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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: dymondm on Wednesday 09 July 25 11:31 BST (UK)
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My GF was born in Poole, Dorset in April of either 1876 or 1877 – baptised in Llanaber, north-west Wales in July 1877. Given his parents were Hawkers, is it feasible at that period they could or would have travelled the 200+ miles when he was just a few weeks old, if born April 1877, or is it more likely he was born April 1876? Presume as Hawkers they would have travelled on horseback/pony and cart? Train? Appreciate any thoughts.
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A man and his wife could easily stroll ten miles every morning carrying goods and baby.
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Even further in a day with horse and cart.
Have you checked for a birth reg GRO?
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What was his name?
Have you the parents names or just occupation of hawker.
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Given the occupation and the uncertainty of the year, the earlier date would seem more likely. A birth record is clearly the thing to look for. Poole and Llanaber are both near the coast, so a coasting vessel might be another possibility - more likely than train IMHO ?
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There was also the railway, there wasn’t a direct route but lots of small connecting railways.
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Thanks all for comments. My GF was Frank Dymond (Titanic survivor); none of his parents eight children were registered at birth although some birth dates/years were given in various places, e.g. Royal Navy records for Frank and a brother, death record for a two-year old sister, although how reliable they are is not always easy to judge. As Hawkers, my GGPs moved a lot around the west of England and Wales and I have a good timeline for much of their life – e.g. they were in Exeter in 1871 (Census), Poole where Frank was born in Apr 1876 or 7, Llanaber (parish, so probably lived in Barmouth) by Jul 1877 (baptism) where they stayed until at least Aug 1879 (baptism of brother), Gloucester by Jun 1880 (birth of brother), Wrexham by Apr 1881 (Census), and in Bristol by May 1883 (court report) – however they were travelling, they were certainly mobile. All places on existing train network (Barmouth station just opened in 1867) and all ports (although Barmouth by this time was a fading boat-building centre) so either of those options possible, as well as horse. Maybe a mix of modes as they needed.
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Does that 1881 census entry help with the age ? It should be accurate although it will only be the number the parents quoted ... but if it's April it will be uncomfortably near the birthday.
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He is listed as 4 in 1881
Baptism 21 July 1877
Find a grave - if he died in Southampton 19 Jun 1947 - has birth 1 Apr 1876
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He is listed as 4 in 1881 - Baptism 21 July 1877
Find a grave - if he died in Southampton 19 Jun 1947 - has birth 1 Apr 1876
The 1881 census was on April 3rd, so if that is correct one might suppose the parents had just celebrated a birthday ;) But a gravestone is quite likely to be a year out, when people were commonly referred to as 'in their 82nd year' meaning they were actually 81.
I have found someone in the 1939 Register born on 1 October 1880, while the birth had been registered on that day in 1878. People usually remembered their birthday but had very occasional need to know which year it was in !
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Andrew, that is so true. These days it seems that we have to mention our birthday on just about every form we ever fill in on the internet, but up until perhaps 30 years ago it was a very rare occurrence.
Zaph
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Blame the NHS! They looked at the 1939 register or made a record when you were born, then that is the first question they ask every time you turn up for treatment. They need to check they have the right person - were mistakes made previously?
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While we may not be able to say precisely how fast a hawker would have travelled back then, we can give an absolute upper bound ~3x10^8 m/s. Could not have been faster than that.
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Is Frank‘a birth possibly registered in his mmn as they did not marry until sq 1877
SS
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While we may not be able to say precisely how fast a hawker would have travelled back then, we can give an absolute upper bound ~3x10^8 m/s. Could not have been faster than that.
I think the implied question was whether a 'hawker' - by virtue of the occupation - would be able to travel as fast as better-off members of the public ?