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Messages - Billy_B

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1
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Birth/baptism - William Barnes (b. 1872 in Liverpool)
« on: Wednesday 16 May 18 01:53 BST (UK)  »
Quick update:

I've just got a DNA match which is confirmed by the paper trail from the Barrys, coming from the line descending from the oldest Barry sibling Margaret:

https://www.geni.com/people/Margaret-Murphy-Barry/6000000042025198873

She married John Murphy in 1863.

This is her in the census of 1861 with the Barry family:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7P4-TDD

Then after her marriage in 1871:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KZGT-H67

I assume this is her in 1881 (the place of birth is wrong, but John Murphy is listed as a blacksmith, which he is in 1871):
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q27L-8YWS

And then the same family in 1891, but she has died by then:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:73QG-DPZ

The interesting thing is that 1881 and 1891 censuses show a daughter Margaret, who could be one of the witnesses at my grandfather's wedding (she'd be his first cousin):

Quote from: suzard on Friday 29 April 16 05:03 BST (UK)
Quote from: Billy_B on Thursday 28 April 16 22:59 BST (UK)
What we can prove (or at least what we have paperwork for):

  • He married Annie Ryan on October 10, 1895 in St Joseph's Church, Liverpool - from their wedding certificate.

St Joseph Liverpool Catholic Register
image clearly gives date of marriage as 10 November 1895

there are also 4 addresses given - Thomas was Nash St  Annie 52 Clare St
witnesses Michael Stanford 22 Rose Villa & Margarita Murphy 37 rose villa

2
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Thursday 03 May 18 18:02 BST (UK)  »
And when things are looking more solid make sure to update your ancestral surnames on FTDNA and add in your family tree as they are very useful for helping people figure out if they have any matches. If you haven't done so already you can also add your autosomal data to GEDmatch.

This is the extra bonus of pushing your family tree back a generation as you double the number of ancestral surnames as it feeds into your DNA tests (helping get more value out of them) which may then help with the family tree.

3
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Thursday 03 May 18 05:18 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: heywood on Saturday 28 April 18 08:23 BST (UK)
You can’t really go off census details. You need the birth records and you have him 1847 from Lancashire?

Marriage

January 24th 1842
Walton on the Hill
Henry Owen, Labourer of Parliament Street Father John, a Farmer
Sarah Norcott of Parliament Street Father John, a labourer

I went through the tree on FamilySearch and did a bit of tweaking and looked into the Norcott's - seems Sarah had a number of siblings, at least one of which (Mary) married and had a number of kids. Her mother is Sarah Eaton.

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/K4TW-4Q4

This is the most likely candidate for her baptism:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NB27-8PN

Although her marriage records don't include parents, so...:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N659-GNL

Looks like ther husband may have died before the 1841 census, if so, she may have remarried:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NKT6-M4R
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2D4L-YDV

As you can see, things tend to get a little tricky once you get into the early 1800s but it is possible to push back further, you just need to pick apart the records and keep an eye out for wills and other documents that might help

4
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Tuesday 01 May 18 18:27 BST (UK)  »
Did Hannah marry for a third time? I'm getting a Hannah Sims dying in New York with the right parents and date of birth:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2WVK-9N3

5
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Tuesday 01 May 18 18:02 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: jowen1986 on Tuesday 01 May 18 06:17 BST (UK)
Hi Bill, the link keeps taking me to the sign in page. Thank you for the updated info though.

Ah, sorry, I assumed you were the John Owen building the tree on FamilySearch in parallel to the one on Geni:

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/LBZB-T9V

So, yes, well worth signing up as they have a lot of resources for free and you can also check out the family tree on there to see if there is anything to add or correct.

6
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Tuesday 01 May 18 05:50 BST (UK)  »
The Brooks in the 1861 census, oddly Isabella's birthplace is unknown (might be worth checking the original census sheets):

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M75Z-8MV

7
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Monday 30 April 18 06:50 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: trish1120 on Saturday 28 April 18 08:24 BST (UK)
GEORGE Owen age 21, Father HENRY, married Hannah SMITH age 19, Widow, Father James BROOKS,
21 Dec 1865, Liverpool.

Looks like this is Hannah Brooks:

Quote
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
  • Name:   Hannah Brooks
  • Gender:   Female
  • Christening Date:   30 Aug 1847
  • Christening Date (Original):   30 AUG 1847
  • Christening Place:   SAINT PETER,LIVERPOOL,LANCASHIRE,ENGLAND
  • Birth Date:   17 Aug 1847
  • Father's Name:   James Brooks
  • Mother's Name:   Isabella

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J9MD-4WL

Registration:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:26YQ-SHW

GRO gives mother's surname, an interesting Irish one:

Quote
BROOKS, HANNAH       CONION     
GRO Reference: 1847  S Quarter in WEST DERBY  Volume 20  Page 972

Then, as she is a Smith and a widow, this seems to be her wedding (at 16):

Quote
England Marriages, 1538–1973
  • Name:   James Henry Smith
  • Spouse's Name:   Hannah Brooks
  • Event Date:   14 Sep 1863
  • Event Place:   St. Matthias', Liverpool, Lancashire, England
  • Father's Name:   George Smith
  • Spouse's Father's Name:   James Brooks
  • Marital Status:   Single
  • Spouse's Marital Status:   Single

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NNM5-8Q7

James and Isabella's marriage intentions (they were both 21 at the time, so were born around 1825):
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBZQ-Z2R

Registration:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:26WG-HKS

8
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Monday 30 April 18 05:58 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: jowen1986 on Monday 30 April 18 00:33 BST (UK)
Thanks Billy. I will do it as soon as I can to help narrow everything down.

It'll take a bit and may need interpretation (and may not offer any definitive answers, mine hasn't just clues) - in the meantime you can push your family tree back further, if you can get paper links to distant cousins you also match genetically then that is a big bonus.

No guarantees though - on my wife's English side we can get one line back to the 1600s (a 7th or 8th cousin ended up a Mormon, so did a lot of the early work and we've nailed that down and expanded it with further research) and another back to the Normans (thanks to stumbling across a known and well-researched Anglo-Norman name) but confirming any matches on that side is proving difficult. The best matches are on our most poorly documented lines, which is in itself a bonus.

9
Lancashire Lookup Requests / Re: Need Help looking up Ancestors
« on: Monday 30 April 18 00:15 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: jowen1986 on Sunday 29 April 18 20:33 BST (UK)
I am part of the group on ftdna, but nothing comes back so far. The only thing I have to go on is I have a aunt who married a male heir of a female from the Lancasters, rumors of Owain Glyndwr and William the conqueor, possibly the tudors. Who knows. I need the ydna testing to be done, thats for sure.

Definitely. You can start at Y-37 and see how things go, for some people I've worked with in our haplogroup (and in the project for my mother's maiden name which I help admin) that is enough to get them solid results for others (including me) it isn't helpful so you need to dig deeper.

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