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Messages - Megatill

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1
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Tuesday 08 October 24 06:05 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: SarahU on Tuesday 08 October 24 05:10 BST (UK)
If she was alive,mWould she not have been in the 1841 census either in UK or australia?

There are no Census records for Tasmania in 1841, and there is no indication that Elizabeth Blacklock returned to the UK as she married and died in Tasmania; thus, she would not appear in the 1841 England Census.


Megan in Sydney
2024-10-08   1605hrs

2
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Saturday 21 September 24 23:56 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: Dave Francis on Saturday 21 September 24 18:26 BST (UK)
I'm not entirely sure that the Elizabeth Blacklock convicted on 11 May 1835 is the same person as the one convicted on 26 October 1835.

The defendant in the first case was said to be 17 years old at the time, but according the the original post above she should have been about age 21 (11 years old in 1825). Also, the Old Bailey Online page says that she was sentenced to six weeks in prison, but the case was also reported in at least four newspapers on 13 May 1835 and they all say the sentence was six months. If the actual sentence was six months, how could she have committed a further offence in September that year?

Incidentally, the Morning Advertiser (London) published on 15 Dec 1835 included a list of convicts who had removed from Newgate prison and transferred to the hulks at Woolwich, prior to transportation. Elizabeth Blacklock was included in that list and was said to be age 21.

EDIT: Just found another record confirming that the first sentence was indeed for only six weeks, not six months. (Can't believe the press!) If it was the same woman I can only assume she lied about her age hoping that she would get a light sentence. Seems to have worked!


Thanks for that insight, Dave, and I will take it under advisement...

Most of my data has come from the Convict Records, and especially from the Female Convict Research Center, which are usually "pretty reliable" but dependent on what has been told to them, and of course, the old "Chinese whispers" situation of "what they said is not necessarily what was recorded" always occurred.

Family anecdotes initiated this search and those family anecdotes appear to be supported by the Convict Records. The younger Sarah was convicted twice, the elder Sarah only once.

For the moment, I will continue as is.

Thank you for the research!


Megan in Sydney
2024-09-22   0856hrs

3
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Sunday 15 September 24 04:59 BST (UK)  »
Barb's suggestion of the Tasmanian Female Convicts Research Center did show both Elizabeth Blacklocks (mother and daughter) but no information on daughter Elizabeth doing anything noteworthy before her apprehension early in 1835 and her subsequent conviction and sentencing to 7 years Transportation later in 1835.


However, there was an indication of Service for daughter Elizabeth, so that is now my hypothesis; when Elizabeth the mother was transported in 1825, when daughter Elizabeth was 11 years old, Elizabeth the daughter found domestic (or some other) service to survive.

Thank you, everyone!!! A fascinating journey!


Megan in Sydney
2024-09-15   1359hrs

4
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Sunday 15 September 24 00:58 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: BarbW on Saturday 14 September 24 16:59 BST (UK)
Have you contacted the Female Convicts Research Centre in Tasmania (Van Diemens Land). I did some research with them years ago and the convict registers were very detailed in some cases, some not so much. 

femaleconvicts.org.au

Barb - that is such a good idea - I completely forgot about the FCRC!!!!   I'll get onto that today!

Thank you!

Megan in Sydney
2024-09-15  0958am

5
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Saturday 14 September 24 13:27 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: bearkat on Saturday 14 September 24 11:19 BST (UK)
The survival of workhouse records can be patchy but there are some online.  See

https://www.workhouses.org.uk/records/

Thanks (and Hi! again) Bearcat

Tried the Workhouse records - found father William Blacklock in London Workhouse at age 11, and again aged 36 where he died, but no other Blacklocks I can attach to William's family.

I'm now thinking that Elizabeth the Daughter must have entered service, in some manner.


Megan in Sydney
2024-09-14  2227hrs

6
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Saturday 14 September 24 09:09 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: Neale1961 on Saturday 14 September 24 08:32 BST (UK)
I see Elizabeth junior had a former conviction for much the same offence.

