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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Northumberland => England => Northumberland Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Gabriel 54 on Sunday 08 February 26 10:10 GMT (UK)
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A bit of a risk but here goes !
I have in my ascendants, Robert Menzies
B:1791 Montrose,Scotland.
D:7 December 1876 Tynemouth, Northumberland, England - he married a Mary Hopper, from a well known farming family of the area, and settled, spawning a family that gradually moved to Newcastle and Durham. I have a suspicion he was of a long line of Roberts, as many of his male descendants are called this. Several members of the family included Hopper in their names. I have since discovered quite a detailed genealogy of the Hopper family as they were farmers for the Duke of Northumberland.
Has anyone done any research on this particular Menzies family? Thank you for nay input.
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Of possible interest:
"NORTH SHIELDS POLICE.- On the 5th inst., before the Rev. R. H. Brandling, Robert Mezies of Tynemouth, shoemaker, and Joseph Malborough, of Hartley, charged with assaults, were severly ordered to pay costs, and to enter into recognizances for keeping the peace."
Saturday, Mar. 9, 1833
Publication: Newcastle Courant
"At Tynemouth, on the 29th ult., Mary, wife of Mr. Robert Menzies, shoemaker, aged 40."
Saturday, Oct. 6, 1832
Publication: Newcastle Journal
Robert MENZIES, shoemaker of Tynemouth was also insolvent in 1835.
Perry's Bankrupt and Insolvent Gazette 1835
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Just in case you don’t have this detail, the DRO transcript of the 1812 Tynemouth marriage has Robert Menzies ‘of the Forfar Militia’.
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Burials;
Christ Church, Tynemouth
MARY Menzies 30 Sep 1832, Wife of Robert, age 40, cause Cholera**
GEORGE Menzies 06 Apr 1821 age 9 weeks, Parents Robert/Mary, buried Tynemouth Castle.
JANE Menzies 20 Apr 1835 age 15, Parents Robert/Mary
ANN Menzies 13 Jun 1837 age 9 years and 9 Mths, Parents Robert/Mary
St Paul, Cullercoats
ROBERT Menzies 10 Dec 1876 age 85
ROBERT Menzies 18 Jul 1879 age 54
Can see only 1 bapt Tynemouth to ROBERT/MARY, Father a Shoemaker;
THOMAS 15 Sep 1816
All above on FreeREG including the Marriage 1812 under Robert Minzies
Trish :)
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:) :) :)
Thank you so much Trish. This is seminal!
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Your very welcome.
Trish in Sydney :)
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Just in case you don’t have this detail, the DRO transcript of the 1812 Tynemouth marriage has Robert Menzies ‘of the Forfar Militia’.
Now that is very interesting - Forfar militia were in Tynemouth and Newcastle ,,,,,Thank you so much for that precious bit of info! Gabriel
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Burials;
Christ Church, Tynemouth
MARY Menzies 30 Sep 1832, Wife of Robert, age 40, cause Cholera**
GEORGE Menzies 06 Apr 1821 age 9 weeks, Parents Robert/Mary, buried Tynemouth Castle.
JANE Menzies 20 Apr 1835 age 15, Parents Robert/Mary
ANN Menzies 13 Jun 1837 age 9 years and 9 Mths, Parents Robert/Mary
St Paul, Cullercoats
ROBERT Menzies 10 Dec 1876 age 85
ROBERT Menzies 18 Jul 1879 age 54
Can see only 1 bapt Tynemouth to ROBERT/MARY, Father a Shoemaker;
THOMAS 15 Sep 1816
All above on FreeREG including the Marriage 1812 under Robert Minzies
Trish :)
Thank you again Trish - descendants of this family now live in Australia and Canada! The most famous of the bunch was one Gordon Menzies (1912-2001) one time Secretary General of Unesco - settled in Australia.
