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Messages - AirtinHame

Pages: [1] 2
1
Ireland / Re: Tweedie
« on: Friday 20 June 14 14:30 BST (UK)  »
Thanks for that speed response. I have sent KatC a private message in the hope that she can shed further light. Based on the evidence you have produced, however, I am more inclined to favour the view that she is a Pendleton and this line have, therefore nothing to do with the Pentlands. It also has me wondering about other Pendleton/Pentland families in the area.

2
Ireland / Re: Tweedie
« on: Friday 20 June 14 08:14 BST (UK)  »
I suspect a common mistake is to assume that all Pendletons were once Pentletons and therefore originally Pentlands. Your research appears to be proving that Martha was either a Pendleton or a Patterson. The whole premise that she was a Pentland seems to be based on the claim that a marriage record exists for 1823 in Donacloney. Tracing this claim back I find it was made by a contributor to Wikitree to whom I have now written asking for the source of the information. In their search for Pentland families I suspect that more than translation from Pendleton to Pentland  has been made due to over enthusiasm on the part of researchers.

If Martha's name was Pentland rather than Pendleton and the error was misinterpretation of a verbal report of her name then one might expect the error to be corrected in Scotland where Pentland is a more common name than Pendleton. The latter name has its roots in England and a further clue may lie in the townland of Moyallon or Moyallan which was granted to a colony of the Society of Friends from England in 1685. Unfortunately there are no extant tithe records for the area so the first comprehensive survey is almost two hundred years later by which time there were no Pentlands, Pentletons or Pendletons in Moyallan. GRanted that is a survey of property owners so not comprehensive but it is all we have.

It may be worth noting the distribution of the three names in Co. Down in the Primary Valuation. All of the Pentlands were in Donaghadee, all of the Pendletons in Tullylish and the Pentletons were in Kilmore. There is evidence which suggests Pentlands in Kilmore were descended from a very old Pentland line in counties Louth and Meath so it is reasonable to suspect that the Pentletons are part of that family. Donaghadee was the main port of entry from Scotland with, inevitably, a strong Scottish contingent.

It would be interesting to know if Pendletons appear in clusters and whether these clusters coincide with clusters of Pentletons. One must ask whether later Pendletons became so as a result of a mutation of their name from Pentland through Pentleton or whether the opposite was the case.

3
Ireland / Re: Tweedie
« on: Wednesday 14 May 14 07:54 BST (UK)  »
Jane Tweedy married John Jack in 1897 and had two daughters; Janet and Mary; John died, so far as I have discovered, unmarried in 1938; William, also unmarried in 1922; Robert married Mary McMillan in 1910 and they produced at least five children; David is said to have married Mary Hood but I have found no evidence of this on SP, he died in 1939; Thomas died age ten, Alexander age twenty and James age two.


"David Tweedie born about 1845 in Ireland. First appearance in Glasgow is in a marriage record where he married Ann Robertson, also from Ireland, in 1876. He was a Brickfield Labourer and his parents are listed as John Tweedie, agricultural labourer and Martha Pendleton (I don't think they came to Glasgow as there are no records on ScotlandsPeople for them). He was a Presbyterian. He died on 18 Aug 1906.

Here's my guess; I think that he and Ann Robertson came from the same part of Ireland and arrived in Glasgow together to get married and start a new life. There are other Robertsons as witnesses on the Marriage Record so it looks like other members of her family went with them."

There are births listed for that couple:
Jane Tweedie, b. 24 may 1877, Glasgow
John Tweedie, b. 16 nov 1878, Glasgow
William Tweedie, b. 2 jun 1880
Robert Tweedie, b. 1 jun 1882
David Tweedie, b. 1 jul 1884, Glasgow
Thomas Tweedie, b. 7 may 1886, Glasgow
Alexander Tweedie, b. 24 may 1888, Glasgow
James Tweedie, b. 17 sep 1890, Glasgow

Also there are two brothers listed for David Tweedy, b. 1843:
Thomas Tweedy
William Tweedy

4
Ireland / Re: Tweedie
« on: Wednesday 14 May 14 07:45 BST (UK)  »
A word of caution; not all Pendletons are Pentlands. It is certainly true that there are examples of people with proved Pentland connections recorded with the name Pendleton or Pentleton but one example given below, Philip Pendleton of Meath and Dublin can be traced back to an ancient Pendleton family in England. He can easily mislead the unwary since his home was at Blackhall, Termonfeckin, indeed he may even have built the house. So far, however, evidence suggests that his only connection with the Pentland family was that he sold them Blackhall.

