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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Essex => Topic started by: Martin17 on Monday 20 October 25 12:16 BST (UK)
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I am trying to find what happened to Eliza Reeve, born 1883 at Great Canfield, Essex.
Eliza was the daughter of Stephen Reeve and Sarah Burton. I have Eliza on the 1891 census as an 8 year old and living with her parents, 1901 as a 17 year old a housemaid domestic at the Old Rectory, Great Canfield. 1911 I have Eliza 28 years old and single, employed as a housemaid domestic for James Lewis Wigan and his wife at Port Arlington, Bournemouth, Eliza is born Great Canfield.
On the 1921 census there is an Eliza Matthews, aged 38 years and 4 months, married, residing with Stephen Reeve, her father at Great Canfield. Eliza is recorded as being employed as home duties and as being born at Great Canfield.
Is this Eliza, his daughter? She is about the right age, not all ages are spot on. To date I can find no marriage for Eliza Reeve to a Mr Matthews from 1910 to 1922.
Any advice or thoughts on the above would be gratefully received.
Regards
Martin17
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I see that on the original form he entered her as his daughter.
This has been crossed out and the word ‘visitor’ added in different handwriting.
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She was buried 24 Jun 1930 St Mary, age 47 abode Cuckoos, Great Canfield
Same address as Burials of Stephen Reeve buried 15 Feb 1927 ad Sarah Reeve buried 24 Mar 1931
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Hi JenB and trish1120
I was in the process of replying to JenB when your reply was coming through so my reply seems to have disappeared. Thank you both for your replies.
JenB was spot of with the daughter crossed out and visitor inserted. I wonder who did the crossing out? I think that Eliza is Stephens daughter, but at this stage can not 100 per cent prove that.
trish1120. I had just found the burial that you mention at Great Canfield, but did not have the Cuckoo's address that you supplied. I know a few of my ancestors resided at Cuckoo's so this almost to me confirms Eliza was his daughter. On the back of that I am still unable to find a marriage for Eliza Reeve and Mr Matthews.
Regards
Martin17
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The handwriting of the word ‘visitor’ is very much like that of the enumerator, which you can see on the address form.
The fact that Stephen entered her as his daughter has to be significant.
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Looking closely at the census image I think her aged reads 38 years 4 months giving a birth year of 1883.
SS
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To date I can find no marriage for Eliza Reeve to a Mr Matthews from 1910 to 1922.
Does it say she is married?
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Hi Milliepede
On the 1921 it states Eliza Matthews is married and living with what I now believe is her father Stephen Reeve, but no sign of Mr Matthews.
I have tried different spellings of Matthews, but to date no marriage found. Eliza is single in 1911.
Regards
Martin17
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There need not necessarily have been a marriage. Maybe Mr Matthews was already married and she simply adopted his surname?
She wouldn’t be the first woman to do this - my mother in law did exactly this in the 1960’s.
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So many possibilities. There is an emigration record of an Eliza Reeve born 1883 in 1914 going to the Cape, South Africa. She is involved with the S A C Society. Wondered if she married Mr Matthews there. He may have died 1914-18 WW!??
SS
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JenB
Thank you for that about not being married. Mr Matthews was not with her on 1921. I will have to check to see if there is a Mr Matthews living locally. Great Canfield is not that big and I will start my search there. I have made an enquiry to see if Eliza had a headstone and to see if any other name was on it.
Regards
Martin17
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Hi Softlly Softly
Thank you for your reply. As you state, so many possibilities, but that would answer why I can not find a marriage. On 1921 she is recorded as being married as opposed to being a widow, that does not mean she is not a widow.
Regards
Martin17
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She was buried 24 Jun 1930 St Mary, age 47 abode Cuckoos, Great Canfield
The only death reg I can see is
June 1930 Chelsea 1a 434
Matthews, Eliza
Age 47
They got the volume number wrong on FreeBMD. They have district as Chelmsford (in italics)
Is it worth getting the digital image? :-\
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Looking at the free indexes to electoral registers on findmypast, no Eliza Matthews (or Mathews) or Eliza Reeve in Great Canfield in the 1920's, or in 1930.
