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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: Varleyhaggart on Sunday 24 August 25 13:45 BST (UK)
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I’m wondering if anybody can help me work my way back from Phoebe Wright who married John Woods in Liverpool. There’s so many Woods/wrights/James/Johns that I’m at a total dead end!
Marriage: 11 Feb 1877 All Saints, Liverpool, Lancs.
John Woods - 24 Labourer Bachelor of 66 Buckingham St
Phoebe Wright - (X), 21 Spinster of 18 Buckingham St
Groom's Father: William Woods, Cab Driver
Bride's Father: William Henry Wright, Carter
Witness: Richard Woods; Elizabeth Kenny, (X)
I believe this is their marriage…
I noticed that there is ELIZABETH KENNY as a witness…
I saw a marriage between a WILLIAM KENNY WRIGHT and ELLEN ROBINSON 1842 LIVERPOOL
I’m unsure if this is correct and I’m unable to see if there was any connection to the name KENNY past these two things…the name past this seems to be WILLIAM HENRY WRIGHT
I believe this ELLEN WRIGHT if correct, passed away in 1864 LIVERPOOL.
This family had came up in another post I did regarding the HESKETH family, but it started to get too confusing with the different names and such. So I’m trying to isolate the families in these posts to make it easier for myself and future family members!
Any input would be greatly appreciated as I’m giving myself a headache and getting nowhere :)
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My maternal side is Wright so I know the problems😂
If she is the Phoebe Wright b 1855 then her mothers maiden name was Robinson
If she is the 1857 birth her mmn was Kenyon
The 1842 marriage was William Henry - not William Kenny
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This looks like a strong candidate for Phoebe in 1861
1861 No 2, 2 court, Gt Oxford Street, Liverpool
William H Wright, carter and Helen his wife, with 3 children including ‘Pheabe’, 5
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This looks like a strong candidate for Phoebe in 1861
1861 No 2, 2 court, Gt Oxford Street, Liverpool
William H Wright, carter and Helen his wife, with 3 children including ‘Pheabe’, 5
The ELLEN WRIGHT I found that died in 1864 address was GREAT OXFORD STREET
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This looks to be the same couple in 1851:
Liverpool St Martin
ED 1h
piece 2176
folio 278
page 45
schedule no. 161
in which case Helen was aka Ellen and there are Robinson in-laws present
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Did Phoebe remarry 24.12.1899 to William Henry Mayor?
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Did Phoebe remarry in 1890 to William Henry Mayor?
I believe she did yes!
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The 1842 marriage was William Henry - not William Kenny
Is that if you read the original? Bcos on FAMILYSEARCH it’s listed as WILLIAM KENNY…but I know from experience that what it says and what you read aren’t always the same! And I haven’t been able to see the original!
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William ‘Kenny’ looks like a mistranscription to me: it is clearly Henry in the signature on the 1842 marriage.
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Typo on re-marriage of Phoebe - should be 1899 - amended in reply
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Alan, With the info you provided, it looks as though Robinson for a maiden name would be most possible I think?
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Yes, I think everything points to that.
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William Henry Wright & Ellen Robinson married 8.8.1842 @ St Nicholas Liverpool
His father was also William & both Williams occs are shown as Carter
Ellen’s father was John - occ looks like brush maker
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Fantastic! Was there names of witnesses at all?
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1841 - parents William & Elizabeth - both Williams are Carters. Ages were rounded down to the nearest 5 yrs in 1841 so William was between 15-19yrs old
Piece 557 book 9 folio 22
Will check for witnesses
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There was an ELLEN ROBINSON born 1822 LIVERPOOL to JOHN ROBINSON and ELLEN JONES
Apparently ELLEN JONES was the daughter of THOMAS JONES and PHEBE
This is according to a tree on FAMILYSEARCH
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Best sort William out first before moving on to Ellen. Word of caution - always check any info yourself that you find on another persons tree
1842 marriage - Witnesses were Richard Tout?? - can’t decipher surname but definitely not Wright or Robinson. Other witness was Eliza Williams
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The 1822 baptism for Ellen Robinson shows her father John was a brushmaker. No maiden name on the record for her mother Ellen
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1841 - all b in county
John Robinson 55 brushmaker
Ellen 50
Peter 5 grandson
Piece 555 book 9 folio 26 page 45
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:)
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Phoebe in 1901
William H Mayor 44 Head
Phoebe Mayor 44 Wife
Annie Mayor 22 Daughter-in-law
John Mayor 18 Son
Elizabeth Mayor 14 Daughter
Hugh Mayor 12 Son
William H Mayor 3 Grandson
William H Woods 20 Stepson (Step Son)
Richard Woods 18 Stepson (Step Son)
Jane Woods 15 Stepdaughter (Step Daughter)
Ann Moran 19 Visitor
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Phoebe in 1901
William H Mayor 44 Head
Phoebe Mayor 44 Wife
Annie Mayor 22 Daughter-in-law
John Mayor 18 Son
Elizabeth Mayor 14 Daughter
Hugh Mayor 12 Son
William H Mayor 3 Grandson
William H Woods 20 Stepson (Step Son)
Richard Woods 18 Stepson (Step Son)
Jane Woods 15 Stepdaughter (Step Daughter)
Ann Moran 19 Visitor
Phoebe married twice. First marriage to JOHN WOODS 1915
Her sister ANN also married a MAYOR
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Best sort William out first before moving on to Ellen. Word of caution - always check any info yourself that you find on another persons tree
Agreed! I’ve been lead down that before before!
