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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Devon => Topic started by: Mamspice on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:03 GMT (UK)

Title: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:03 GMT (UK)
Hi, I'm struggling to find a birth and wondered if someone might know what else I can try. I'm looking for a William James Moore, born 1868. I can only find him on 2 census', 1901 and 1911 when he is married. His birthplace on one is stated as Coyton (which obviously doesn't exist) the other one just says England! He died in 1911. He is down as James Moore on his marriage certificate, with just a line through the fathers section. Any ideas on how to find his birth date/place and his mums name?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Milliepede on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:07 GMT (UK)
Does Coyton have a County or is that the only word?  Who did he marry please?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Milliepede on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:15 GMT (UK)
I can see a census 1911 with Coyton Devon is that the one?

There is a Coryton Devon under Tavistock district and a James Moore birth in 1868.

Perhaps he added the William later on.

Can you find him as just James in earlier census?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: jonwarrn on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:21 GMT (UK)
There's Coryton in Devon? In Tavistock RD.
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:49 GMT (UK)
I can see a census 1911 with Coyton Devon is that the one?

There is a Coryton Devon under Tavistock district and a James Moore birth in 1868.

Perhaps he added the William later on.

Can you find him as just James in earlier census?
Yeah thats the one, married to Mary. I guess he could have gone by just James, I can see one but he's a servant so still no luck on the mum
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Tuesday 24 February 26 21:50 GMT (UK)
There's Coryton in Devon? In Tavistock RD.
It's possible  ???
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: teragram31510 on Wednesday 25 February 26 09:03 GMT (UK)
Or Colyton, Devon (just north of Seaton, east of Exeter)?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: softly softly on Wednesday 25 February 26 09:06 GMT (UK)
I can see a census 1911 with Coyton Devon is that the one?

There is a Coryton Devon under Tavistock district and a James Moore birth in 1868.

Perhaps he added the William later on.

Can you find him as just James in earlier census?

1871 census ref 2144 38 22---1881 ref 2218 115 31

parents James R (Richard) and Mary Ann

MOORE, JAMES       mmn WARNE 
GRO Reference: 1868  S Quarter in TAVISTOCK  Volume 05B  Page 361

---

Marriages Sep 1855   

MOORE    James Richard        Stoke D.    5b   520    
WARN    Mary Ann        Stoke D    5b   520   

SS
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 10:29 GMT (UK)
I can see a census 1911 with Coyton Devon is that the one?

There is a Coryton Devon under Tavistock district and a James Moore birth in 1868.

Perhaps he added the William later on.

Can you find him as just James in earlier census?

1871 census ref 2144 38 22---1881 ref 2218 115 31

parents James R (Richard) and Mary Ann

MOORE, JAMES       mmn WARNE 
GRO Reference: 1868  S Quarter in TAVISTOCK  Volume 05B  Page 361

---

Marriages Sep 1855   

MOORE    James Richard        Stoke D.    5b   520    
WARN    Mary Ann        Stoke D    5b   520   

SS

If James was born to married parents why would his father's name be blank on his marriage record?

Here's another possibility for 1891
Piece number 1758, Folio 93, Page 10

James Moore b abt 1868 Colliton Somerset, living in Devon. The Colyton near Seaton isn't too far from Somerset border and can't find a Colliton or close in Somerset.

Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 10:39 GMT (UK)
And another James (Southcott) Moore illeg son of Thirza born Kennerleigh, some distance away from Colyton, but could the place name have got confused. ?
1881
Piece number 2227, Folio 115, Page 9
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 10:49 GMT (UK)
There's a likely Thirza Moore d/o James b abt 1847 living in Kennerleigh in 1851 and 1861

added
Can't be this James, found him in 1921 with family and Thirza is with them
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 11:36 GMT (UK)
Did James's widow Mary marry again to an Alfred Moore? James and Mary's son Cedric Charles gives an A Moore as nok on his military record and J & M's daughter Bessie is with Alfred and Mary in 1921
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: hanes teulu on Wednesday 25 February 26 12:22 GMT (UK)
What was Mary Pedrick's/Pederick's father's given name (if present on marr. cert.) - Thomas or Francis possibly?

