RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: Pennines on Sunday 08 June 25 15:03 BST (UK)
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Hello Everyone,
I wonder if anyone can find an Elizabeth (or Betty) Holt after the 1871 Census please.
Details;
Baptised in 1794, Preston as Elizabeth Slater.
First marriage 1814, Preston - to Thomas Whalley (shown as Waller)
Second marriage 1830, Preston - to Christopher Parker.
She had children from her first 2 marriages (along with an illegitimate one in between!) As a result her children are named Whalley - then Parker.
Third marriage 1844, Preston to James Holt. No children.
1851 Census - Betty Holt living at 2, 'Whalley' Square, Preston - shown as married, but husband James Holt, living separately on 'Whalley' Square.
1861 Census - Elizabeth 'Hoult' Widow, shown as aged 67 at 7, 'Walley's' Square, Preston.
1871 Census - Elizabeth Holt - shown as aged 80, at 1, Whalley Square.
I cannot find her on the 1881 Census - nor can I see a likely death, under any variant of her name.
Just hoping that a fresh pair of eyes can embarrass me and find this frustrating lady please.
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Is she living with anyone in 1871 or on her lonesome?
No obvious death 1871-1881 is there :-\ There's an Elizabeth Hall 83 died Preston 1875 in case the name was written wrong but lots of Hall's so very tenuous.
Not buried with James Holt I take it.
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Hi Milliepede - in 1871 she is alone, at 1, Whalley Square, Preston - shown as Elizabeth Holt aged 80 - occupation 'Keeps Mangle'!! (The occupation made me laugh - but in 1841 she had been a 'Mangle Keeper' as well!)
Thank you for looking at this query.
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I wonder if she went to live with a relative in another area and died there but still can't find her.
Have you ruled out her being with any of her children in 1881? More likely she had died I think but you never know.
Keeps Mangle that is an odd one! Obviously very fond of it to keep it that long.
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Yes. I agree - I had thought that she may be living with one of her children.
To be honest, I hadn't wanted to face that - she had 4 named Whalley and 3 surviving ones named Parker.
I really cannot find a death under her current name of Holt - so do suspect I will have to explore the children in 1881 unfortunately. This means finding the female marriages first (oh joy!).
(Regarding the Mangle - you can imagine it being VERY rusty after 30 years, if it was the same one).
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I did have a brief look in 1881 for the children she was with on one census, mixture of Parker and Whalley names, but she wasn’t there.
Abraham Parker was married by then if I recall and Richard Whalley had died before 1881.
Back to the mangle I remember my Gran having one and helping her turn it on wash day.
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She was still alive and at 7 Whalley-square 1874; there is a piece in the newspaper about some stolen sheets, Preston Herald 10 January 1874.
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Oh thank you SO much.
Milliepede - yes - it was Abraham Parker I followed back to Elizabeth. He ended up in the Workhouse and died in the Asylum. This family have been so difficult from my friend's grandmother backwards.
(I remember my Mum having a Mangle when I was a child. How times have changed.)
Willsy - great find about the newspaper article!! I am so grateful.
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Thanks Penines, hoped it would narrow down a few dates for you.
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7 Whalley-square 1874
Can we find that address in 1881 just to check who was living there? Or check Whalley Square in general as she seems to have lived there for a number of years.
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1881 - 7 Whalley Square - William and Margaret Bagnall with their son Frank
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Yes - I searched Whalley Square in 1881 and she wasn't anywhere on it. She is still a flippin' mystery.
Prior to living on Whalley Square - she had been on Bridge Lane and Marsh Lane, which both ran along the bottom of that Square.
Hence she had been in that area for decades.
Willsy - that article about the stolen sheet was pretty amazing. The thief of that sheet was given 7 years penal servitude!!
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This burial has been on my mind whilst searching the deaths and ages for an Elizabeth Holt and thought better to leave this link than kick myself later!
Having not been able to pinpoint a death or census, I wondered about this death
Elizabeth Holt Oldham Q3 1880 age 87
which has a burial record online for Greenacres Cemetery,
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01tt9/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01tt8/
I think the address is Bower St. but I'm not absolutely sure; hope it was ok to add despite the area.
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Willsy!!!
You absolute star! I ordered the digital copy of the death you found in Oldham and it WAS the correct Elizabeth Holt. She was described as the widow of James Holt (correct!)
In addition, the death was registered by her son in law, Abraham James - who was living with Elizabeth's family in 1841 AND married Elizabeth's daughter, Margaret Whalley that same year.
Also - Abraham James and wife, Margaret, were witnesses when Elizabeth married James Holt in 1844.
I cannot thank you enough - it's been driving me crackers (it didn't have far to go!!) - and whilst I hadn't held out much hope that she would have died in Oldham - I thought it worth checking.
Let joy be unconfined! Thank you SO very much for your time and your help.
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Pennines
Thank you so much for your kind words, made my day and I am really pleased it was your Elizabeth.
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Not as pleased as I was, Willsy!
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Excellent work, am pleased she has been found :)
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Thank you Milliepede and for the time and interest you took in trying to help with this mysterious lady.
She was a tough cookie - 3 marriages - lost 2 husbands very young and separated from her 3rd! Yet made it to 87.
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Gives me hope in conclusively finding my tough cookie one day. You just know they are somewhere and the fact the death for Elizabeth had such great confirmation of who she was is a bonus. I was afraid if she died on her own the informant would be unknown and you would be none the wiser.
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Milliepede - you need to put your query on Rootschat.
You never know Willsy may see it!! (No pressure Willsy!!)
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Oh I have done! Many years ago now but nothing I was able to conclusively prove was him.
I can look for it again if you’d like a nosey at it now your Elizabeth is done and dusted!
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Nothing ventured - nothing gained, Milliepede!