I see that on the original form he entered her as his daughter.
This has been crossed out and the word ‘visitor’ added in different handwriting.
So a daughter, but only visiting her parents at census time. Was she visiting from London? :-\
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That was a very good spot jonwarn. S*ds law though as Anc* is down so cannot check electoral registers
SS
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This might help--369 Fulham Road is Westminster Hospital address.
1930 electoral register @ 25 Caroline Street are John & Nellie Matthews.
SS
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There's a marriage in Q4 1917 between a John Matthews and a Nellie E Reeve. Farnham district vol 2a page 371
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On the 1930 electoral register there are 4 people at 25 Caroline Street, Pimlico, John and Nellie Matthews and Edward Cyril Brewer and Caroline MacDonald
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On the 1930 electoral register there are 4 people at 25 Caroline Street, Pimlico, John and Nellie Matthews and Edward Cyril Brewer and Caroline MacDonald
Also there is a Mary Sharp who is also there in 1921 and appears to have been running it as a boarding house.
This has to be the right person - I wonder why she took on the name Nellie? And why her abode is given as Cuckoos, Great Canfield in the burial register when, according to the death cert it was 25 Caroline Street SW1?
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Taken home to be buried near her parents?
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Taken home to be buried near her parents?
Sorry, I didn't make myself clear, I wondered why, although she'd clearly been taken back 'home' her abode was given as that of her parents rather than where she was actually living in London?
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Well done to SS for getting hold of that death registration.
And to Lizzie for finding a likely marriage.
Martin will be pleased!
Somewhere in 1921 there should be a married John Matthews, but without his wife Eliza/Nellie!
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Yes I see your point now JenB.
Her Father was dead but Mother still alive.
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She had been living with her husband in Pimlico (as on 1930 Electoral register) until she was admitted to hospital where she died, so why not be buried in or near Pimlico? I have cases where a young spinster daughter who died when in service away from home was buried in her home village. But Eliza was a middle aged married woman.
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Thank you to everyone so far who has posted an answer to my enquiry.
I know for a fact that some of my ancestors resided at Cuckoo's, Great Canfield, Essex, so any links to that address would have to be a positive. Great Canfield is a lovely place, but not that many people lived there.
To date, not sure where the forename Nellie comes from. although Eliza's brother James later named one of his children Nellie.
Thank you all once again.
Kind regards
Martin17
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Somewhere in 1921 there should be a married John Matthews, but without his wife Eliza/Nellie!
They married in Farnham in 1917. Could he have been a soldier or civilian horse looker-afterer attached to a cavalry regiment. Farnham is Rd for Aldershot. Had became a groom by 1930. Can't find a suitable married groom in 1921, but maybe had some other job to do with horses.
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She had been living with her husband in Pimlico (as on 1930 Electoral register) until she was admitted to hospital where she died, so why not be buried in or near Pimlico? I have cases where a young spinster daughter who died when in service away from home was buried in her home village. But Eliza was a middle aged married woman.
Someone who died in Pimlico in 1930 would, I’m fairly sure, have been buried in one of the big cemeteries towards the edge of London such as Hanwell.
Perhaps her family preferred to have her buried in her home village rather than a huge London cemetery?
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I have made an enquiry to the church warden at Great Canfield Church to see if there is a headstone for Eliza and if so, if she is the only name mentioned on it. I am awaiting his reply.
Regards
Martin17
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In 1921 there's a John Matthews*, Stud Groom, in Englefield Green (near Egham)
Says he is married.
Age 39 years and 9 months.
Born Great Takeley (says London in the index!)
One of many servants at Park Close. Head is a chap called Urban Hanlon Broughton.