Pendleton deaths;

Henry L Pendleton; 12/5/1854 (18)
Beechworth Australia
Eldest son of Captain H L Pendleton
----
Samuel Pendleton (Derry); 1836 Hardwicke st Dublin
---
Rev.Edmund Charles; 1846
Dunmanaway Cork
--
Anna Maria Pendleton; 1841
Upper Leeson st Dublin
dtr of late Philip
-----
Chars-Henrietta are listed in Brian Cantwells Memorials of the Dead
=======
Passenger lists;
Capt Pendleton; 1859
Ship; Breman
Sail date; 9/7/1859
Southampton
from; New York
Arrived; 23/7/1859
Master; Wessells H
----
William Pendleton;  (34)
3rd class
Married
Miner
Ship; United Kingdom
from; New York
to; Glasgow
Arrived; 14/10/1865
Master; Munro Robert D
======
Jack

5
Westmeath / Re: Michael Lynch and Margaret Brady m 1876 Mullingar
« on: Monday 05 May 14 10:31 BST (UK)  »
I may ahve other information which will help your search. This link http://boards.ancestry.co.uk/boardinfo.aspx?p=surnames.pentland will give you my email address. Drop me a line and we can see how else I can help.

6
Westmeath / Re: Michael Lynch and Margaret Brady m1876 Mullingar
« on: Monday 05 May 14 08:26 BST (UK)  »
Unfortunately, the name confusion does not surprise me. The problem it produces is that she may have been either a Pentland or a Pendleton and they are not necessarily the same family. There is the added confusion that Pentleton, Pentelton and Pendelton are all used interchangeably by clerks. Some search engines pick up Pendleton/Pentleton/Pedelton/Pentelton in a single search, others do not and very few see any of them as an alternative to Pentland.

I am not quite clear on what you men by "the American connection". Is there some proof that Mary Pentland, daughter of Henry and Julia emigrated? Or have I missed the point completely and are you tying to establish a connection from the USA back to Ireland?

7
Westmeath / Re: Michael Lynch and Margaret Brady m1876 Mullingar
« on: Friday 02 May 14 12:04 BST (UK)  »
It appears to me that the Mary who married John Lynch was the daughter of Henry Pentland and his wife Julia. There is a civil marriage entry (Register of Births, Deaths and Marriages Ireland, Dublin South Marriages V2 #628 Jul - Sep 1899. John Lynch & Mary Bridget Pentland.) and also the RC record from St Mary's, Haddington Road, which would confirms her parentage.

On the family search website there are five user submitted genealogies (http://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.2.1/33N5-7SL), all of which appear to mirror each other but
try to shoehorn the facts into the scenario in which Matthew Pentland is Mary's father which we have now disproved. It does, however also give specific dates and places for John Lynch's birth and death. Clearly 24 July 2014 is an error for his birth but Rathganny, Westmeath, Ireland seems too specific to have been imagined and his death in 1934 in Dublin Ireland points to possibilities for further information on his parentage from civil records.

The difficulty with Henry Pentland and his wife Julia is that they were, if the marriage record is accurate in tense, living in Athboy in 1899 but there are no Pentlands in Athboy in 1901. there is an alternative spelling for Pentland, Pentleton which produces a result in 1901: Mary Cassidy, widow of George Pentleton and her son George but over the three generations of the family I have identified in Athboy there was no use of the forename Henry.

There is also some evidence of Pentlands and Pentletons being recorded as Pendleton and there is one Henry Pendleton recorded in the Tithe Applotments in 1830 a Lower Drumgill, Meath. More than that I have yet to find but will come back to you if I have any success.


8
Westmeath / Re: Michael Lynch and Margaret Brady m1876 Mullingar
« on: Thursday 01 May 14 11:30 BST (UK)  »
There are three problems with that conclusion:

1. At the time these events occurred divorce was not available in Ireland. If Matthew Pentland remarried while his first wife was alive he had either obtained a papal annulment, most unlikely since there as a child of the marriage, or he committed bigamy.

