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Hi Meely - The modern address for the house is 823 Wilmslow Road after the re-numbering. It is still there, though has undergone a huge rebuild in the last couple of years and I don't think it is a children's home nowadays but it was certainly active as one till about 10 years ago. It is the property on the left corner of the entrance to Wingate Drive if you look on google maps. For many many years was run by the extraordinary Sister Lucy...probably until she retired.  I recall they kept a massive number of guinea pigs in the garage that just kept on breeding. The garage is still the same today and can be seen on google street view if you head down Wingate Drive, it is behind the property built of brick. We were neighbours and we were always welcome to come and play at the home and Sister Lucy didn't mind looking after us if my mum had  errands to do. Wingate Drive was a constant playground back then with so many kids living in the private houses in addition to the children's home, all playing in the street. There were no parking restrictions or double yellow lines back then.  At the far end of Wingate was a passage through to Francis Convent. The last house on Wingate also belonged to Catholic Rescue and was where a 'father' lived , some kind of rectory, but we never played up there. The younger children's home kids all went to went to St Catherines Primary School on School Lane. So the address you have is correct for the time that the document was written, but as more properties were built it was necessary to re-number Wilmslow Road at some stage, and before I moved in to the area. My memory of the house was that is was bright light and airy and there were several long term kids resident there for much of their young lives. Sister Lucy was kindness itself. I recall her baking a cake for my parents wedding anniversary and getting my sister and I in to decorate it (as if she didn't have enough to do already.) We also got invited to go on  coach trip outing with her and the children in her care, to see a Panto one Christmas. The one and only time I ever went to a Panto.

Hi James and John Phimister too and any other of my direct descendant cousins of the John Phimister and Janet Torey...
At long long long last have found some indication of when Janet's hubbie John Phimister died.

Newspaper Article:
Dundee Courier Wed 22 March 1882
"Death of a Centenarian.- a woman named Janet Torry or Phimister died the other day at Kirkhill in the Parish of Rothes, Elginshire at the advanced age of one hundred years.  She was the widow of John Phimister, at one time tenant of the farm of Edinburgh, now included in the farm of Shogle, Birnie parish, but who predeceased her by the period of 54 years. Her family were eleven in number and they have all of course now reached an advanced period of life. Although far from active in her last days, she retained her mental powers to the hour of her death. Had she lived till June next, she would have reached her 101st year."

With that little nugget, we can put John Phimister's death as c.1828.
Even though no burial record exists for him.

Hope that helps a bit towards a more complete tree for you too.

Did you order the birth cert for 1917 Frederick J Penfold born in Croydon, mother's maiden name Lawrence?
I wonder if Phyllis knew TFP BEFORE she married Stephen Saunter.

Had child No.1 Frederick J.    [with TFP perhaps)
Married Stephen and had 4 children with him.

Vera Vivienne Rhoda Saunter b.1922 Cranbrook, she married Cyril Seymour Huggett - they lived in Kent.
Her story is on the BBC website http://www.bbc.co.uk/ww2peopleswar/stories/40/a2989740.shtml

Stanley Stephen Saunter b.25 May 1923 Cranbrook d.Dec 1998 Mansfield Notts, he was married.

Peggy Vivan Saunter b.10 Jul 1924 East Ashford d. Feb 2004 Staffordshire, she married Alexr Rankin in 1943.

Rudolph F P Saunter b.1927 East Ashford, and I can't find any sign of him. He was very young, and perhaps also adopted out with a name change in the process.

Then Phyllis gets back with TFP and 3 more children arrive in quick succession, bringing the total to 8.
Quite a handful, and if TFP then jumped ship or either was taken ill for example then that might explain why the little ones were placed for adoption.
It's just a theory.

Have you contacted any of the children of the older offspring of Phyllis, incase their parent told them how come the family ended up split, or indeed if they know anything about TFP?

Frederick J Penfold would have been a teenager when the break up was taking place, Vera would have been approaching 10.

Ellen Elizabeth Morley died Q2 1878 aged 3 in Eastry RD, so she must be a Morley not a Morfey.

With regard to your request for information on Thomas Frederick Penfold's kids: Do you have a name for any of them?

Possibly there could be a baptism record in the local area, however c.1930s records are often still stored at the local church, though some parishes will have forwarded their baptism books to Maidstone archives.

When TFP died in 1991 did he leave a will? If so that might specifically name his children as beneficiaries.

If it is a case of a rumoured liason, and the children likely to have been registered with their mother's name but not the father's, then you have a truly difficult task determining who the kids were, without the mother's name.

Perhaps TFP and partner were witnesses to someone elses wedding, or registered a business together, or there might have been some legal case involving both that would give you clues to work with.

Was TFP already married? Did his wife file for divorce naming the 'other woman' in the case as co-respondent?

If the child/children were registered with surname Penfold and the registrations also list mother's maiden name, then you could by process of elimination check each and every child with surname Penfold with birth registered in the area, then cross check for a marriage between the Penfold and mother's maiden name. Any with a marriage before the birth you can eliminate, then whittle the list down to as few as possible that way, and order the certificates for those that are still possibilities. Then check for their own marriages, order those certificates and see if the father is named on the marriage certs. It will be an expensive exercise, but that depends on how desperate you are to find the missing kids.

the marriage certificate number at Rye is  1871 / Quarter2/ vol 2b / page 17
BUT - before you order it

....I think I am now about to throw a spanner in the works. I don't now think Ellen Elizabeth is a Morfey.
and this is because in

1901 census

Albert  H Penfold aged 38 Agricultural Waggoner born Rye Sussex
Ellen E Penfold 31 born Rye Sussex
Susan E Penfold 10 born Playden, Kent
Mabel J Penfold 7 born Ashford
Ellen L Penfold 6 born Hastingleigh
Albert E Penfold 3 born Frittenden
Thomas F Penfold 1month born Willesborough

on looking for the 1891 cenus.... the ONLY match I can find for Ellen & Susan is as follows...