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There is a WILLIAM HENRY WOODS born 1822 LIVERPOOL ST NICHOLAS to WILLIAM WOODS and ELIZABETH no maiden name
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Ignore my last post…I started to confuse myself again ???
Regarding JOHN WOODS/PHEOBE WRIGHT…when they married JOHNS father was WILLIAM WOODS ( CART DRIVER )
In 1861 there is a
WILLM WOODS 35
HEAD
MARRIED
CART DRIVER
ROONEY STREET
BORN BOOTLE
MARIA WOODS 33
MARRIED
WIFE
ROONEY STREET
BORN DOWLES, MONMOUTHSHIRE
Same couple in 1871
WILLIAM WOODS 45
MARRIED
HEAD
CAR DRIVER
BORN KIRKDALE, LANCASHIRE
MARIA WOODS 44
WIFE
BORN METHYR, NORTH WALES
WILLIAM was head both times but I can’t see who else was in the household
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For both of those Woods entries (1861 Rooney Street; 1871 River View?) there are no others in the household.
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That’s frustrating…I’m still unable to locate a birth for John. Perhaps he went by a different name or was born outside of Liverpool :(
Also a marriage between WILLIAM and MARIA is proving difficult…
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1871 census
“cellar under 18 Buckingham Street” [the address that Phoebe Wright gives at her wedding]
William Henry Wright, widower, 50, waggon driver, b Liverpool (also everyone below)
William Henry Wright, son, 20, [v faint, possibly ditto marks for occupation]
Julia Wright, 15, daughter, housekeeper
Sarah Helen Wright, 11, daughter, scholar
Julia Wright 15 is possibly Phoebe. I can find various records for the son and the other daughter, but nothing at all for this Julia.
In 1871, all of the houses in Buckingham Street seem to be recorded as separate households at the main address and at the cellar address.
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Thank you Alan!
I wasn’t aware of SARAH ELLEN I thought I had found a MARY ELLEN who possibly married WILLIAM MCMINN….perhaps there’s multiple families in looking at here…
And I have never seen JULIA so maybe you’re right about the possibility of it being PHOEBE ???
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Regarding the WOODS couple I previously posted, there is this couple in 1881…
JOHN WOODS ( not William? )
57
BORN LIVERPOOL
IRON MOULDER ( different occ )
MARY WOODS ( not Maria? )
54
BORN DENBIGHSHIRE WALES
The births somewhat match up, MARY/MARIA being from WALES somewhat matches up ( the town previously mentioned is a southern town even tho it was listed as NORTH WALES. Could easily be a transcribe mistake of MERIONETHSHIRE ? )
I’m still unsure if the previous census I posted are even the right people to begin with…there’s never any children listed and I’m unable to find a marriage unfortunately ???
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Using the same search of BUCKINGHAM STREET 1871 but changing the name to WOODS.
I saw a family with parents from ARMAGH IRELAND children from LIVERPOOL. No names matched up.
Same family in 1881 are all said to be born in LIVERPOOL.
If they’re relatives maybe JOHN WOODS side where from IRELAND.
Long shot but something to think about
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1861
MARIA WOODS 33
MARRIED
WIFE
ROONEY STREET
BORN DOWLES, MONMOUTHSHIRE
1871
MARIA WOODS 44
WIFE
BORN METHYR, NORTH WALES
I'd suggest Maria came from Dowlais / Merthyr Tydfil in South Wales.
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When JOHN WOODS married PHEOBE WRIGHT in 1877 and stated his father was WILLIAM WOODS ( CART DRIVER )
Realistically there’s two possibilities I can see…
One born in 1811 on the 1851 census ( Litherland )
And one born 1826 on the 1871 census ( Kirkdale )
The one born 1826 makes most sense to me time frame wise, but that doesn’t really mean anything bcos WILLIAM could quite easily have been older…
Since posting this thread ive been looking and looking but I can’t link JOHN WOODS to either of them…hopefully somebody will see this at some point and have better luck than me ???