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Messages - gweilo8888

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Essex Completed Lookup Requests / Re: O'GORMAN MERVYN - looking 4 Christine & ?
« on: Wednesday 06 May 15 18:09 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: michel65 on Wednesday 06 May 15 16:02 BST (UK)
hello,
thanks to you all for trying to solve that puzzle. I find it tantalizing, same as you I guess.

I found an article in the daily mail that pretty well sums up what we know (and what we don't) about christine.

the link is : http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3066019/Who-lady-red-Mystery-young-woman-cascading-blonde-hair-earliest-colour-photos.html

I am no specialist in genealogy but I am fond of art. Whoever the sitter is, in my view these photos might tell us about the genealogy of art. As regards painting, they stand half-way between the Preraphalites .... and Salvador Dali!
No soft watches here, of course. However Dali was fascinated with classical poses, and many of his his paintings have a similar dreamy, slightly frightening surrealistic atmosphere. Take the items lying on the beach in the "picnic" autochrome, for example, and of course the vast expanse of sea and beach behind Christine. And the odd shapes of the cliffs in the background.

do you know if mervyn o'gorman shot other photos by any chance?

to return to genealogy : if any private correspondence from O'Gorman emerged, this would greatly help to define who christina really was.


Best and thanks again
   

Quick heads-up for you that the bulk of the discussion seems to be taking place in a different thread, which you can find here:

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=478074.27

2
Dorset / Re: Lulworth Cove, O'GORMAN photos?
« on: Thursday 30 April 15 21:56 BST (UK)  »
I made several additions to the above post, but then hit its length limit, so here they are separately:

EDIT: And one more update from me: familysearch.org has several records suggesting a Robert Cecil Radmore, born 13 September 1895 in Dalston, Hackney, London, and still living there at the age of 16 in 1911. During World War I, it has him serving in the Honourable Artillery Company, 4085 Regiment, 1st Reserve, 2nd Battalion in 1915, and registering for the draft in 1942, now in New York City.

Separately, there are records for a Robert Radmore (born England), married to Mary (born Ireland) and with son Peter (born New York), listing Robert and Mary as emigrated to the US in 1926, and the whole family as resident in Manhattan (Districts 0501-0750) in 1930, then with a six year old daughter Mary (also born New York) and living in Assembly District 14, Manhattan in 1940.

EDIT 2: Aha -- and going back to libertyellisfoundation.org, there's record of a Robert C P and Mary C Radmore arriving in the USA on the Ascania in 1926...

EDIT 3: And going back to jeffseeley.org, I note that he has Robert Radmore and Mary Gorman as having two children, Peter and an unnamed female child who married a John D. Foster, deceased 2002 in Chicago. The Chicago Tribune has a John D. Foster, married around 1966 to Adrian Radmore Foster:

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2002-07-15/news/0207150017_1_mr-foster-montgomery-ward-longtime-wards

Slightly curious, but there are several other records of a Mrs. Adrian Radmore Foster in Chicago, so it's most likely correct. Adrian can, it seems, also be a girl's name (not just Adrienne, Adrianne, or Adriana); perhaps she was Mary Adrian Radmore, and goes by her middle name as it seems her mother did? There are several records on Google of a Mary Adrian Foster.

EDIT 4: And returning to familysearch.org, there's a Mary Adrian Radmore arriving in New York in 1953, on the Sadena.

EDIT 5: I'm familiar with the other ship names above, but had never heard of the Sadena, so I went back to the Liberty Ellis Foundation and looked at the manifest. There was indeed a Mary Adrian Radmore listed on board, but it wasn't a ship -- it was a plane. Specifically, it was TWA Flight 953 from Shannon, Ireland to New York, arriving 10:13AM on September 2nd, 1953 in New York.

That flight, incidentally, was on N6020C, a Lockheed Constellation L-749A that was just 2.5 years old at the time, and a little under 14 years later would serve TWA's very last passenger-carrying Constellation flight in April or May 1967. Why they have her listed as Sadena I don't know; her name was actually Star of Kentucky. That exact plane can be seen in the French-language film Escale a Orly (http://www.impdb.org/index.php?title=Escale_%C3%A0_Orly), and there are lots of photos of her on the web.

