW / Ireland . Say six weeks each way,  one week there ... thats three months ..... could cause embarrassing delays to 'hasty' marriages ....

JM

Hmm yes. I suspect the informant was one of her children, as her husband had already passed away at this point. So that could also be the source of the discrepancy. Would certainly be interesting if that 1851/1858 theory was correct.

St Thomas has responded to my email. They've said the records are in the Archdiocesan archives and they will contact them for me. They've also asked for why I want the information, in case there's another/additional ways to get it. I'll be responding to them now :)

7
Australia / Re: St Aubyn Burke family from Cork, Ireland
« on: Friday 03 May 19 05:44 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: majm on Friday 03 May 19 05:40 BST (UK)
Exactly.   Somewhere on RChat there's a recent thread discussing RC marriages,  and regardless of where in the world,  the clergy would refer back to baptism parish register to check the details .... and  the details to be recorded on that baptism's parish records include their marriage ....

So hopefully the NSW parish register has the actual place ,  not just Ireland

JM

Ooh, interesting. I'll search for that thread. I wonder how that used to work, seems like it could get a bit expensive to copy and send parish records all over the world. I suppose that's discussed in that thread.

8
Australia / Re: St Aubyn Burke family from Cork, Ireland
« on: Friday 03 May 19 04:43 BST (UK)  »
@majm Thanks for all the help and info!

Registration Number: 1854/4580
Family Name: Murray
Given name(s): Henry
Mother's given name(s): Francis Wilmot
Father's given name(s): John

Just took a look at those examples you gave, thank you very much. Incredibly useful. It seems that the NSW marriage cert I got had most of that information in there, apart from birthplace. Would the purpose of getting the original church record be to see the birthplace section?

9
Australia / Re: St Aubyn Burke family from Cork, Ireland
« on: Friday 03 May 19 03:46 BST (UK)  »
"The marriage certificate has St Thomas Church Vestry.  They are not married before the church altar. That would mean that one of the couple is not Catholic, and the priest would be ensure that it was recorded as such."

Hmm, interesting, I'd imagine Henry Murray wasn't Catholic, considering he's from an English family.

"I think that they have given Christchurch as "usual residence" because that is their intended residence. Eileen has not been in NZ before her marriage."

Christchurch as usual residence because that's where she intended to live certainly does make sense.

"Henry would be named for his father, and St Aubyn for mother's family"

Yep, makes sense.

"Stella would be named for maternal grandmother, paternal grandmother and mother"

John Murray, Frances Wilmot Coffin, John St Aubyn Burke, Stella Chester are all of Stella F E Murray's grandparents.

Bernard Percival Murray is my father; I do not know where his name comes from. I knew about my aunt and uncle. I will ask around the family.

Henry St. Aubyn Murray had a son, Anthony St Aubyn Murray. The St Aubyn name was not passed down to Anthony's children (probably lost all meaning by that point).

I will get a printout of the death record. Are there any other printouts in NZ that might be useful in finding further information about Eileen?

Thanks for all the help @wivenhoe

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