Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - lipscombe

Pages: [1]
1
Derry (Londonderry) / Re: Jemima Beatty - Citty Derry
« on: Thursday 10 February 11 09:33 GMT (UK)  »
Pernille, you will find that there are TWO Benjamin Beatties (or Beatty - the spelling is variable). For a while I was led on a wild goose chase in chasing 'your' Benjamin Beattie thinking he was my ancestor, and I accumulated some information on him and the rest of the family before I realized my mistake. I will try to dig out what I have on him if you want to PM me.

My immediate recollection is that there is little to tell about his earlier life because the records simply aren't there, but I will check. However, when I did my search I wasn't aware of Scotland's People, a very good website of Scottish BMD records. The one snag with Scotland's People is that it is a pay site (though initial searches are free, you will have to pay to see the detailed records).

For the record, Chester and I got in contact and have worked out the background (in considerable detail) of the other Benjamin Beatty. In brief, he was an Irish schoolmaster who came to Australia in his fifties along with the rest of his family. He worked in and around Brisbane (and from his official records, doesn't seem to have been particularly good at his job and possibly had a drink problem). Jemima got pregnant by a Mr Hamilton from Sydney (we have no positive proof, but we suspect Mr Hamilton was a trainee teacher working under Mr Beatty). Jemima had the first child out of wedlock, and then married Mr Hamilton. From all we can gather, the couple prospered and Mr Hamilton ended his days as Alderman Hamilton and was a fruit grower living near Sydney. We have very strong circumstantial evidence that the Hamiltons and the Beatty families knew each other before all this through a close relative of Benjamin, called Hugh Beattie (he changed the spelling of his name when he arrived in Australia). Hugh was either Benjamin's brother or a close cousin. Hugh was one of the earliest wine growers in Australia and one of his grandchildren was Mary Gilmore, a rather famous poet and writer whose face adorns the Australian 10 dollar note!

If anyone is reading this thread who wants more details of this branch, please PM me.


2
Derry (Londonderry) / Re: Jemima Beatty - Citty Derry
« on: Tuesday 02 February 10 16:38 GMT (UK)  »
Did a bit more checking up - we can forget the idea that Benjamin adopted Irish Jemima, because he'd died eight years earlier in 1860!

Also, looking at the dates, Irish Jemima must have been pregnant before setting out for Australia. So this makes it very unlikely that William Hamilton was the father and the naming of the child as William John is pure coincidence (and bear in mind also these are very common names, so it's not all that big a coincidence).

I also doubt if the Beatties in Australia would claim Irish Jemima with a child born out of wedlock as their daughter and then announce this in a newspaper marriage announcement. Sydney at that time was still a relatively small (so everyone knew everyone else) and with a fairly conservative and 'respectable' middle class - I seriously doubt if folks would have tolerated such a thing. Therefore, I think that when Jemima is announced in the wedding announcement as the daughter of Benjamin Beattie she really is the biological and legitimate daughter of Benjamin Beattie.

Thus, I think on the balance of things that Irish Jemima is not the spouse of William Hamilton. Instead, the spouse is Jane E Beattie, who for reasons now lost, decided to call herself Jemima (this isn't all that odd a thing - e.g. one of my other ancestors was born Vivienne Irene, but always seems to have called herself Brightie). All that is required to fit the evidence (the formal NSW records, the newspaper announcement, etc) is that Jane E Beattie later called herself Jemima. And as I've just said, this isn't all that odd a thing to do.

My hunch on what happened to Irish Jemima is this. She got pregnant in Ireland. To avoid scandal, her father packed her off to Australia to have the child. There are a LOT of Beatties in Sydney at this time, and it's not impossible that there was a close relative out there. Jemima was met by Sarah on the last leg of the journey and they went to Sydney where William John was born. Irish Jemimah then went back to Ireland or otherwise simply disappeared off the radar. I think she quite possibly went back to Ireland and the child was adopted, possibly by a relative. Indeed, it's not impossible that 'our' Beatties were the adopting family. I've a shrewd suspicion that as Benjamin and others prospered, other family members were invited to come and live in Australia. There's the occasional mention in the Sydney Morning Herald about the death of a Beattie, 'late of Dumfries' (i.e. where Benjamin Beattie was born), which tends to support this idea.

Incidentally, absolutely the only marriage of a Jemima Beatty (or Beattie) I can find in NSW is the one to William Hamilton.

If this sounds plausible, I can gladly send you what I know about Jane E Beattie (and more particularly her father, who makes for interesting reading).


3
Derry (Londonderry) / Re: Jemima Beatty - Citty Derry
« on: Tuesday 02 February 10 12:58 GMT (UK)  »
This is getting more confusing!

Quick answer for the moment. There is no NSW birth record of a Benjamin Beattie (or Beatty) having a daughter called Jemima. However, there are records of a Benjamin Beattie and Jane having three daughters: Georgiana (b. 1834), a Jane E (born 1846) and a Georgina (b 1854).

I think we can take it as read that a marriage took place on March 28th, 1868 between a William Hamilton and a Jemima Beattie.

There are two obvious explanations:

1. Jane E Beattie (b 1846) and Jemima Beattie are the same woman. This fits the NSW records and the newspaper announcement. BUT: can we accept that Jane E was also known as Jemima?

2. 'Irish Jemima' and Jemima Beattie are the same woman. BUT: why is she described in the newspaper announcement as the daughter of Benjamin Beattie, because clearly she isn't? Did Benjamin take pity on her and adopt her? This is not as impossible as it first sounds.

Must go to a meeting now - I will think more on this and I hope write later today.  Incidentally, I can tell you a shedload about the Hamiltons as I'm descended from Alfred Hamilton (one of William's kids).

4
Derry (Londonderry) / Re: Jemima Beatty - Citty Derry
« on: Wednesday 27 January 10 11:42 GMT (UK)  »
Are there two Jemima Beattys who married two William Hamiltons in that year? To quote from the Sydney Herald of 20th May, 1868:

HAMILTON-BEATTY-March 2Bth, by the Rev. Dr. Bailoy, of  the Free Church of England, Mr. William Hamilton, to Jemima, daughter of Mr. Benjamin Beatty, both of Smithfield, near Parramatta.

Jemima was born in Australia (prob. 1846) and her parents were originally Scottish. Her father was transported, her mother (Jane Wells) went on assisted passage. I've traced the father back to Canongate, Dumfries and found his parents and grandparents, but earlier than that the trail runs cold. There's a full transcript of the father's trial at the Old Bailey available on-line.

I suspect that the Jemima Beatty you've found is a separate Jemima Beatty, but it doesn't sound like the one who married William Hamilton in 1868. I've been looking through a lot of the Sydney newspapers of this period and the Beatty (or Beattie - the two get used interchangeably, even for the same individual) surname is very common. Jemima isn't all that unusual a name in the 19th century (and to confuse matters, could also be used as a nickname, so the birth certificate might not register it) so it's entirely possible that there were two or more Jemima Beattys in a city the size of Sydney.

Pages: [1]