ADDED
Her 2 convictions here. The first one was stealing from Mr. King. The second one got her sentenced to transportation
https://www.oldbaileyonline.org/search/name?given_name=elizabeth&surname=Blacklock&text=ELIZABETH%20BLACKLOCK&year_gte=1830&year_lte=1836#results

Correct.  But in the same year.

There is the interval between 1824-25 when Elizabeth the Mother was transported up to 1835 when Elizabeth the Daughter was transported...   I am hoping for an entry in to a Workhouse or another fluke in finding employers... maybe some one else has that answer!


Megan in Sydney
2024-09-14 -  1809hrs

7
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Saturday 14 September 24 08:22 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: Neale1961 on Saturday 14 September 24 07:59 BST (UK)
It will be difficult to know with certainty what happened to Elizabeth Junior.
Grandparents or other close relatives may have been there to help her for a while. As Maddy suggests, the workhouse was also an option.
She would have been old enough to go into domestic service or agricultural labour (depending where she lived). Some kind of service would be my guess, but as this is pre-census, one can’t know for sure.
Elizabeth Junior’s criminal records may shed some light on where she was living and how and if employed.


Thanks, Neale,

Elizabeth the Daughter's Convict Records report that mum Elizabeth was convicted and Transported (which which is how I found Mummy) but nothing else. She, too, like her mum, was tried at the Old Bailey, and the excerpt states (in summary) she was ELIZABETH BLACKLOCK. Theft; stealing from master. 11th May 1835.

The "Master" was HENRY WILLIAM KING, a journeyman bookbinder, who lived in John-street, Spitalfields. "The prisoner came into my service on the 3rd of April, as a weekly servant...".

Nothing that occurred before that event except her birth year 1814.
The reference to her mum was in the Tassie Convict Records, so once she arrived in VDL, and not before during her trial.


Megan in Sydney
2024-09-14   1722hrs

8
The Common Room / Re: What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Saturday 14 September 24 07:48 BST (UK)  »
Quote from: maddys52 on Saturday 14 September 24 07:20 BST (UK)
I could be wrong, but I would assume the 11 year old Elizabeth would be placed in a workhouse or institution for orphans. See this familysearch wiki, though it doesn't specifically mention children of transported convicts.
https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/England_Orphans_and_Foundlings_-_International_Institute

Certainly some children did accompany their mothers if sentenced to transportation, but if your Elizabeth is later convicted in England, I would think it very unlikely she went with her mother and then returned to England.




I agree with your reasoning, but I did need confirmation of my hypothesis - I guess the next question would be where would I find Workhouse records?

Elizabeth the daughter was born in Smithfield, and the deceased siblings born, baptised and buried in St Andrews Holborn.  I would assume these two areas would be the top of the list of Workhouses?

Megan in Sydney   

2024-09-14   1648hrs


9
The Common Room / What happened to the children of people transported to Australia around 1825
« on: Saturday 14 September 24 06:46 BST (UK)  »
Hi Everyone - don't know which category to use so thought maybe "General" would fit the bill.

My question is hard to verbalise: I have a mother-daughter situation where the mother Elizabeth is convicted 1n 1825 in the Old Bailey to 7 years transportation to Australia. Elizabeth's daughter - also Elizabeth! - was 11 years old at the time of her mother's conviction and transportation. Husband and Father William died in 1824, and while there were siblings - both Mary Ann and John had died by 1824.

To make matters more confusing, or maybe are the clarifying points, daughter Elizabeth was convicted in 1835 and transported to VDL (Van Diemans Land now Tasmania).

Some say the children travelled with the convicted parent, but this may not be the case for Elizabeth the mother and Elizabeth the daughter especially if Elizabeth the daughter is also transported 10 years after her mother. Also - no mention of Elizabeth the daughter is made against Elizabeth the mother in the Convict registers from 1825 onwards...

For Elizabeth the daughter to be transported in 1835, and she **had** been transported with her mother in 1825, then she would have had to have had made her way back to London to be caught, convicted and sentenced herself.

So - what would have, or could have, happened to Elizabeth the daughter between 1824 and 1835?

Thanks for reading!

Megan in Sydney  2024-09-14   1546hrs

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