RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Norfolk => England => Norfolk Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Pigeon63 on Thursday 20 March 25 20:41 GMT (UK)
-
I am struggling to distinguish between two ancestors both named Aquilla Wanser.
I have two birth dates, 1654 and 1660 and one death date of 1680. I am guessing a child was named after one who had previously died. Parents are listed as Henry Wanser and wife Alice /Alise.
Spellings vary, I have found Wanser, Wansor and Wanfor, Aquila, Aquila and Agnila.
Mother’s maiden name is unknown. They lived at Wells next the Sea, Norfolk.
Help appreciated.
-
Hi
It looks like the first child died as a baby.
Aquilla bapt 13.7.1654 but died the following March 6.3.1654.
It looks like earlier because the Georgian calendar was April to March 1654
So we have
William 3.3.1649 -9.6.1659
Henry 17.2.1651-6.5.1663
Aquilla 13.7.1654-6.3.1654
Ann 9.1.1655
Alice 12/18.4.1658
Aquilla 8.7.1660-13.2.1680
Robert 27.1.1662-2.2.1662
Priscilla 5.9.1664-3.5.1667
Ciderdrinker
-
Thank you so much Ciderdrinker. I wasn’t aware of a different calendar being used at that time which is why the dates were confusing me.
That’s a great help.
-
To be honest the name seems to be Wanfer, not Wanser. Yes, there may be variation pronunciations and spellings, but perhaps some transcribers have mistaken the f for a long s (which, looking at some of the entries, it clearly isn't)
-
Yes, you are right jonwarrn, there seem to be quite a few transcription errors. I have tried to correct them on Ancestry .
Would you mind letting me know which sites you used to find the information Ciderdrinker? I am trying to find the maiden name of Alice/ Alise who married Henry and is mother of Aquilla.
-
Hi
I can't see a marriage, perhaps ciderdrinker can conjure something up. But it can be harder to find them back then, and potentially here execerbated by being during the Commonwealth period.
Aquilla is quite a rare name, perhaps it came from Alice's family, so you could have a look and see if there were any around in Norfolk pre the Wanfer ones.
From a quick look at free indexes, in Wells there was a family with one, that of Henry and Priscilla Cleydon / Clayton, who had a son Aquila in 1644. Followed by Priscilla junior (1646) and Robert (1648). After a couple more children, Henry has one more (Margaret) by a new wife, Katherine.
According to Henry's will, proved 1661, he had three older sons, Henry, Joseph and John. They seem to have been baptised in Kings Lynn.
In his will, Henry does name a couple of brother in laws, but I don't think your Henry and Alice are mentioned.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C39Z-5H9V
I can't find a marriage of Henry Clayton/Clayden, etc. to Priscilla. There is a marriage indexed in King's Lynn, 4 Dec 1636, Henry Clifton and Priscilla Gold. Maybe that's a possibility.
I don't think this has helped very much.
Hang on, I've got a new idea!
-
Hang on, I've got a new idea!
OK, from FreeReg, a baptism at Little Walsingham, very close to Wells
5 June 1625
Alice
(daughter of) Aquila Cotten
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818d586e93790eca3eb1b45
What happened to her?
Is this the father?
NROCAT has this record
Cotton, Aquila, of North Barsham
Archdeaconry of Norfolk original will, 1651-1652 no. 31
https://nrocatalogue.norfolk.gov.uk/index.php/cotton-aquila-of-north-barsham
-
Well that will of Aquila Cotton is on one of the few ANF microfilms we can see at home.
Seems to be wife Joane, son John, daughters Frances and Anne
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CS62-7XQS
-
Thank you yet again. I think you’ve solved the puzzle. The names Aquilla and Priscilla seem to be family names used through the generations.
I looked up the names Priscilla and Aquilla , they were missionaries of St Paul in the New Testament .
-
Good Morning
I used Find My past but no luck with their marriage I'm afraid.
I'll be honest I'm struggling to find anything on the family before late 1640's
A second marriage to Margaret Tidd single woman 9.2.1668 after Alice's death 28.10.1668.
So 4 months latter.
And Henry's burial Henry Wanser senior 9.9.1707
That's it .No sign of the first marriage to Alice.
Ciderdrinker
-
Possibly
Henry Waynford, baptised 10 January 1621/2, Wells next the Sea
Father Henry
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818a86be93790eca3922790
Henry senior may be the same Henry (Wainfoord) who had a son Edward baptised at nearby Barney in 1608
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818d82fe93790ec8b46cc9d
Followed by Priscilla in 1610
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818d82ee93790ec8b46cc19
There is though another Priscilla Wainsford baptism to Henry in Wells in 1619
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818a86ce93790eca39228c6
An Edward Waynford married in Wells in September 1635
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/58184210e93790eb7f76d7fa
Is he Edward Wanfor, father of Susanna, who was baptised there in November? Though findmypast say Waynford
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818a8b6e93790eca392d160
Ann baptised in 1640? According to Free Reg
Barbary Wanfor baptised in 1643. Parents Edward and Mary
https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5818a8b3e93790eca392c95e
Some ifs and buts here, but perhaps something to investigate.
-
Thank you to both for supplying that information.
I had found Henry’s second wife but did not have his death date so that fills in a gap in my research. I’ll try using Find my past for other searches.
If there are no records of the Wanser/ Wanfer name before that I am wondering whether they could have come from abroad. The surname is Dutch/ Germanic sounding and with Wells being a port at the time they could be immigrants. Norfolk had a Dutch population in the 1600s and there was an interesting programme on tv recently about the Dutch influence on engineering and architecture at the time.
-
Wanfer entries in Wells next the Sea seem to date from 1640 (Susanna in 1635 is Wainford/Waynford)
I think the reason for the change in the recording of the name from Wainford and obvious variant spellings to Wanfer may be due to the arrival in Wells at that time of a new Rector, Mungo Murray. He was appointed on 13 Dec 1638, and may have been rector there for twenty years or more
https://theclergydatabase.org.uk/jsp/persons/CreatePersonFrames.jsp?PersonID=126412
There may be a handwriting change in the parish register. Did he write them up himself?
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6GP3-T1
Spelling of some other names have changed at the same time, Blowme has become Bloome, Cosine has become Coson (I haven't gone through the whole A-Z)
-
That would explain it. Also, as they were illiterate themselves they wouldn’t realise that the spelling of their name had changed.
I’m going to take a look at the Wainsfords tonight to see whether I can fill in more gaps.
Thank you
-
You might not be able to find a marriage between Henry and Alice because it may have been a clandestine marriage or a "fleet marriage." Which was held in secrecy, and many times without a church banns or marriage license. The marriage act of 1753 stopped this from happening frequently.
I find with many of my ancestor who lived before the 1750s have no marriage record. It makes finding a mother's maiden name or who a daughter marries very hard. If they have rare given name, like Frances, Priscilla, or Cornelia, I find baptism records that include a mother's name, and try to track the mother until they die. I usually go off of names, and it helps if someone else in the family also has a rare given name, as then her children may also have the same name. If a burial record with an age can be found, it's even better. Of course I doubt everyone is 100% correct.
-
Thanks for that information AR Usher. It is highly likely the marriages were not recorded.
Yes, I am finding that unusual names do make it easier to find individuals and follow families through the generations.