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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => Topic started by: Ashnz on Wednesday 07 January 26 02:26 GMT (UK)
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Happy New Year :D
What I have discovered is my g-g-grandfather had 11 acres of freehold land at Powhatu West in Greytown. Also, his son-in-law Peter Beck had 10 acres at Powhatu West i Greytown. According to papers past Powhatu West was 84 acres in is entirety. I found a map which I will attach. I am wondering what the map is measured in? I would dearly like to figure out which section of Powhatu West they lived.
My warmest regards,
Ashley
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Greetings Ash.
Ideally I would require a little more information, and I am more familiar with the original surveys of Auckland, South Auckland, and the Waikato.
Look for larger period maps. Do Archives NZ and Papers Past searches, just for the area of interest and locality. Say; Pouhatu West and allotment; OR acres trying to find references, sales adds or maps that will give you the names allocated to the surveyed parcels of land when they were first registered etc. In my area the maps will be overwritten with a Parish name, and then lot numbers. Also overwritten on the maps will be council or regional names.
Confusing when some of the original maps will have the likes of "New Munster" written on them.
What you have is a clipping. There are a number of allotments notated, and probably involving three separate surveys. Each succeeding the previous larger block.
I was starting to add up the acerage [A.R.P.] when I realized that there was a smaller subdivision, off a previous subdivision numbered 1, 2, and 3, at the top, but then below that there is a second 3 [rd] lot (bold numerals) and each of those numbered lots, also have notated their area as A R & P.
So your small clip, is probably part of the original survey, and then the three lower ones are notated with their acerage, and numbered allotment thereof. Above being three smaller lots surveyed off a previous allotment.
I could attach local examples but that would probably confuse you more and not be relevant.
Alan.
PS As we have corresponded in the past PM me if you wish. Looks like Jens is still proving to be a challenge.
Edited - Senior moment re locality,
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Ashley
If it is an old map it will be in acres, roods and perches. If there are measurements they will probably be in links. Throwback to older English land measurements.
A rood is a quarter of an acre and there are 40 perches in a rood.
There are 100 links in a chain, which is 22 yards, the length of a cricket pitch. In todays measurements it is about 20 metres.
Section 4 is 23 acres, 1 rood and 32 perches.
Ian C
Edit
To convert links to metres multiply by 0.201168.
eg 100 links x 0.201168 = 20.1168 metres.
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Hi Again.
https://ndhadeliver.natlib.govt.nz/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE5312966
With luck the link will take you to an early survey map of Greytown. But possibly not covering what is referred to as West Greytown. I do not know the area.
There are other location clues. The little clip that you have shows two types of boundary. A long dash on one front, and a long dash separated by a short one on the other. Note on the link map provided, the lines marking the river boundary, and the other a district / block boundary.
Happy hunting.
Alan.
PS I am blind. Too late at night. Right click and roll to zoom in. Look to the left and slightly above the word URUOKAKITI. Bingo
Your titles of interest will probably start Tararahi Plains Block 14 then list subdivison number and allotmant number/s.
Alan.
PPS. The original Powhatu West Block, survey plan of 1879/1880 by Surveyor H T BROWNE is held by the Wellington branch of Archives NZ.
The reference number is R23975986. And if you ask our Moderator he may offer to look it up, and photograph it for you.
Alan.
Added a day later. R24006073 is the Archives NZ reference number for the TIFFIN survey map of the Wairarapa area, dated 1896-1889, and is available to view at the Wellingtoin branch. Or via the link above, which I found online when searching for Wairarapa maps.
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Morning Ashley.
Best I can do. Played with maps longer than I should have, as I have a farm water supply problem that needs fixing.
Attached a clip from the survey map, and another aerial one of the present, covering approximately the same area.
Alan.
Replaced notated 2026 image
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Morning Ashley.
Best I can do. Played with maps longer than I should have, as I have a farm water supply problem that needs fixing.
Attached a clip from the survey map, and another aerial one of the present, covering approximately the same area.
Alan.
Replaced notated 2026 image
Thank you Alan, those images were very helpful indeed :) I will contact archives and see if they wouldn't mind taking a look into their record. Just from my observation, my thought is that the smaller 3 sections at the top, with no measurements, look to have a combined area of about 20 acres. Though I did find a version of a map (attached) that Powhatu is divided differently.
Ashley
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Hello again Ashley.
The 2nd attachment is exactly the same BLOCK of land, but from a latter period in time. It has indications of buildings notated plus owner or lease holder's names.
As stated in my first post there appeared to have been subdivision, with the original lots 1 and 2, having been re-subdivided into 4 titles. The three smaller titles facing Papawai Road could well be what you are looking for. In error.
Added Edit : Archives reference R24617612 has John SKEET purchasing allotment 3 POWHATU EAST of 12a, for eight pounds per acre, in 1903. And that is the largest lot with the stream boundary for egress of Fabians Road if 1, 2 & 3 comprised a holding.
Allotment 3 POWHATA survey block was advertised for sale in the Wairarapa Daily Times 22/7/1893, page 3 at 17a 3rods.
I also searched through Archives NZ holdings using several search options but did not have much luck.
Alan
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And again Ashley.
