RootsChat.Com
General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: organicgardener on Sunday 07 December 25 05:47 GMT (UK)
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My grandad Alfred Onions served in WW1 and we always had a brass spill container on the fireside. He always said it was a brass casing that he had made from a shell during WW1 when he was in the army. It had a pointed top and hammered sides. I have tried to find his war records but with no luck. I have bought several but they are not him. He was born in Walsall Staffordshire in 1889 parents John Alfred and Helen Jane nee Thacker. In 1911 he was a waggoner in Wednesfield aged 20. I would love to find out what he did between 1914 and when he married my grandmother in 1920 in Lancashire.
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Unfortunately more than half of WW1 service records were destroyed in a fire at the War Office repository during WW2.
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Thanks for that BumbleB Grandad never talked about where he was or what he did, just the brass spill holder and a couple of medals. There seems to be a lot of records that are lost so I guess we are lucky to have all the census records.
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The medals should have his army number, rank and regiment on them.
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There were 7 Medal Index Cards for Alfred Onions
And One Burnt Attestation Survived but not him
His Five Brothers also probably Served
There are 50 Ancestry Trees for Alfred none found his Military Number
Do you think he didn't talk about the War because it wasn't a pleasant time of his Life
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…..just the brass spill holder and a couple of medals.
Your next step should be to pull out the medals and see what they are, and see what is written on them.
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If he had 2 then it is likely he had the Great War medal and Victory medal. This would indicate that he was not deployed overseas until after 31 Dec 1915 or he would have had a third medal; the 1914 or 1914-15 Star.
In all probability he was in the Army Service Corps as they would have wanted his skills as a waggoner but you will need to check what is on the medals' rims. As a young man then he might be in the Royal Artillery as they also needed lots of men who could handle horses. Of course he may have voluntered for a local infantry regiment.
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Deleted
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2 potentials.
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Thanks for all the information. He had two medals but I don't have them as they were given to the males in the family. The first record seems more like Alfred as I never knew him to drive a car just a bike.
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First record (M2) is Mechanical Transport
Second record (T4) is Horse Transport
And see
https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/50028-prefix-t4-before-army-number/
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Unfortunately there are many candidates of the same name in the Infantry and other Corps so without any regimental number or another fact you are unlikely to find out any more. I am assuming that we can discount the other medal winners with middle initials. Once they are removed and the deceased there are at least a further 2 candidates: one a Royal Engineer and another in the Labour Corps. Unfortunately none of them have surviving service records so there is a limited amount you can find out about them. I found out a lot about my great grandfather's movements through the local newspaper which reported on his enlistment, training and leave to his parents during the war and his demob in 1919. That might be an option if you know where his parents were living.
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I know his parents lived in Rowley Street Walsall Staffordshire as I have all the census records. I will try that. Thanks for helping me. After the war he turned up in Warrington where he met my grandmother Dora Eliza Eckersley.
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Walsall 1918 electoral register (Division 1 voters) has
34a Upper Walhouse Street
Onions, Helen Jane
Onions, John Alfred
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN9-LY3B
Division 2 voters at that address, first three are absent, naval/military voters
Onions, Alfred
Onions,Frank
Onions, Howard
Onions, James Lewis
Onions, John Henry
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN9-LLDF
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WOW thats amazing as the 1911 census shows them all at 40 Rowley Street Walsall.
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Hi
We have an absent voters list!
Alfred Onions at 34a Upper Walhouse Street is
T4/253161 Lce.-Cpl., 1st Co., A.S.C.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN9-L5TL
Plus details for Frank and Howard
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Thats amazing, thank you so much. The family seems to have moved up and down Rowley street for most of the census years, but 34a Upper Walhouse Street is a new one to me. Will have to investigate further !
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So in addition to his medal entitlement you now have a unit. '1st Co' would be 1st Company Horse Transport Army Service Corps was a depot company based in Aldershot. It seems likely that he has been posted back to Aldershot after returning from France as this was depot company that would not leave UK; however it is just the sort of unit he might have been discharged from in 1919.
The rank is Lance Corporal. "Lce - Cpl" This is not the usual abbreviation of LCpl or L/Cpl but is consistent with others on the page.
https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-army-service-corps-in-the-first-world-war/army-service-corps-horse-transport-companies/#trains
I found his medal card on Ancestry but it has no further information other than his name, driver, ASC and number. . As he did not have the star you know that he was not in France until 1 Jan 1916 or later.
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Those medal index cards are free to view on ancestry if you are logged in, Alfred here
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/1262/records/5544018
That Walsall absent voters list I linked to was from Spring 1919, but there is also one for 1918, details for Alfred are the same
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN9-LR7Z
Howard and Frank Onions are still on the AVL in Autumn 1919
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN9-L2J7
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Howard is a sadler in the AVC which is the Army Veterinary Corps. His brother is in the LC which is the Labour Corps.
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Thanks so much for that Alan I have rejoined Ancestry so will investigate more.
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Thanks to all who helped me find my grandads war records, now to check out my dads dad Hugh Challinor and his war records. I have photo's of Hugh and his brothers in army outfits so that is a start. Medal card of Onions, Alfred
Corps Regiment number Rank
Army Service Corps T4/253161 Driver
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Thanks. Also happy to help with the photo if you wish to post it.
Alan
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I have grandads photo of him with his brothers but can't seem to post it on here.
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It is probably too large. Try making it a JPEG?
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It is already a jpeg Alan it says 143 jpeg ! I have found Grandads war records under Huch Challinor instead of Hugh.
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OK see what the size is and what size the site lets you have and then try either cropping it to make it smaller or try a bmp and see if you an get the file data size down to below what the site alows..
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still no picture?
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I have given up on the photo Alan as I have tried to attach the cropped photo with no luck !
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It maybe will not accept the name of the snip. You need to change the name of the photo if you have already tried attaching it. Just add a dash or #.
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Hi Neale, I have tried what you suggested but no luck ! never mind I will just leave it for now. Thanks for your help. Chris.
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The,name of the attachment just be unique WITHIN Roots chat.
I always add my initials to the filename.