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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Sally4x on Sunday 11 May 25 22:16 BST (UK)

Title: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Sally4x on Sunday 11 May 25 22:16 BST (UK)
I have a Florence Hall born in London on 14th May 1883. I haven't been able to find her birth record. Florence marries a Thomas Moore on 30th May 1909 at St Mary in Haggerston. Her father is named as Henry Philip Hall and I think it says he is a traveller. I can find a Henry Philip Hall who is born in 1865 and died in Shoreditch in 1929, but I haven't been able to find a marriage for him or him on a census after his marriage. I was hoping I could trace Florence that way, but haven't been able to. I would really appreciate any help with this. Thanks!
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Kay99 on Monday 12 May 25 04:16 BST (UK)
Were Florence and husband William Thomas Moore living in Staffordshire in 1921 with Florence's mother Jane Hall widow - 67 born Highbury??

Sorry for  the mistake
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Kay99 on Monday 12 May 25 05:19 BST (UK)
I found the death cert of Jane Hall in 1923 on the GRO but can't post the image on this board

Jane Hall 23 Jan 1923 Walsall Hospital Age 67 - Widow of Henry Phillip Hall Commercial Traveller (Tobaccco) Registered by daughter Florence Hall

Added - However I can't find a marriage or the family in the census  :-\
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: ShaunJ on Monday 12 May 25 11:54 BST (UK)
Quote
Were Florence and husband William Moore living in Staffordshire in 1921 with Florence's mother Jane Hall widow - 67 born Highbury??

Florence's husband was Thomas and he is Thomas in the 1921 census

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBC%2F1921%2FRG15%2F13200%2F0461&parentid=GBC%2F1921%2FRG15%2F13200%2F0461%2F08

Florence aged 38 years and one month (tallies), born St Georges, London.



Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: gc1 on Monday 12 May 25 12:33 BST (UK)
Florence Hall marriage on Family Search ???

Name   Florence Hall
Event Type   Marriage
Event Date   1909
Event Place   Shoreditch, London, England
Registration District   Shoreditch
Page   99
Volume   1C
Affiliate Line Number   264
Registration Quarter   Apr-May-Jun
Registration Year   1909
Possible Spouse   Thomas Moore

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2DNG-G9B?lang=en
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: gc1 on Monday 12 May 25 12:38 BST (UK)
Henry Philip Hall birth 1864 not 1865 on Family Search

Name   Henry Philip Hall
Event Type   Birth Registration
Event Date   1864
Event Place   Pancras, London, England
Registration District   Pancras
Page   120
Volume   1B
Affiliate Line Number   113
Registration Quarter   Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration Year   1864

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2XM8-GTG?lang=en


Edit: and dearth that states DoB as 1865 (Estimated)   
Name   Henry P Hall
Age   64
Birth Year (Estimated)   1865
Event Type   Death
Event Date   1929
Event Place   London, England, United Kingdom
Event Place (Original)   London
Page Number   99
Volume   1C

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV41-3GWP?lang=en

Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: ciderdrinker on Monday 12 May 25 12:48 BST (UK)
Hi
1901 census 125 Shepperton Road London
Jane Hall widow 44 infant millner Shoreditch
Florence 19 book folder and pattern card maker Islington.


The Henry Phillip Hall you mention is with his family on the censuses till 1881.
he seems to marry  Ellen Emily Bishop Mar 1886 St Pancras

1891 32 Camden Passage Islington
Henry Hall 26 carman and Ellen 27 Devizies Wiltshire

1901 Cropley St Shoreditch
Henry P Hall 36 stoker St Pancras
Ellen E 37 Devizies.

The 1911 census says they had no children .
Henry Phillip hall remarries at St Pauls Clerkenwell 17.8.1924 Elizabeth Belcher widow father Daniel Richardson dec lab.
His father Alfred a printer.

So I'm thing Henry P Hall may be her father but it doesn't look as though he married Jane .But of course there could be another Henry P Hall out there.
Where are Florence and Jane 1891?

Ciderdrinker
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: softly softly on Monday 12 May 25 12:48 BST (UK)
Needs further research but a strong possible.

In 1891 London Electoral register living at 93, Tabernacle Street, Hoxton, Hackney there lives a Henry Philip Hall.

1891 census 243 204 19    -  93, Tabernacle Street, Shoreditch, London & Middlesex, England

Jane   Hall   Head   Married   Female   37   1854   Living on her own means   London, Middlesex,
Annie   Hall   Daughter   -   Female   8   1883   -   London, Middlesex, England

The dates of the 2 occupants match nicely for Jane & Florence.