Further searching of Archives NZ holdings have found proof that the top left allotment numbered 3 was of 12 acres. I think, though yet to be clear on what was East and West Powhatu Block, unless that was used to distunguish the allotment resurvey numbers with the block
4 results matching Powhatu between 1875-2026 | Archway-style Collections Search
Alan.
PS will supply link privately because I have been unsuccessful in transferring.
PPS Some Archives clippings sent privately re above research.
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ATTENTION Dear Moderator SPADES
Could you assist?
Ashley, and I, are interested in knowing if the Wellington Archives NZ held item R24617612
Has any detailed plans attached. It could be the 12 acre property Ashley is looking to identify.
Subject; Removal of restrictions on Powhatu East No 3 for sale of 12 acres to John SKEET.
Mr John SKEET being a prominent land owing identity, with the local firing range on his property which was across Fabian’s Road from the title named above.
Alan.
PS reply #4. Just spotted a senior moment. The bottom right credit should read .... a mile and a half EAST of GREYTOWN; and as some early sale adverts said ... a mile and a half WEST of Papawai.
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Hi Alan,
Thanks for your PM, I had missed your post.
Yes, I’ll have a look for it.
Regards,
Spades
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Thankyou SPADES.
Further research now leads me to believe the block you have offered to look up for us is the triangle allotment numbered 3, East of Fabian Road, where the paper road split to reach two different river fording places.
The Western one eventually deemed the shortest, and best, for a bridge over the river. While straight a head, towards the Papawai Marae, was closed and farmed.
Alan.
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Thanks Alan.
I'll see what I can find but I might be sending the whole file to Ashley.
Ashley, I've ordered the file and it's waiting for me already. I'll have it for you by Wednesday.
Regards,
Spades
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That is a prompt reply SPADES.
Thank you. You can send any photos that you are able to take to either Ashley, or I, and we will forward to the other. We are in email contact with each other.
We have both been digging out information about properties Between Greytown and Papawai, and in particular the Powhatu survey block.
Alan.
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Hi Ashley,
I have the file for you if you'd like to PM me with your email address.
Regards,
Spades
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Images sent.
Spades
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Thanks SPADES.
That was quick. Hope you had other reasons for attending the Archives as well, now that they are located further out of town.
Appreciated,
Alan.
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Morning Alan,
I didn't, but that's ok.
Archives only moved across the road to their new building. This isn't open to the public as yet, I collect files from upstairs in the National Library. Same process, quite easy.
And there's a good cafe downstairs!
If you two find another file which might forward Ashley's research, let me know and I'll hunt it down.
Best wishes,
Spades
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Oh I am missinformed. I had a feeling it had moved up valley.
There could be one other survey plan held by Wellington Archives that may be of interest, Unlike the TIFFIN survey I have not been able to locate a copy, on line, from other archives, however from the description it appears to predate the era that AshNZ is really interested in.
So yet to have been re subdivided into smaller holdings. The original grantees having subdivided down to smaller lots, that allowed for small holding leases, or sale to owner operator farming and horticulture businesses. Like the 40 acre allotments of the Greytown settlement.
A week after calling upon your assistance, I did an Archive search for further filings by the same solicitor's and discovered that at least one filing noted that a plan was included. So my main reason for asking your assistance took a knock.
We will get back to you, after I have discussed with Ashley.
Thank you.
Alan.
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Roger that.
Hope we can find something :)
Spades
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Evening SPADES.
It is late, but I have finally cracked why I was not finding records and references to what I was seeking. Wellington Independent 23-12-1871 to 6-1-1872 page 3.
Knowing there is no 'OW' in modern Māori spelling I initially searched using both POWHATU and Pōhatu but must have missed searching using POHATU as the spelling.
In the last few minutes, when doing searches using the names of the local watercourses I came upon references to the records I was seeking; plan 85N etc.
The spelling Pohatu having been used.
Tomorrow Ashley and I will discuss the land records that this discovery has lead me to, and we will advise of what further found files we might appreciate your looking up for us.
Thank you for your offer,
Alan.
Adjustment: OOP's late at night and not very precise. What I was meaning was I am not used to seeing a W following an O in the spelling of Maori names. Alan.
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Morning all.
After a lot of searching in an area of NZ I am not familiar with, the attached illustration, along with actual allotment measurements [prior to resurvey done to include the roading provision easements that can be found in the WELLINGTON INDEPENDENT adverts that ran from late December 1871 into January 1872 page 3] gives a partial answer to Ashley and his quest to match up oral family history with records of the period, that can be found in various archives.
Search using POHATU spelling.
As assumed in the little plan initially supplied, the POWHATU West survey as illustrated, shows allotments of 3 to 7 of the survey that saw the land being broken up, and sold by the original Crown grantees.
AND the POWHATU WEST allotments of 1 & 2 having undergone further survey and being re numbered 1, 2 & 3, of former 1 & 2. Unfortunately none of the allotments so far identified are of 10 to 12 acres.
Named title holders: J BAIRD, C COTTLE, J TULLY, Mrs E JONES wife of WPH JONES
E & O E Alan.
PS Image notation correction.
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Wow! Well done, Alan!