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Messages - colfi

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1
World War One / Re: Military Medal recipients
« on: Tuesday 28 July 15 01:21 BST (UK)  »
Be aware, the Kew Records office holds very few WW1 war diaries, most were retained by the Regiments (fortunately) the archived ones from WW1 were mostly destroyed in the WW2 Blitz. Kew Records are still trying to sort out a lot of the partially burnt paperwork. Try the Regiment's museum.

I had a similar case with my Father (RFA), he was given a Mention in Despatches at Mons, 1914 and the MM in 1916, yet I could find no mention of the MM apart from the medal cards held at Kew. I did find out that a lot of MM's, earlier than March 1916 (when the MM was first announced) were back dated ones given to some M.I.D recipients later in the war. This may account for the 1918 issue dated 1915. If this was the case then the M.I.D was withdrawn and wouldn't show on the Kew medals cards.

I eventually (luckily last year) found the war diaries at the Royal Artillay museum in Woolwich London. They were on loan to the Museum and had details of the engagements for my Father's M.I.D and MM. As has been said, citations for the MM were given to the receiver but not recorded outside of the diaries.

I was fortunate to find my Father's battery Commander's, Brigade Commander's and the Regimental diaries for the 1914 to 1917 period and all three had full details of him in them. Good luck with the search.

Col

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World War One / Re: How do i fine more info on 'Mentioned in Despatches'
« on: Tuesday 01 April 14 23:14 BST (UK)  »
Hi Barbara

If he was at the Woolwich Barracks in London, you may be in luck. Most of their records went to Oxford during WW2 and missed the Blitz, they are now in the Artillary Museum Library situated next to the Woolwich Ferry on the Thames at Woolwich.

The Library readily answers emails and do not charge a specific cost, just ask for a donation towards the Museum.

The  hold a lot of various War Diaries that Kew do not have. I am visiting there in June (from Tasmania) to get further knowledge of my father (27th Brigade RFA) He was M.I.D in 1914 and awarded the MM in 1916, whilst I have the M.I.D details, the MM details are elusive, he may have been a back-dated one. Hopefully the 1914-1917 War Diaries at Woolwich will tell me. good luck.

Col

3
World War One / Re: How do i fine more info on 'Mentioned in Despatches'
« on: Tuesday 01 April 14 03:30 BST (UK)  »
Alternatively try the Kew records office for the War Diaries of his unit, I originally got my answers there, the book came later.
Col

4
World War One / Re: How do i fine more info on 'Mentioned in Despatches'
« on: Tuesday 01 April 14 03:24 BST (UK)  »
Hi Barbara

My Father was 'M.I.Ds" in 1914 by Sir John French, at the end of WW1 a book was publiched that showed all of French's despatches, only 500 were printed, the imperial war museum in London has a copy, they may have a copy of such a book showing Haig's Despatches, worth a try. I was allowed to copy the French Despatch book, so if anyone has Qs on Sir John French's despatches
 1914 to Nov 1916, I can send a copy, gratis, email (*)

(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy, to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.

5
World War One / Re: Military Medal recipients
« on: Thursday 20 February 14 22:37 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Jess

Yes, you have it right, the standard war medals awarded are kept on one micro-fiche/card ( now, I believe, on the data base) and this card is marked with abreviations as to further awards, ie: the MM. My Fathers Micro-fiche had MM* in a small section to the right of the list of his normal WW1 medals awarded. I then went to the MM micro-fiche and confirmed his MM awards. There were just dates of the awards there. I am still searching Diaries for some idea as to why he was awarded the MM, no luck to date though.

Unlike a lot of MM awards, his were gazetted in the Edinburgh gazette of 3 Oct 1916 and 27 Oct 1916, and I could find no mention of them in any of the London Gazette.

He was in the RFA (Royal Field Artillary) and enlisted in Oxford in 1913.

Col

6
World War One / Re: Military Medal recipients
« on: Wednesday 19 February 14 22:25 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Vicky

I have the same problems with my Father's citation(s) He was a Driver in the RFA (Royal Field Artillary) Thankfully, their records were mostly stored out of London during WW2 so the blitz didn't burn them.

The Artillary Museum at Woolwich, London have the Battalion and Brigades diaries for 1914 to 1917, I am hoping to find some mention of his Citations in them when I visit London in June, hopefully the rain will be gone by then. I am in Tasmania Australia, so all my research has to be done at a distance.

Keep searching, you may get lucky.

Col

7
World War One / Re: Military Medal recipients
« on: Monday 17 February 14 02:50 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Vicky

His Regimental number should direct you straight to him, if you have the medals or an index card copy it's on there, also try the RAF diaries after April 1918 ( when the RAF was officially formed), it may have been a late war award. you can also try his battalion Musuem, (if they have one) most Regiments do, the museums keep a lot of the war diaries in their libraries. That is how I found the information that I needed. Good luck either way. and the librarians only ask for a donation not an arm and a leg fee. :)

Col

8
World War One / Re: Military Medal recipients
« on: Sunday 16 February 14 23:07 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Vicky
Like you, my Father's MM, his first award of the MM, was mentioned in the Edinburgh gazette in 3 Oct 1916, not the London gazette, yet the London gazette of 27 Oct 1916 and the Kew Records Office had recorded an award of the MM. I always assumed the two mentions were for the one award.( the bar is missing from his MM) However, it was much, much later I found the first award (Edinburg gazette) was a backdated award to 1914, given at the retreat from Mons, this one was gazetted but not on the Medals records cards. His second award was at the Somme and gazetted in the London Gazette and is on the medal cards at Kew Records Office, The cards show a small 'mm' to one side of the medals awarded and there is a seperate set of cards for the MMs. Maybe he was a backdated award, who knows??

9
World War One / Re: Military Medal recipients
« on: Saturday 15 February 14 06:30 GMT (UK)  »
Hi All
I am new to your forum and I have read the posts above and find a lot of assumptions and incorrect info in them.

My father was awarded the MM and also the bar (second award) in 1914 in the retreat from Mons he was Mentioned in Despatches, in July 1916 he was awarded the MM, backdated to 1914. He was then awarded the Bar to the medal in September 1916, he was a member of the RFA both times. As far as his 'Citation' goes, this was usually given to the recipient at the time the medal was given, copies were rarely kept (Kew Records Office)  In my father's case the M.I.D is mentioned in Sir John French's book of Despatches, printed in 1919, which I, luckily have a copy, however, there is no record in the battery, Brigade or Battalion diaries of his awards.

My last avenue to find details of why he was issued the Bar is the Artillary Museum at Woolwich London who have two  27th Brigade Diaries for the period 1914 to 1917, there might just be a mention there.

And, the MM was never issued to Officers and only rarely to Warrant Officers, as implied by a post early in this thread.

The MM and rations comment should be taken like the rations, with a pinch of salt, if you read the M.I.D despatch of my father's he had rifle fire at 100 yards and MG fire at 200 yards whilst he and another Driver hauled the gun out of it's trench and got it back to the retreated lines in good order. The Battery Officer and other men had long retreated with the breech block some time before, so they really were issued for Bravery In the Field.

If anyone wants a copy of a Despatch during the Aug 1914 to Nov 1916 period, email me and I will gladly supply it, they make for interesting reading, just supply the approximate date and the name please. colfi1@bigpond.com

keep well all.

Col

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