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Midlothian / Re: Harvieston
« on: Saturday 18 May 13 19:07 BST (UK) »
The TC may refer to Thomas Cranstoun who died in 1848?
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Midlothian / Re: Harvieston
« on: Saturday 18 May 13 18:18 BST (UK) »
Now place-names, not wishing to ruffle any feathers, here concerning the meaning of Harvieston, it seems most likely that rather than it being "a market," as one contributor stated the place-name, "Harvieston" is simply derived from a possessive and a personal name. Thus:
Hervie + tun.
Hervie's tun.
I retrieved this information from an unpublished PH.d thesis that sat upon the shelves of the School of Scottish studies at Edinburgh University and which I consulted whist an undergraduate in my final year at Uni whilst living at Harvieston. Here's the source:
"The place names of Midlothian"
Norman Dixon.
1947.
(If anybody wishes to consult Dixon's work it is available to download as a fully searchable pdf here).
http://www.spns.org.uk/PNsMIDLOTHIANv3.pdf
Note: The earliest recorded entry for the pn. is 13th Century and is recorded in the Bannatyne Club which was founded by Sir Walter Scott, to print rare works of Scottish interest. Though nowadays one is cautioned against using the Bann CL as a primary source. Second reference is in the Calendar of Charters contained in H.M. General Register House, Edinburgh. 13 vols. 1142-1591. On page 51, Dixon deals with the pn. Here's what Dixon wrote:
"HARVIESTON
Herviistun 13 th Cent. Bann. Cl. 69.
Herwyngistoun 1354 Reg.Ho.Ch.
Heruystone 1336-7 Bain.
Herviston 1354 Reg.Ho.Ch.
Hervi(e)stoun 1449 Bann. Cl. 109 1517 1537 1544 RSS 1627 R on P. 1656 RMS.
Harv(i)(e)stoun 1510 RSS 1773 Arm.
Harwestoun 1614 LC.
‘Hervey’s farm’ v. t
ū
n; Hervey is a M.E. surname.
Note
: Harvieston had three pendicles, now lost, mentioned in 1627 R on P:
Bogend is
Boigend v. Gael. now Scots bog OE ende;
Mochhollie is thus
; probably ‘moth-eaten (place)’ or ‘maggot-ridden field’ v. Scots moch SDD 363 ‘moth, maggot’
hollie SDD 268 adj. ‘having holes, holed’; cf. moch-eaten SDD 363; Feidlaw is thus;
probably ‘small field’ v. Scots feedlie SDD 16"
I hope this helps and is of interest. The upshot of these place name references and dates is that we can track settlement here for a very long time. An older house could indeed too have stood upon the site of the current property with a settlement cluster and a big hoose growing up around it. Though this is speculation.
Best Wishes to you all.
Hervie + tun.
Hervie's tun.
I retrieved this information from an unpublished PH.d thesis that sat upon the shelves of the School of Scottish studies at Edinburgh University and which I consulted whist an undergraduate in my final year at Uni whilst living at Harvieston. Here's the source:
"The place names of Midlothian"
Norman Dixon.
1947.
(If anybody wishes to consult Dixon's work it is available to download as a fully searchable pdf here).
http://www.spns.org.uk/PNsMIDLOTHIANv3.pdf
Note: The earliest recorded entry for the pn. is 13th Century and is recorded in the Bannatyne Club which was founded by Sir Walter Scott, to print rare works of Scottish interest. Though nowadays one is cautioned against using the Bann CL as a primary source. Second reference is in the Calendar of Charters contained in H.M. General Register House, Edinburgh. 13 vols. 1142-1591. On page 51, Dixon deals with the pn. Here's what Dixon wrote:
"HARVIESTON
Herviistun 13 th Cent. Bann. Cl. 69.
Herwyngistoun 1354 Reg.Ho.Ch.
Heruystone 1336-7 Bain.
Herviston 1354 Reg.Ho.Ch.
Hervi(e)stoun 1449 Bann. Cl. 109 1517 1537 1544 RSS 1627 R on P. 1656 RMS.
Harv(i)(e)stoun 1510 RSS 1773 Arm.
Harwestoun 1614 LC.
‘Hervey’s farm’ v. t
ū
n; Hervey is a M.E. surname.
Note
: Harvieston had three pendicles, now lost, mentioned in 1627 R on P:
Bogend is
Boigend v. Gael. now Scots bog OE ende;
Mochhollie is thus
; probably ‘moth-eaten (place)’ or ‘maggot-ridden field’ v. Scots moch SDD 363 ‘moth, maggot’
hollie SDD 268 adj. ‘having holes, holed’; cf. moch-eaten SDD 363; Feidlaw is thus;
probably ‘small field’ v. Scots feedlie SDD 16"
I hope this helps and is of interest. The upshot of these place name references and dates is that we can track settlement here for a very long time. An older house could indeed too have stood upon the site of the current property with a settlement cluster and a big hoose growing up around it. Though this is speculation.
Best Wishes to you all.
