RootsChat.Com

Oh, well done, Daithi!

Now all I need is to find out what our Fred did in Worthing!

Edit: apparently he was a tea planter

"A Fred J and Nora C England (aged 41 and 27) appear on the passenger lists on Ancestry traveling from Ceylon (Sri Lanka) to Hull in 1930. Fred is recorded as a planter with an address at Park Villa, Chaucer Road, Ashford, Middlesex."

Further news: Here http://www.historyofceylontea.com/Estates/view/1429 there's a reference to FJ England in Ceylon as an employee of KATUGASTOTA tea plantation - the same name I'd previously seen in relation to the Owston family (as a house name - growing up in Dun Laoghaire I often saw houses with exotic Indian names, which were called after Indian and Ceylonese and Afghani places their owners had served in).

And more places this FJ England managed http://www.historyofceylontea.com/Users/view/11113745

Oh, well found! This looks good; and if his two brothers had 'J' as a middle initial, which looks likely, then perhaps Frederick Joseph is our boy.

I was feeling rather sad for Richard; Ashdale Avenue is a definite step down in the world from Palmerston Road:

https://www.google.ie/maps/place/Ashdale+Ave,+Terenure,+Dublin/@53.3143479,-6.2840934,3a,90y,18h,90t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sTNuqXOQHJhhU6q5CWyo8iw!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x48670c0a4aa1a55f:0x530148152982be3c!6m1!1e1

- not that this necessarily means that he was any less happy, obv.

The first two Frederick Joseph Englands seem to be different records:

GS Film number: 101576 , Digital Folder Number: 004199368 , Image Number: 00130
GS Film number: 101576 , Digital Folder Number: 004199368 , Image Number: 00104

(or maybe not; everything except the image number is the same). However, I can't see how to get a wife off this record; I used to be able to do this, but either the site has changed or I've forgotten.

Oho, and a bit of a newspaper ad from a Winnipeg paper that I can't read without signing up to some plutocratic site:

"Nora Constance, to Mr. Frederick Joseph England, of Katugastota estate, ... The _weddmg will take place in Dublin, March 1. fourth, and Mrs Wallls. fifth, in th…"

(Also, I think she may have been Nora Constance Owston.)

Hm, interesting. The Englands were well-off Catholics, but their next-door neighbours, the boys that is, went to Wesley for a bit, I think; or if they didn't, they had friends who did.
So Frederick (Jr) didn't marry, or didn't have a surving wife or children, or maybe was furiously estranged from them. Hmm. I hope not so.
From the people he was associating with in the early 20th century, he is likely to have been a member of the Irish Volunteers, or to have emigrated into arty circles, or to have joined the British Army, or to have worked on as an engineer or in the bank or some other middle-class place - unless he was destroyed by the slaughter of any of the wars that crossed Europe at the time.

I'm looking for traces of a family called England, who lived in Palmerston Road in Rathmines in the 1900s. Here they are in the 1911 census:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Rathmines___Rathgar_East/Palmerston_Road/39953/

I'm curious to know what became of them all, and whether they have descendants. I think I may have a photo of one of the family.