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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: gnorman on Wednesday 02 April 25 11:15 BST (UK)
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Hi everyone,
I have a relative named Abraham Entwistle born in Oldham on 26th May 1877. Abraham was in and out of prison for petty theft, drunken fighting, living on prostitution and neglect of his family.
Rootschat members have helped me in the past to look into his history but I have a new query. The 1921 census lists him again as being in prison in Cheetham, Manchester. By this time his wife Annie, has died (at a work house in Stockport on 27th Nov 1918). The Census lists Abraham as married rather than widower so he must have married again, this is also confirmed by his children's record. The census says he has 6 children aged under 16. These are listed as being aged 3, 7, 8, 10, 11 & 12.
I am aware that Annie and Abraham had 4 children; Abraham b.1902 (on 1921 aged 19), Mark b.1909 (12), Annie Hannah b. 1911 (10) & Theresa b. 1912 (9). This would match roughly with the first 3 but the last 3, and their mother remain a mystery.
I have Annie & Theresa on the 1921 Census living at 15 Fogg Street in Stockport but nothing for the boys or the other children. I have nothing for Abraham either after 1921.
Could anyone see anything that may lead to Abraham after 1921, the fate of his first 4 children, who his 2nd wife may be or his other three children please?
Thanks for your time, Luke
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His YoB varies on different docs (1867 or 1877) - census, prison records or 1873, 1867 in newspaper.
There is a death reg
Abraham Entwistle, Mar Qtr 1926, Manchester North, age 59 (YoB c.1867)
Raised an eyebrow when I saw "Toerag" but certainly justified.
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Abraham and Annie married in 1907 :-\
The 1911 has Abraham bn 1909 and Mark 1910
ENTWISTLE, ABRAHAM mmn LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1908 J Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 673
ENTWISTLE, MARK mmn LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1909 D Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 574
ENTWISTLE, ANNIE LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1911 S Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 1110
ENTWISTLE, THERESA LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1912 D Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 1080
ENTWISTLE, JENNIE LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1916 S Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 918
ENTWISTLE, AGNES LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1918 S Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 08A Page 115
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Rootschat members have helped me in the past to look into his history but I have a new query. The 1921 census lists him again as being in prison in Cheetham, Manchester. By this time his wife Annie, has died (at a work house in Stockport on 27th Nov 1918). The Census lists Abraham as married rather than widower so he must have married again, this is also confirmed by his children's record. The census says he has 6 children aged under 16. These are listed as being aged 3, 7, 8, 10, 11 & 12.
I am aware that Annie and Abraham had 4 children; Abraham b.1902 (on 1921 aged 19), Mark b.1909 (12), Annie Hannah b. 1911 (10) & Theresa b. 1912 (9). This would match roughly with the first 3 but the last 3, and their mother remain a mystery.
I think you mean 4 and 2 children.
It looks as though Annie died after the birth of the last child
Deaths Dec 1918
Entwistle Annie age 34 Stockport 8a 116
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Could this be his next marriage
Marriage Jun qtr 1919
Entwistle, Abraham (spouse Ferris)
Ferris, Ethel M
Stockport RD 8a 187
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As Rosie highlights firstborn son Abraham was registered 1908
There is a likely in Lancs as nephew to Ellen Duffy, widow. Ellen looks likely sister of Abraham snr. (1891 census)
1921 - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/63150/records/27488092
Cas
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Likely Mark is with a foster mother under Stockport board of Guardians. Age would fit, pob is Stockport. There is not a birth for another in area for year +/- 2 only in Oldham.
1921 - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/63150/records/2563802
Going back on census page there are a number of children in her care.
Possible 1939 in Lincolnshire, unmarried, gives birthdate transcribed as 27 Feb 1908 Image is 27 Sept 1908 same as baptism but out by 1 year- with Annie bapt same page
Bapt - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/62472/records/1044139
Cas
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Possible death
ENTWISTLE, JENNIE age 5
GRO Reference: 1920 M Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 08A Page 66
Possible 1921 for Agnes age 3 b Stockport at Shaw Heath (Ward) think this is Stockport Workhouse/hospital. Many mentally ill there. Transcribed as Enlwistle, has both parents alive, but could be error.
Cas
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His YoB varies on different docs (1867 or 1877) - census, prison records or 1873, 1867 in newspaper.
There is a death reg
Abraham Entwistle, Mar Qtr 1926, Manchester North, age 59 (YoB c.1867)
Raised an eyebrow when I saw "Toerag" but certainly justified.
Thank you Hanes, I bought a digital copy of the death you've suggested. It could be him but I think it needs more investigation. He is listed as a Foundry Labourer. The witness is A Entwistle, son, living at 13 Anthony St, West Gorton. It could be his eldest, Abraham.
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Abraham and Annie married in 1907 :-\
The 1911 has Abraham bn 1909 and Mark 1910
ENTWISTLE, ABRAHAM mmn LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1908 J Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 673
ENTWISTLE, MARK mmn LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1909 D Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 574
Rosie, I have also bought the birth certificates for Jennie and Agnes. Jennie is correct, she was born at another family address. I need to look further into Agnes' as it doesnt yet fit as easily.
As far as the census goes in 1921, it mentions 6 children under 16, Abraham is over 16 at the time so he wouldnt count. That would leave one more child unaccounted for.
ENTWISTLE, ANNIE LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1911 S Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 1110
ENTWISTLE, THERESA LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1912 D Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 1080
ENTWISTLE, JENNIE LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1916 S Quarter in OLDHAM Volume 08D Page 918
ENTWISTLE, AGNES LYNCH
GRO Reference: 1918 S Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 08A Page 115
Thank you Rosie,
I have bought the birth certificates for Jennie and Agnes. Jennie was born at a family home so she is correct. Agnes is more complicated so I'll need to do more digging to confirm things.
As for the 1921 Census, it mentions 6 children under 16 but the eldest child is aged 19 so there must be another missing child somewhere.
Thanks, Luke
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Cas,
some wonderful gems here. The baptism for Mark & Anne is correct. Ellen Duffy is the sister of Abraham Ent so thats certain too.
I'll research to confirm the other things but this is all really great.
Thank you and thank you all!
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The eldest child was Abraham, his birth was registered in 1908 not 1901. I thought he had been found with his aunt Ellen in 1921 age 13
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Apologies Rosie, you are right
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There is this marriage
Abraham Entwistle
Registration Date March Q 1934
Registration District Halifax
Inferred County Yorkshire West Riding
Spouse Margaret E Winter
Volume Number 9a Page number 908
1939 register for couple gives his birthdate as 26 May 1877, same date as you have, so a very good possible it is your Abraham.
1939 - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61596/records/20635419
Possible - Deaths Dec Q 1953
ENTWHISTLE Abraham age 75 Halifax 2b 527
1939 for wife transcribed gives b 1870, but I think it is likely 1879
Deaths Sep Q 1956
Entwhistle Margaret E age 77 Halifax 2b 507
Cas
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There is also this tree that has Agnes birthdate and marriage. No cert data but maybe family knowledge, possibly worth contacting
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/174028171/person/312255005239/facts
Marriage was 1940 Oldham, 2 likely children to couple. Possibly tree owner is relation.
Cas
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Thank you once again Cas. The person with the family tree shares a little of DNA with me it would seem so thats a good possibility - I've messaged her. The death certificate is well worth me looking into.
Thanks again, Luke