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Midlothian / Re: Harvieston
« on: Saturday 18 May 13 18:05 BST (UK) »
Hi, newb here. Stayed up at Harvieston house for many years in the top of the house (yes with the water tank) and had something of an interest in the history of the place whilst there. From my reading about it, the place once had quite extensive grounds. Something like 100 acres in fact were at one time laid out. They were modelled (as was the fashion in the 18th Century) upon the idea of a Grecian Arcadia. In fact at one point in the course of the Gore river, down from the weir but heading into sunny Gorebrig on the Harvieston side of it, there were carved stone statues. Presumably of gods or who knows? These were held in a stone niche. Whilst the statuary has long since gone (tumbled into the river possibly?) the niche was still to be found. At least in 2001 or something when I lived up there.
I did have extensive notes on Harvieston but have since lost them. I only have vague memories now. Possibly George Cranstoun? stated in reference to the vast amount of money he had spent upon landscaping,"that he may as well have covered the grounds in banknotes." Architecturally the house is interesting. I have a scan from a photocopy from a book called:
The Castles and Mansions of the Lothians. J. Small. 1883.
Published by J. Paterson,
Edinburgh.
Forgive the quality of the picture, it is just off a photocopy. The original is much better! But it clearly shows some development of the house. Perhaps the oldest part of the house (born out by the thickness of walls) is where the entrance now is. Not the formal entrance but around the side. The first thing that is noticeable is that the line of the approach to the drive has changed. There is an absence of castellations or battlement-type crenellated features. A stone relief-type carving of a crane can be seen today. It commemorates a date. "1901". Thus dating the castellations to then. The crane motif is a, "Cranstoun" emblem. I cannot now recall exactly how the family name of, "Cranstoun" came to be associated with "Trotter." This may help:
http://www.ancestor-links.com/chart_images/Family-Links-Broomhouse-Chirnside-Bridge-Mills.htm
Above the exterior of one of the windows where the Dormitorium II kitchen is at the front upon the first floor, there is a carved monogram of, "TC." I believe (but am not certain of this) that the owners before the days of the Temperance hotel in the twenties moved to South Africa. This was following the loss of close family members during the First World War. Curiously the place-name, "Harvieston" can also be found in Zimbabwe which may bear this out. There is a modest dwelling house also called, "Harvieston" in Elie, Fife! I cannot believe that this anything but the MLO place-name of the Harvieston estate growing some legs.
I think internally it would take a genuine house detective to work out all stages of development. As any ex Harviestonian knows - the place is a bit of a rambling warren. Going up the turnpike spiral stairs in the dark was a very scary and disorientating experience during power cuts.
The crows steps upon the gable end of the roof of the house were added in 1869. Again, I don't have a source and quote, it is just my memory from the book. Around 1900 the gardens at Harvieston had got themselves a good reputation for being well kept. Again, sorry no source. Different book.
Best Wishes to you all!
Chris.
I did have extensive notes on Harvieston but have since lost them. I only have vague memories now. Possibly George Cranstoun? stated in reference to the vast amount of money he had spent upon landscaping,"that he may as well have covered the grounds in banknotes." Architecturally the house is interesting. I have a scan from a photocopy from a book called:
The Castles and Mansions of the Lothians. J. Small. 1883.
Published by J. Paterson,
Edinburgh.
Forgive the quality of the picture, it is just off a photocopy. The original is much better! But it clearly shows some development of the house. Perhaps the oldest part of the house (born out by the thickness of walls) is where the entrance now is. Not the formal entrance but around the side. The first thing that is noticeable is that the line of the approach to the drive has changed. There is an absence of castellations or battlement-type crenellated features. A stone relief-type carving of a crane can be seen today. It commemorates a date. "1901". Thus dating the castellations to then. The crane motif is a, "Cranstoun" emblem. I cannot now recall exactly how the family name of, "Cranstoun" came to be associated with "Trotter." This may help:
http://www.ancestor-links.com/chart_images/Family-Links-Broomhouse-Chirnside-Bridge-Mills.htm
Above the exterior of one of the windows where the Dormitorium II kitchen is at the front upon the first floor, there is a carved monogram of, "TC." I believe (but am not certain of this) that the owners before the days of the Temperance hotel in the twenties moved to South Africa. This was following the loss of close family members during the First World War. Curiously the place-name, "Harvieston" can also be found in Zimbabwe which may bear this out. There is a modest dwelling house also called, "Harvieston" in Elie, Fife! I cannot believe that this anything but the MLO place-name of the Harvieston estate growing some legs.
I think internally it would take a genuine house detective to work out all stages of development. As any ex Harviestonian knows - the place is a bit of a rambling warren. Going up the turnpike spiral stairs in the dark was a very scary and disorientating experience during power cuts.
The crows steps upon the gable end of the roof of the house were added in 1869. Again, I don't have a source and quote, it is just my memory from the book. Around 1900 the gardens at Harvieston had got themselves a good reputation for being well kept. Again, sorry no source. Different book.
Best Wishes to you all!
Chris.
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