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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Llanfihangel on Tuesday 09 December 25 12:08 GMT (UK)

Title: Old Welsh will Gwalter ap Gllm 1588
Post by: Llanfihangel on Tuesday 09 December 25 12:08 GMT (UK)
Hi,
I have obtained a scan of an old Welsh Will from the Library of Wales. It is dated 1588 but is remarkably legible.
However, there are some words I can't decipher and I would really appreeciate your help.
I have made my best shot of deciphering this passage and I would like your experts assistance in deciphering the words identified by my ????? notations
All replies will be gratefully acknowledged!

Thanks!
Llanfi  :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
Title: Re: Old Welsh will Gwalter ap Gllm 1588
Post by: horselydown86 on Tuesday 09 December 25 15:14 GMT (UK)
...in the hand(es) of the undernamed overseers for
iiijor yeres.  It(e)m...

iiijor = quatuor = 4

The tenement given to Thomas appears to be:  Kevenvaese or Kevenuaese

Note that the e at the word end isn't certain.  It could be e, o or just a flourish and not a letter at all.

The tenement given to John appears to be:  tyr John ap R(es) ap John

R(es) is based on the -es brevigraphs on debt(es), good(es) and hand(es).


...my doughters by the hand(es)
of myne overseers. / Overseers How ap R(es) groyne and Richard
ap Rydd

Title: Re: Old Welsh will Gwalter ap Gllm 1588
Post by: horselydown86 on Tuesday 09 December 25 17:45 GMT (UK)
Sorry Llanfi, I forgot the numbers for the debts at the top.

They are iiijli = 4 pounds and iijli = 3 pounds respectively.

I think it's a red herring that li on the first number looks more like lv.
Title: Re: Old Welsh will Gwalter ap Gllm 1588
Post by: Llanfihangel on Tuesday 09 December 25 21:20 GMT (UK)
Hello horselydown 66,
Yes those items match the other clues I have.. There is a place called Kevenworth in Merthyr Cynog, but the reference is 1oo years later. I expect that is the same place. Your help is really appreciated!
Thanks, and all the best for the holiday season (Christmas) and a Happy and Prosperous New year to all in this Forum.
LLanfi
 :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
Title: Re: Old Welsh will Gwalter ap Gllm 1588
Post by: Bookbox on Wednesday 10 December 25 00:33 GMT (UK)
May I suggest that in the penultimate line the first Overseer could be Ho(we)ll ap R(es) gwyne ?
Title: Re: Old Welsh will Gwalter ap Gllm 1588
Post by: horselydown86 on Wednesday 10 December 25 03:45 GMT (UK)
Quote from: Bookbox on Wednesday 10 December 25 00:33 GMT (UK)
May I suggest that in the penultimate line the first Overseer could be Ho(we)ll ap R(es) gwyne ?

Yes, I agree that is correct on both counts.  Sorry, Llanfi.