Added - I'm looking at James Moore, born 1866, Bow living in Spreyton in '81 and Mary Pedric/Pedrick in nearby Zeal Monachorum.

Added - I'm discounting the above James. Appears to be the James, born Bow, in 1901 and 1911 Census.


Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Wednesday 25 February 26 14:38 GMT (UK)
Did James's widow Mary marry again to an Alfred Moore? James and Mary's son Cedric Charles gives an A Moore as nok on his military record and J & M's daughter Bessie is with Alfred and Mary in 1921
Hi, yes she did marry Alfred. I thought it might be a brother but couldn't find any link
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: softly softly on Wednesday 25 February 26 14:47 GMT (UK)
Did James's widow Mary marry again to an Alfred Moore? James and Mary's son Cedric Charles gives an A Moore as nok on his military record and J & M's daughter Bessie is with Alfred and Mary in 1921
Hi, yes she did marry Alfred. I thought it might be a brother but couldn't find any link

I believe Alfred's parents were Robert and Elizabeth(Webber). 1921 records he was born in the Parish of Bow, Devon. 1871/81 finds him in Bow with parents but no sign of a James/William James with mmn Webber in the census.

SS
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 15:39 GMT (UK)
Did James's widow Mary marry again to an Alfred Moore? James and Mary's son Cedric Charles gives an A Moore as nok on his military record and J & M's daughter Bessie is with Alfred and Mary in 1921
Hi, yes she did marry Alfred. I thought it might be a brother but couldn't find any link

I believe Alfred's parents were Robert and Elizabeth(Webber). 1921 records he was born in the Parish of Bow, Devon. 1871/81 finds him in Bow with parents but no sign of a James/William James with mmn Webber in the census.

SS

I came to the same conclusion.
I think James / William James is illegitimate. Moore is quite a common surname so J /WJ may not be related to Alfred or it may go back a couple of generations and they are distant cousins. Did Robert Moore have a sister who could have given birth to J/WJ.?

Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: softly softly on Wednesday 25 February 26 15:54 GMT (UK)
This young man I cannot find after 1871 census ref 2209 67 10, grandson.

Believe below is his birth.

SS
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 16:07 GMT (UK)
I think I have William (grandad) on 1861 and 1851, but doesn't seem to have a son James who fathered James 1869

Piece number 1507, Folio 74, Page 6

Piece number 1895, Folio 727, Page 15
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Wednesday 25 February 26 16:34 GMT (UK)
I think chances are he was born William James but by the time of marriage he just went by the name James?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Wednesday 25 February 26 16:48 GMT (UK)
I think chances are he was born William James but by the time of marriage he just went by the name James?

On which events is he listed as William James as opposed to James?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: hanes teulu on Wednesday 25 February 26 18:33 GMT (UK)
Reply #12 - can you confirm Mary Pendrick's father's given name (if name on cert)?
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Wednesday 25 February 26 19:01 GMT (UK)
I think chances are he was born William James but by the time of marriage he just went by the name James?

On which events is he listed as William James as opposed to James?
On the 1901 and 1911 census' plus his death certificate
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Wednesday 25 February 26 19:04 GMT (UK)
Reply #12 - can you confirm Mary Pendrick's father's given name (if name on cert)?
He's Francis Pedrick
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: hanes teulu on Wednesday 25 February 26 19:28 GMT (UK)
Thanks for confiming
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Dundee on Wednesday 25 February 26 22:14 GMT (UK)
He is James in 1901, not William James.  In 1911 his wife Mary completed the census.

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: LizzieL on Thursday 26 February 26 07:10 GMT (UK)
He is James in 1901, not William James.  In 1911 his wife Mary completed the census.

Debra  :)

That's what I found too

Possibly she was informant on his death as well.

they had a son, William James, so perhaps she got muddled and thought it was her husband's full name too
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Thursday 26 February 26 17:24 GMT (UK)
There might be a newspaper article about his death in May but I can't find it. He got kicked in the stomach by a horse on the farm he worked
Title: Re: Birth dilemma
Post by: Mamspice on Saturday 28 February 26 17:32 GMT (UK)
Just another thought, his son named him as William James on his own marriage certificate. I was thinking senior went by James so as not to confuse things in the home