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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (North Riding) => England => Yorkshire (North Riding) Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Nicky on Wednesday 07 January 26 16:20 GMT (UK)
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Any help please, gone cross eyed looking
I have Ruth Adams born 12 Dec 1881, she married Thomas john Kennedy Scott born 9 oct 1880. They married 1906.
Have them in 1911 census but can not find them in 1921. Found them in 1939.
Children are Alexander born 7 Jan 1908
James born 1910
John born 5 Nov 1914
George born 1917
Violet born 19 May 1921
I would appreciate help for 1921 census and Violets birth.
Children were born Wykeham area and in 1920 they were still there. 1939 moved to Coventry.
Much appreciated
Nicky
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Just to add that in 1911 Thomas John Kennedy Scott is listed as just John Scott
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Where was Violets birth registered
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Yes Thomas was John in 1911.
I cannot find Violets birth record so I don't know where she was born unfortunately
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He is also John in 1939
ADDED
As the 1921 census was taken after Violets birth it would give a clue as to where they are living
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Were Thomas John Kennedy Scotts parents Thomas and Sarah. If so Violet is with them in 1921
Maybe not the right Violet as she is 5 months in 1921 census
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This family are in Dornock, Dumfriesshire, Scotland in 1921
John Scott aged 40
Ruth Scott aged 39
Alexander aged 13
James aged 11
John aged 6
George aged 4
Violet aged 0-1
I suggest you invest in some credits for Scotland's People!
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Well done Jen :)
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Oh no, Correction - all those people are there APART from Violet :-[
There is a Violet in Dornock but she's at different reference number from the others.
The Scotts (John, Ruth etc) are all reference 819/4/16
Violet Scott is with a family whose reference is 819/5/9
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If Ruth was born in Wykeham, York, and John in Cummertrees then they are in Dornock, Dumfries in 1921.
SS
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If Ruth was born in Wykeham, York, and John in Cummertrees then they are in Dornock, Dumfries in 1921.
SS
Reply #6 :D
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If Ruth was born in Wykeham, York, and John in Cummertrees then they are in Dornock, Dumfries in 1921.
SS
Reply #6 :D
JenB, I did see reply#6 and had 6 spare credits so had a look.
SS
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Thank you so much, didn't occur to me that they'd gone to Scotland, Thank you so much. That's a great help!
Much appreciated
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JenB, I did see reply#6 and had 6 spare credits so had a look.
So was my deduction about the family correct - all of them minus Violet?
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Spot on JenB,
SS
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Nicky, please forgive this question - what evidence do you have that Violet was John and Ruth's daughter, apart from the fact that she was with them on the 1939 register, when relationships weren't shown?
Perhaps you have evidence from marriage certificates, in which case please forgive my question :)
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No problem with the question at all, I was told by a family member who vaguely remembered her. It's definitely not concrete that she was their daughter, that's part of why I was trying to trace them I 1921. Have confirmation of all the others.
I'll most likely get her marriage certificate to confirm.
Going to take a look at Scotland site too for birth.
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Info only. Father Thomas was born with surname Kennedy. Suspect he was illegitimate.
KENNEDY
THOMAS JOHN SCOTT
M
1880
817 / 25
Cummertrees
SS
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1881 scotland census.
Jane Kennedy 62 Head
Agnes Kennedy 20 Grandaughter (Granddaughter)
Jas Kennedy 8 Grandson
Wm Kennedy 2 Grandson
John Scott 3 Mo G. G. Son He is the son of Agnes--as per birth image.
SS
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I see that in 1939 Violet is entered as ‘Sim Scott, Violet’.
I think, judging by her 2001 death record (surname French), Sim was her middle name.
I don’t see anything yet on SP for her birth.
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Thomas/John's mother Agnes Kennedy married James Scott 1882 Cummertrees.
SS
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Thank you, I've subscribed to Scotland people and had just found the birth of Thomas Kennedy.
Doesn't solve Violet but Thomas/John sorted.
Many thanks. The hunt for Violet goes on ....
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I see that in 1939 Violet is entered as ‘Sim Scott, Violet’.
I think, judging by her 2001 death record (surname French), Sim was her middle name.
I don’t see anything yet on SP for her birth.
!st marriage for Violet
Violet S Scott
Sep qtr 1942 Warwick RD
Spouse Norman D Jones
Volume 6d p 2405
SS
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Found....she's not Ruth's daughter
Violet Sim born 19 May 1921 to a David Sim and Margaret Sim.
Just no idea why she was on the 1939 census as a Scott and married as a Scott
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Found a birth for a Violet Sim born 19 May 1921 in Scotland to a David Sim and Margaret, nee atkinson
Very likely her but no idea why she was with the Scott's and called herself Scott
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If you have access to ancestry try this link, most info pretty good, but not Violets marriage as we know different.
SS
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/117879829/person/370170003622/facts
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Thank you. Yes I do have ancestry. I will continue looking tomorrow.
I'm determined to find out what happened and why she became Scott
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In 1921 Violet might be in Morningside with her mother Margaret and older brother Leslie Moscrop Sim
On the results page the following are at ref 685/767/8 - you would obviously need to check the original.
James Sim aged 64
Annie Sim aged 54
Margaret Sim aged 25
Violet Sim aged 22
Charles Sim aged 18
Leslie M Sim aged 3
Violet Sim aged 0-1
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If you have access to ancestry try this link, most info pretty good, but not Violets marriage as we know different.
SS
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/117879829/person/370170003622/facts
This tree has Violet born in Gretna Green. Thomas John Kennedy Scott was born in Cummertrees, which isn't too far away from Gretna. I wonder if the families were related?
Chrissie
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If you have access to ancestry try this link, most info pretty good, but not Violets marriage as we know different.
SS
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/117879829/person/370170003622/facts
This tree has Violet born in Gretna Green. Thomas John Kennedy Scott was born in Cummertrees, which isn't too far away from Gretna. I wonder if the families were related?
Chrissie
Violet was actually born Royal Maternity Hospital, Edinburgh, Her father David registered the birth and recorded that he was domicil at 7 West, Gretna, his occupation--Railway Clerk.
SS
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A couple of thoughts and info. It appears David Sim died just over 1 month after the birth of Margaret in 1923. This would leave Margaret snr with 3 children 5 and under. I suspect she could not cope and both Violet and Margaret were unofficially adopted. Violet to the Scott's and possibly Margaret to Robert and Cassie Gate.
Margaret snr was born 8th November 1894 Brampton, Cumberland. Her mmn was Armstrong.
Only known info re Leslie is his birth, marriage and death.
SS
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According to this record https://www.devilsporridge.org.uk/hm-factory-gretna-workers-database/name/david-sim
Violet had another sibling called David Humphrey Sim, who was born in 1920 and died in 1921 only a month or so after Violet was born. His death is recorded in Morningside, mother's maiden surname Atkinson. That was where the family were found in the 1921 census, taken only about three weeks after his death.
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Thank you for all the info, I am beginning to think that they were maybe related in some way and that Violets mother couldn't cope after the death of David. Most likely will never find the reason but at least I have some answers.
Much appreciated
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Just as an aside....The Devils Porridge Museum at Gretna (mentioned by JenB) is a very interesting place to visit, telling the story of the munitions workers there in WW1. My great uncle worked there and we visited a couple of years ago. I was able to add to their workers database from some family information that I had
Chrissie