1891 census
Raiton, Playden
Ellen Lacey aged 21 born Rye (and is married but no spouse with her)
Susan E Lacey aged 5months born Playden
also Lily Weller aged 9 a boarder and scholar aged 9

so I checked marriages and ...

1886 Q4 Rye,  between Ellen Elizabeth Leadbeter & Tom Lacey. The same page as a marriage of Emily Weller & Charles Payne (so they may be something to do with Lily Weller the boarder)

so this would indicate that Ellen Elizabeth Lacey nee Leadbeter could become Mrs Penfold somewhere between 1891 census and 1893 birth of her daughter Mabel Jane Penfold at West Ashford Reg District. 1893 Q3 2a /803 and perhaps when Albert Henry Penfold registered the birth and was asked for mothers name, he gave his own mother's name rather than his daughter's name. OR that he had a fling with Ellen Elizabeth Morfey which produced a daughter and Albert Henry Penfold brought the child up with his new partner Ellen Elizabeth Leadbetter/Lacey.

Susan Ellen Lacey is registered as born Rye District in 1890 Q4, there is no Susan E Penfold registered at all.

This would seem to confirm that the woman that is the mum of Ethel Lilian Penfold on the census is infact born Ellen Elizabeth Leadbetter  and not Morfey but formerly Lacey. If this is the case.....

The 1881 Census
George Leadbetter 32 Fishmonger born Rye  is her father
Sarah Ann Leadbetter 34 wife born Rye
Eliza Leadbetter 9 born Rye
Ellen Leadbetter 6 born Rye
Emily leadbetter 4 born Iden
William H Leadbetter 2 born Hastings.

(by 1891 George is widowed, married again to Eliza Down in Q2 1885 Hastings - and the Leadbetter and Down families have merged with Eliza bringing 4 of her own children to the family, and then having 3 more with George.)

(Sarah Ann Leadbetter had died 1884 Q4 Hastings, she was born Sarah Ann Saunter and married George Leadbetter in 28 Jul 1867 in Rye Registration District. Sarah's parents were Henry Saunter a carpenter and Jane Fuller his wife. Her parents are living with the large Saunter family in 1861. Her parents were Richard & Emma Fuller. Henry Saunter's ancestry goes way back and someone has published it on ancestry.com)

This does not explain why there is a marriage between Albert Henry Penfold and Ellen Morfey in 1871 Rye, unless these are infact Albert Henry Penfold's own parents or at least might be his Dad and may be a 2nd wife,
as Albert Henry Penfold should have been born about 1864 ish.

However.... I cannot find a marriage between Penfold and Lacey or Leadbetter or Morfey in the 1890's

Unless Ellen Elizabeth Lacey had divorced Tom Lacey, or he had died, and I can't see any record that he died in England, it looks to me like Ellen Elizabeth & Albert Henry Penfold were not married to each other.

Or to complicate things even further .... perhaps the 1901 census wife Ellen Elizabeth Penfold did what her father had done and married a man who already had a family as she did and the families merged. This might mean that Ethel Lilian Penfold's mum really was an Ellen Elizabeth Morfey! - but i doubt it. It could be worth ordering the birth cert for mabel jane penfold to see what the mother's maiden name is on that, and also Albert E 's birth cert. As they were the two children born either side of Ethel Lilian. Yes it will cost £14 for the two certificates but it might clarify who the mum is if Albert Henry Penfold filled in those forms properly.

Mabel Jane Penforld 1893 Q3 West Ashford Dist. 2a /803
Albert Edward Penfold 1898 Q2 Cranbrook Dist. 2a / 785
Thomas Frederick Penfold 1901 Q1 East Ashford 2a/ 866

...............
getting back to Albert Henry Penfold
1891 census
Albert Penfold aged 28 (single) profession Baker, is a Convict at HM Convict Borstal, St Margaret, Chatham.
1881 census
Albert H Penfold aged 18 (single) Ag Lab boarder at house next to Rose & Crown, Old Romney, Kent
1871 census
Cinque Ports Yard, Rye
Henry Penfold aged 33 Ostler born Hawkhurst Kent (son of Henry Penfold & Maria Jenner married Hawkhurst 25 Oct 1829)
Mary Ann Penfold aged 33 wife born Rye Sussex
Maria Penfold aged 12 born Rye (Q1 Rye)
Mary Ann Penfold aged 10 born Rye
Albert Penfold aged 8 born Rye
Lois Penfold aged 5 born Rye
Elizabeth Penfold aged 2 born Rye
Eliza Penfold aged 3months born Rye
(Mary Ann Buckland married 1859 Q1 Rye 2b/13 to Henry Penfold)

Certainly things are not straightforward in this mysterious family tree. I will delete the reference to Morfey as a maiden name in the Hastingleigh website as it cannot refer to Ethel Lilian's parents. her dad was too young for a marriage in 1871 if her only born 1863/4 ish.