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You are all stars - many thanks for your input - this fleshes out the Menzies family quite a bit. Now the difficult bit - finding out the parents of the first Robert Menzies in Tynemouth. I am partly relying on the very strict naming pattern of Scots families , geographics and 'educated guesswork'....on verra!
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Yes naming pattern can help;
So we have;
THOMAS bapt 1816
JANE c 1820 buried 1835 age 15
GEORGE 1821 buried age 9 weeks
ROBERT 1826 appears on Census with Father 1841/1851
ANN c 1827 buried age nearly 10
JOHN 1830/1 on Census with Father also
I see a Tree has Jacob Hopper Menzies also.
If only baptisms could be found ::)
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Looks like Jacob is linked through a marriage record;
Thomas Menzies single (son of Robert) m. 2 February 1847, Tynemouth to Elizabeth Taylor
Jacob Hopper Menzies single (son of Robert) m. 18 July 1859, Tynemouth to Jane Smith
Possibly another daughter too;
Mary Menzies (dau of Robert) single m. 2 March 1840 to Hugh Dingwell
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Robert Dingwall bap 4 April 1841, Chatham Kent, son of Hugh and Mary
Mary Dingwall b. abt 1844 Ireland (in 1851 census)
Isabel Dingwall b. 18 Oct 1848, bap 24 Oct 1848 at Christ Church, dau of Hugh (soldier) and Mary
Isabella Dingwall buried 5 Sep 1849 Christ Church, Tynemouth aged 10mths day of Hugh & Mary
Mary died 1 February 1850, aged 32 at Tynemouth. Obit in the Newcastle Chronicle.
1841 Hugh’s at Chatham Barracks Kent
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQKP-T95?lang=en&cid=fs_copy
As is Robert
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQKP-T54?lang=en&cid=fs_copy
In 1851 Hugh (b. 1809, Scotland) is a widow living at Billy Mill Lane w/ Robert & daughter Mary
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SG6Q-GFD?lang=en&cid=fs_copy
In 1861 he’s at Newcastle Street Tynemouth now with son Robert with him
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7NT-Z1P?lang=en&cid=fs_copy
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Yes naming pattern can help
Who are Mary's parents supposed to be?
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A Tree has her Parents as THOMAS/ANN, Ann nee Codling.
Thomas/Ann did bapt a Daug Mary 22 Feb 1795 but Thomas was a Labourer.
(FreeREG)
F/S has a Mary Christening 25 December 1793 Christ Church, Tynemouth to JACOB/JANE
Wife maybe Jane NEWTON, married 17 February 1793 Jarrow, Durham
He was likely bapt 13 Dec 1772 Father Jacob a Farmer
May be more likely I think?
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Robert Menzies 1791-1876 married Mary Hopper 1792-1832 daughter of Jacob Hopper, farmer, 13/12/1772- and (marriage 17/2/1793, Jarrow)Jane Newton, 1771-1822. The name Hopper continues down the Menzies family for several generations.
There has been a study of the Hopper family, tenant farmers of the Dukes of Northumberland, with a very good genealogy going back to the early 17c. I found it on ancestry - and then Google books. For some reason specific birth/baptism dates seems to elude me.
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Yes naming pattern can help;
So we have;
THOMAS bapt 1816
JANE c 1820 buried 1835 age 15
GEORGE 1821 buried age 9 weeks
ROBERT 1826 appears on Census with Father 1841/1851
ANN c 1827 buried age nearly 10
JOHN 1830/1 on Census with Father also
I see a Tree has Jacob Hopper Menzies also.
If only baptisms could be found ::)
Thanks again for this - getting quite full my menzies family tree!
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Jacob Hopper, Farmer, and Jane Newton, if you are referring to Mary Hopper
If not Mary Menzies is daughter of Robert Menzies and Mary Hopper - there is quite an extensively researched genealogy of the Hopper family - they were tenant farmers of the duke of Northumberland - about 400 acres.
Gabriel