2. When Matthew married Charlotte Carr his marital condition was clearly stated as widowed.

3. There is clear evidence from the 1901 and 1911 censuses that Matthew Pentland's and Bridget Dougherty's daughter Mary was in Wales, then England with her aunt. Her aunt then dealt with her estate and the probate records confirm's Mary's death in 1935.

I am quite prepared to provide you with copies of any of the documents which you cannot access if that would help.

The Bridget Dougherty found in the USA is clearly someone completely unconnected with this family and if it would be of assistance I am quite prepared to look at the evidence from the USA and try to identify her connection to Ireland.

9
Westmeath / Re: Michael Lynch and Margaret Brady m1876 Mullingar
« on: Wednesday 30 April 14 06:04 BST (UK)  »
Roman Catholic Church records for St. Andrew's parish show the marriage of Matthew Pentland of 16 Crompton Court; father John Pentland, mother Bridget of 16 Crampton Road and Bridget Dougherty of 21 Anglesea St; father Christopher Dougherty, mother Mary on 7 November 1880.
church of Ireland.

The marriage of Matthew Pentland Full age, House Painter Widower of 23 Nassau Street Dublin; father John Pentland, House Painter and Charlotte Kerr Full age, Spinster, father Isaac Kerr, Steward of 24 Upper Fitzwilliam Street Dublin took place on 10 November 1883 in Dublin at St. Anne's Church of Ireland.

There then follow five children#s baptisms between 1885 and 1891. The younger died first, in 1893 followed by her mother in 1899. The two girls, Matilda and Isabella were recorded as CoI in the orphanage in 1901 but with their father marrying first in the RC then CoI church I do not see what you mean by "wrong religion". No further trace has ben found of them. Matthew jnr. was resident on the cripples' home in Bray in 1901 and died there a few years later. Of John Joseph, the eldest son no trace has been found beyond his baptism. Bridget Catherine died in Dublin, a spinster, in 1958.

It is usual logical that the daughter of the first marriage would be brought up by her grandparents. This was common practice in both Scotland and Ireland well into the twentieth century. I do not see, however, where Athboy comes into the picture. As I mentioned before there were Pentlands there well into the nineteenth century but Matthew Pentland was son of John Pentland and Bridget Smith who lived in Dublin. They also had a daughter Julia who married Ernest Wilson in Surrey in 1890 and appears with him in the following three censuses. In the 1901 and 1911 censuses their niece Mary Pentland is living with them; she died a spinster in 1935 in Liverpool.

Unless Matthew Pentland lied about his marital status in 1883 the Bridget Dougherty who emigrated to the USA cannot have been his wife. All I have found for MAry Pentland's birth is the civil record but not all Dublin church records surive and even fewer have been indexed on-line.

Roman Catholic Church records for St. Mary, Haddington Road, Dublin show the marriage of Joannes Lynch, 1 Malachy Place, Father Michaelis Lynch, Mother Margarita to Maria Pentland, 1 St Mary's Rd, Father  Henricus Pentland, Mother Julia, residence Athboy on 24 September 1899; Priest Hen J Lube; Witnesses Elizabetha Greene & Gulielmus Walker.

This could be where the Athboy connection comes from. It is perfectly reasonable for John Lynch's wife to have been raised in Athboy since her parent's lived there and to have gone into service in her teens, perhaps long before she was sixteen but it is very doubtful that a child in her early to mid teens would have been given the responsibility of a nursery nurse or nanny, they were usually older. It would be most interesting to know the original source of this information.

From this analysis it appears there were two Mary Pentlands in Dublin during the relevant period. One never married and her age was correctly recorded in the 19-1 and 1911 censuses as 23 and 33. The second Mary did not marry and her age was also recorded correctly as 19 and 29 in the 1901 and 1911 censuses.

The Bridget Dougherty found in the USA no doubt existed although I have insufficient information to track her in censuses. What seems clear is that she was not the first wife of Matthew Pentland nor was she the mother of John Lynch's wife.

I hope this information helps you to sort out your mystery and thank you for helping concentrate my mind as it this review has sorted out two families who were giving me problems. All I have to do now is work out who Henry Penltand of Athboy was!

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