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Remember I said that a connection to Debroah Brettargh would have been a major development. The entry we all found for the marriage of Deboarah brettargh to John states that John's surname was Chandler, not Challinor. (Chaleneur). However, Mr Pinkwhistle and the rest of us maybe thought that could easily have been a mistake in translation. Often happens.

However, I've just found an entry that refers to the will of a Deborah Chandler in 1686:

"The will of his widow, Deborah Chandler, was dated and proved in 1686; she desired to be buried in the chancel of Childwall church next to the body of her late husband, James Brettargh. There are mentioned her daughters Hitchmough, Hanna, Phoebe Potter; her grandchildren, Thomas Brettargh, Edward and Phoebe Richardson, and Deborah, wife of Mordecai Cocker of Cockshead."

It would appear that James Brettargh was her first husband and that after his death, Deborah married John Chandler and became Deborah Chandler. You will note that a number of names are mentioned in the will and there is no mention of a Timothy Chandler. I cannot imagine that had he been her son and alive that she would have omitted him from her will. Looks like the kiss of death for Mr Pinkwhistle's proposed tree. Shame!!

Thank you Linda for the information sent.

However, there are still problems.

Mr Pinkwhistle had Timothy born in 1667 to John Chaleneur and Debra Brettargh. He also has Timothy as marrying a lady called Ann on 6 May 1703.

I now have no doubts that a Timothy Challinor, Yeoman, was the father of the John Challinor, who married Margaret Williams in 1717.

The problem is that I have now found a record of a Timothy Challinor baptised on 6 Dec 1666 in Huyton by Roby (very much Brettargh country) to a William Challinor. This William Challinor was baptised in Huyton by Roby on 29 Apr 1646.

There are at least two problems here. There is clearly at least one alternative father to the Timothy provided by Mr Pinkwhistle. The other problem is that we know John Challinor married Margaret Williams on 23 Apr 1717. If Mr Pinkwhistle is right and this John is the son of the Timothy Challinor, who married Ann in 1703, John would have aged 14 at best on his marriage to Margaret Williams.

Also , I don't think John would have received the Freedom of the city of Chester in 1721 at the tender age of 17 or 18. That doesn't make sense. As a barber (presumably a well respected one and possibly a wig maker as well), he would have had to have gone through his apprenticeship and trading independently before any such honour would be given.

Given the date of his marriage and the honour of Freeman, the earlier baptismal date of 1 Jan 1695 to father William would be much more likely., ie 22 when married, and 26/27, when he received the Freedom of the City and even that age would be good going to be honoured as a Freeman.

Again, we need Mr Pinkwhistle to confirm his sources.

Hi Linda,
Thanks for your message. I'm delighted that we've got some proof that Timothy is John's father. Can you post the link on this site?
As mentioned, we are trying to confirm the data supplied by Mr Pinkwhistle, who unfortunately has not responded to any of the concerns raised. Timothy was christened on 1 Jan 1695 at St Olave's, Chester.  Mr Pinkwhistle has John Chaloner and Debra as Timothy's parents. However, the John Chaleneur and Debra Brettargh to whom her refers were married on 23 Mar 1667. This is almost a thirty year gap between the marriage and the birth of Timothy (Debra appears to have been born on 8 Feb 1653 to father James Brettargh (1625 - 1665). This gap would make it most unlikely that she was the mother (she would have been aged 44 or 45 at the time of Timothy's birth). Not impossible, just unlikely.

However, as mentioned, if Deborah is Timothy's mother, this would be a most exciting development. I already have an outline tree taking Deborah back to the Brettarghs of Brettargh Holt, near Liverpool. This family goes back to the 13th/14th century with links to many other families.

As such, I am very keen to make sure that we get this link right and we really need Mr Pinkwhistle to confirm his sources.

I'd be grateful if someone could tell me the sources for their conclusion that Timothy Chalinor is John Challinor's father. This lead to Debra Brettorgh is an important one as her surname has been misread. It should be Brettargh. Her father is a James Brettargh and his family is easy to trace back to Elizabethan times. The Brettarghs are an old well established family from Little Woolton near Liverpool with roots well into the Middle Ages.