SS
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: ShaunJ on Monday 12 May 25 12:54 BST (UK)
Another possibility in the 1901 census:

31 St John's Road, Shoreditch:

Jane Hall, wife, 41, born Hackney
Florence Hall, daur, 18, cigar worker, born Newington
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: gc1 on Monday 12 May 25 12:56 BST (UK)
 Deleted Wrong DoB Sorry
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: ciderdrinker on Monday 12 May 25 13:12 BST (UK)
Great find Softly ,it really does fit with census and Electoral register.
Brill

Ciderdrinker
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: softly softly on Monday 12 May 25 14:12 BST (UK)
Just trying to narrow down birth for Florence/Florence Annie/Annie. 1939dob 14.5.1883

1891 pob Southwark
1901 pob Newington
1911 pob London
1921 pob St George's

3 of the pob's suggest South of the Thames, with a possible registration district of St Saviour, Southwark.

SS
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: ShaunJ on Monday 12 May 25 15:45 BST (UK)
Quote
In 1891 London Electoral register living at 93, Tabernacle Street, Hoxton, Hackney there lives a Henry Philip Hall.

He's listed there 1890 to 1898.
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: ShaunJ on Monday 12 May 25 16:07 BST (UK)
This birth is a possibility

HALL, FLORENCE       mmn DOWNES 
GRO Reference: 1883  J Quarter in BETHNAL GREEN  Volume 01C  Page 196
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Sally4x on Monday 12 May 25 16:15 BST (UK)
Thanks! I did find the other marriages for Henry Philip Hall which I had confused me even more. This is all really helpful. Florence was the mother of my great aunt. The Walsall death makes sense because that is where my family ended up. I’ll order some birth certificates.
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Kay99 on Monday 12 May 25 16:23 BST (UK)
I think this baptism relates to the 1883 birth in Bethnal Green.  The parents married in 1857

Florence Hall
Baptism Date   27 May 1893
Baptism Place   Saint Jude, Bethnal Green: Old Bethnal Green Road, Tower Hamlets, Tower Hamlets,
Father   Robert Hall
Mother   Maria Hall
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Sally4x on Monday 12 May 25 17:23 BST (UK)
So if Jane never married Henry Philip Hall, Florence's birth could have been registered with Jane's maiden name.
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: softly softly on Monday 12 May 25 17:40 BST (UK)
Between JQ & SQ 1883 there ere 26 Florence births in St Saviour reg district. Only 2 had no mmn recorded. These 2 can be accounted for and not your Florence. There were 5 Florence Annies in same period and they can all be accounted for. Not yet done the exercise with Annies yet.

SS
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Sally4x on Monday 12 May 25 22:01 BST (UK)
Are there then two Henry Philip Halls? And the one I found is wrong? Their jobs are certainly different.
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: softly softly on Tuesday 13 May 25 14:59 BST (UK)
Spent a little time searching the 4 Henry Philip Hall born between 1857-1868.

1. 1857 Reg dist Chertsey mmn Brooke (should read Brooker. He appears with parents James Anthony & Susannah in 1871/81 census and by 1900 is with parents and siblings in Cambridge Ward 4, Middlesex, Massachusetts.

------------------

2. 1864 Reg Dist Bromyard mmn Lawrence (should be Lawrance) With parents Henry & Maria in 1871/81. He marries Rhoda Rogers 1888 Fulham
Dau Elizabeth born 1888-1888
Son David Samuel born 1890-1890

1891 ref 36 155 35

dau Rosetta Mary born 7.6.1893

1901 ref 1627 116 31

Cannot find any of them after 1901 census.

----------------------

3. 1868 reg district Bromley--mmn Stratton

Sadly dies 1881 Bromley aged 12.

_________________

4. 1864 Reg Dist Pancras mmn Robson. His mmn varies between Robson & Robertson . Parents Alfred & Annie Edith Robertson

Details known for him in 1871/81 and then marriages and death. Except for 1921
__________________

Number 2 needs further research.

SS
Title: Re: Florence Hall born London 1883
Post by: Sally4x on Tuesday 13 May 25 17:19 BST (UK)
Thanks  - I did as well and Henry Philip number 2 is in Aston Warwickshire with his parents on the 1881 census. He is a glazier like his father. After he marries in 1888 in Fulham he is in Hammersmith on the 1891 census working for an ironmonger.

Henry Philip number 4 seems to be the best option because he is also in the right area of London.

Neither of them are travelling and selling tobacco though. Of course Jane could have put an entirely made up name down on the birth certificate, but if Henry Philip Hall is correct I am thinking it is number 4.

I hate it when I never manage to get all the answers, but thanks for all the help.