Great Takeley is in Essex and is virtually next door to Great Canfield!
Could this be Eliza's husband? :-\
*Mathews with one t in the index.
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In 1921 there's a John Matthews, Stud Groom, in Englefield Green (near Egham)
Says he is married.
Age 39 years and 9 months.
Born Great Takeley (says London in the index!)
One of many servants at Park Close. Head is a chap called Urban Hanlon Broughton.
Great Takeley is in Essex and is virtually next door to Great Canfield!
Could this be Eliza's husband? :-\
That looks very likely. Urban H Broughton became 1st Baron Fairhaven and owned Anglesey Abbey in Cambs (OH is a volunteer there). He bought AA due to its proximity to Newmarket for the races
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Info until proved incorrect.
1921 census records John aged 39y 9m = c1882/3 born Takeley, Essex
1891 census
James Matthews Head Widower 45 Farm labourer b Hatfield Broad Oak, Essex
William Matthews Brother Widower 43 Farm labourer b Hatfield Broad Oak, Essex
James Matthews Son - 11 Scholar b Takeley, Essex
John Matthews Son - 8 Scholar b Takeley, Essex
births
MATTHEWS, HENRY JAMES ROBINSON
GRO Reference: 1880 J Quarter in DUNMOW UNION Volume 04A Page 503
MATTHEWS, WILLIAM JOHN ROBINSON
GRO Reference: 1882 D Quarter in DUNMOW UNION Volume 04A Page 517
Deaths Mar 1884
Matthews Maria aged 30 Dunmow 4a 297
Marriages Sep 1874
Matthews James B. Stortford 3a 339
ROBINSON Maria B. Stortford 3a 339
SS
added--in 1901 both James and John are " Horse" Hay Carters in Takeley.
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Softly Softly, Jon Warrn and LizzieL
Wow, that is some piece of detective work from all three of you. I am sure that John Mat(t)hews that you have highlighted is our man. Having lived in the area, I know that Great Canfield and Takeley are neighbouring areas. It all seems to fit. I will be chasing all this up.
Once again, a big thank you.
Regards
Martin17
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His exact dob 19th September 1882.
MATTHEWS, WILLIAM JOHN ROBINSON
GRO Reference: 1882 D Quarter in DUNMOW UNION Volume 04A Page 517
SS
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I am sure that John Mat(t)hews that you have highlighted is our man.
Just a personal opinion - I’d want to see the marriage certificate :D
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I am sure that John Mat(t)hews that you have highlighted is our man.
Just a personal opinion - I’d want to see the marriage certificate :D
That would answer a lot of questions I agree.
SS
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Being an Essex man myself (albeit from the metropolitan part now in London) and always having been interested in the history of England's greatest county, suddenly into my head popped The Hermit of Great Canfield!
I did have a book about him, probably it's still around somewhere in the house.
Googling him and up he pops - Jimmy Mason.
He seems to have been well acquainted with the Reeve family, Eliza must have known him!
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I too am an Essex man from a pretty rural area and like jonwarrn must also say it’s the best county.
SS
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I agree that the marriage certificate would confirm or deny if I have the right couple.
My mother grew up in Great Canfield and I believe as a young girl she knew Jimmy Mason, known as " The Hermit" locally. I bought Mum the book about Jimmy Mason, some years ago, Mum gets a mention, but by a changed name. My grandfather visited Jimmy on various occasions. The book written by Raleigh Trevelyan.
Regards
Martin17
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England's greatest county,
it’s the best county.
Situated close to the banks of the mighty River Tyne and looking out at the hills of Northumberland I have to say that you've both got it wrong!
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England's greatest county,
it’s the best county.
Situated close to the banks of the mighty River Tyne and looking out at the hills of Northumberland I have to say that you've both got it wrong!
Now the fun starts. ;D
SS
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Have a look through the newspapers online to see if you can find any details about the wedding.
Nesta