3
Dorset / Re: Lulworth Cove, O'GORMAN photos?
« on: Thursday 30 April 15 21:10 BST (UK)  »
I replied to this a little before you all yesterday on an older thread here:

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=478075.9

...but I figure that since this thread is active, I should copy the reply here too. Forum member aghadowey pointed out in that thread that:

Quote
There's a Christina O'Gorman in 1911 Irish census age 13-
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Waterford/Dungarvan_No__1_Urban/St__Mary_Street/663177/
parents are James and Mary O'Gorman and they have 11 children so it's possible that some of the children would have gone to stay with relatives
In 1901 the family are here with lots of other relatives-
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Waterford/Dungarvan_No__1/St__Mary_s_Street/1770907/

To which I replied:

Quote
I'm no genealogist -- not even a hobbyist -- but I spotted something that appeared to my uneducated eyes to fit your story well, so I'm sharing it.

aghadowey pointed out that there was a Christina O'Gorman in the 1911 Irish census, aged 13. That would put her date of birth around 1898.

Googling "Christina O'Gorman" and "1898" turns up the following page:

http://www.jeffseeley.org/familytrees/radmore/pafg04.htm

From which I'm pulling the excerpt below, in case the page goes offline:

Quote
44.   Robert Cecil Radmore (Samuel Ernest , Samuel , John ) was born on Sep 13 1895 in Hackney, County London, England. He died on Jan 08 1969 in New York, USA.

Robert married Mary Christina O'Gorman in 1925 in Elham District, County Kent, England. Mary was born about 1898 in Ireland. She died on Aug 04 1962 in New York, USA.

They had the following children:

+   65   M   i   Peter Michael Radmore
    66   F   ii   Living
                Living married John D. Foster. John was born on Oct 02 1914 in Tarboro, Edgecombe County, North Carolina, USA. He died on Jul 12 2002 in Chicago, Cook County, Illinois, USA.

Could it be that Christina was actually her middle name, and that her given name was Mary?

...to which I'll add that libertyellisfoundation.org has a Robert C. Radmore arriving from England in 1932 at the age of 36 on the Aquitania. That age is what you'd expect from his date of birth if he arrived pre-September 1932. An Ireland-born Mary Christina Radmore, meanwhile, arrives on the Olympic the same year, aged 34 (which again fits with an 1898 DOB).

And finally a Peter Michael Radmore, aged 4 (matching the age of their son at the time) also arrives in 1932, but on the Laconia. There are no other Radmores on the ship, but there are a Richard and Catherine O'Gorman, both Irish-born and aged 30 and 32 respectively. Peter Radmore was born in the USA (New York, specifically, matching the Liberty Ellis info), and died five years ago in Maine according to the info at jeffseeley.org.

There are a fair few strands there which would seem reasonable to fit together. There's a close match for the name that's apparently attached to these images; she's born in Ireland the same year as aghadowey suggested; her age would seem to fit with the tentative date of the photos; she married in Kent, only a few hours away from where the photos were taken; she then moved to the USA where a family was started (which we know at least some family members did at some point, as that matches original poster and relative Katie's current country).

Could the mysterious Christina have been a relative of Mervyn's born in Ireland, married in the UK, and then traveling back and forth between the UK and the US for a few years (including the trip on which her son was born), then the family finally moved there -- first the father, then the mother, and then finally the son perhaps traveling with relatives of his mother who also emigrated?

Of course, this could all be coincidence -- I'm the first to admit I'm a rank amateur who's out of my depth here -- but I'd love to see somebody with more experience chase these threads down.

4
Essex Completed Lookup Requests / Re: O'GORMAN MERVYN - looking 4 Christine & ?
« on: Wednesday 29 April 15 18:12 BST (UK)  »
I'm no genealogist -- not even a hobbyist -- but I spotted something that appeared to my uneducated eyes to fit your story well, so I'm sharing it.

aghadowey pointed out that there was a Christina O'Gorman in the 1911 Irish census, aged 13. That would put her date of birth around 1898.

Googling "Christina O'Gorman" and "1898" turns up the following page:

http://www.jeffseeley.org/familytrees/radmore/pafg04.htm

From which I'm pulling the excerpt below, in case the page goes offline:

Quote
44.   Robert Cecil Radmore (Samuel Ernest , Samuel , John ) was born on Sep 13 1895 in Hackney, County London, England. He died on Jan 08 1969 in New York, USA.

Robert married Mary Christina O'Gorman in 1925 in Elham District, County Kent, England. Mary was born about 1898 in Ireland. She died on Aug 04 1962 in New York, USA.

They had the following children:

+   65   M   i   Peter Michael Radmore
    66   F   ii   Living
                Living married John D. Foster. John was born on Oct 02 1914 in Tarboro, Edgecombe County, North Carolina, USA. He died on Jul 12 2002 in Chicago, Cook County, Illinois, USA.

Could it be that Christina was actually her middle name, and that her given name was Mary?

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