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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Cboyd13 on Saturday 08 February 25 19:45 GMT (UK)
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Hi all,
Looking for help started family tree again and due to other people tangling my family tree info with there’s with info I know isn’t right wondering if I have went wrong myself further back
My grandads was Samuel George Boyd born 1896 married two once to Nellie Carmichael and once to Jessie McCullough
I know is dad was Samuel Boyd from marriage certs and his mother Mary from death certs of his brother David who died and Robert. So think this is the tangles bit wondered if I have the right maiden name for Mary as there seems to be Robert Boyd’s family who moved abroad who has linked in with out tree
Unless I am wrong and my grandads brother Robert moved and didn’t die but I a, sure this was all checked correctly
Any help would be great even on how I solve this
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You haven't told us what maiden name you have for Samuel's mother Mary but his birth registration is quite clear- mother Mary Boyd formerly Carroll-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1896/02186/1827391.pdf
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/St__George_s_Ward_Belfast/Hilland_Street/955869/
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Shankill/Harrison_Street/151535/
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Removed information already supplied above Sorry
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That's the 1911 census record I just posted but you haven't said what you have for mother Mary's maiden name.
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Thank you I had brown I got this with some help from the records office but think it’s now wrong
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Just going to check a few more things.
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Thank you
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...married two once to Nellie Carmichael and once to Jessie McCullough
So his first marriage was to Jessie McCullough - 13 October 1921.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1921/09230/5340104.pdf
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That’s correct. Thank you
Looking to confirm my granddad Samuel George Boyd mums maiden name
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Marriage of Minnie Boyd & William McClurg-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1910/09997/5635865.pdf
Boyd family in 1901-
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/St__George_s_Ward_Belfast/Hilland_Street/955869/
Haven't yet found marriage of parents or other children.
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Looking to confirm my granddad Samuel George Boyd mums maiden name
See aghadowey's reply #1
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Thank you, she said to give her time to look more I am just very confused
Your help has been great thank you
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Marriage of Minnie Boyd & William McClurg-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1910/09997/5635865.pdf
Daughter Mary Agnes McClurg born 1910.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1911/01542/1624398.pdf
She sadly died in 1913.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1913/05337/4486021.pdf
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Thanks this explains conflicting birth dates on second Mary Agnes they had in 1915
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Just looked at the birth record for Mary Carroll and it’s not my grandad he was born April this Samuel George was January
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25th April is his birthdate
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Your original post said Samuel's parents were Samuel Boyd and Mary and that he was Samuel George Boyd born 1896. More than a few things don't added up here.
Can you confirm this is the correct family?
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/St__George_s_Ward_Belfast/Hilland_Street/955869/
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Shankill/Harrison_Street/151535/
Samuel Boyd, labourer, and wife Mary. Children: Robert James, Mary, Samuel, John H[enr]y, David.
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This is correct family and my grandad was born 25th April 1896
I found this birth link for his sister Mary
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1888/02531/1937627.pdf
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It seems to be brown and Cowan is a middle name in our family
Just need to now confirm the death I was given for brother Robert is correct
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Normally it should be quite straightforward- find Samuel's birth, find all of his siblings then get parents' marriage. In this case not so much.
Using the surname of Brown for mother Mary I did find this marriage- Samuel Boyd to a Mary Brown in 1885
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1885/10872/5970601.pdf
Date looks good with details in 1911 census. Mary born 1888 and a brother Robert James c1886 (and death for Robert James 1901/1911).
I did find a John Henry Fullerton Brown with same parents-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1899/02032/1778942.pdf
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Robert James?
James Johnston Boyd born 1886-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1886/02617/1966011.pdf
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Fantastic thank you
I think the other family who know Robert Boyd who emigrated to Canada have got mixed up then by the looks of it and linked into us somehow by going down a rabbit hole
So many Boyd’s it’s easy done
Hence why here is a godsend
The records office helped me find Robert’s death same place parents were married
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On Robert James I think your right wonder is the death was him
So his name was James
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Still doing searches but likely was registered as James Johnston Boyd but parents later called him Robert James.
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Samuel Cowan Boyd born 1890-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1891/02402/1895958.pdf
Likely death?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1892/06021/4714496.pdf
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Next Samuel born Sept.1893- informant was father Samuel Cowan Boyd-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1893/02296/1861521.pdf
Likely death in July 1895 aged 1 yr. 10 months- note address Donegore St.-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05925/4682601.pdf
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So sad
Thank you
Strange my granddads birth is missing but know his date of birth is correct as my uncle has all his records etc only one I know as he moved to Scotland from Ireland when he married his second wife my gran
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Just about everything tied up nicely now :)
Samuel Boyd (c1863-26 May 1925) m.(1885) Mary Brown (c1864/c1861-9 Mar.1941)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1885/10872/5970601.pdf
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/St__George_s_Ward_Belfast/Hilland_Street/955869/ (Samuel Boyd, 28; Mary Boyd, 37; Robert James Boyd, 15; Mary Boyd, 13; Samuel Boyd, 5; John Hy Boyd, 2.
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Shankill/Harrison_Street/151535/ (m.26y, 7 ch./4 liv.)- Samuel Boyd, 29, Mary Boyd, 46; Samuel G. Boyd, 15; John Boyd, 11; David Boyd, 8; son-in-law William McClurg, 25; dau. Mary McClurg, 24; niece Anna E. McClurg, 2; niece Mary McClurg, 3 mo.
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=8015.9133 (Samuel)
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7041.14424 (Mary)
Children (7 as in 1911 census)-
1. Robert James/James Johnston Boyd (17 Mar.1886 Rampart St., Dromore-aft.1901)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1886/02617/1966011.pdf (James Johnston Boyd)
2. Mary Cowan “Minnie” Boyd (28 Dec.1888 Magherlane, Derryaghy (Dunmurry, Lisburn reg.dist.)) m.(30 Nov.1910 Belfast Registry Office) William McClurg (c1886-aft.1911). See next post
3. Samuel Cowan Boyd (30 Dec.1890 at 13 Terence St.-30 Dec.1892 at 24 Lagan View St.)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1891/02402/1895958.pdf
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1892/06021/4714496.pdf
4. Samuel Boyd (6 Sept.1893 at 35 Terence St.-28 July 1895 at 19 Donegore St.)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1893/02296/1861521.pdf (father Samuel Cowan Boyd)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05925/4682601.pdf
5. Samuel George Boyd (21 Jan.1896 at 11 Donegore St.) m.(1921) Jessie McCullough
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1896/02186/1827391.pdf (mother Mary Carroll)- informant Sarah McDowell was probably midwife/neighbour
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1921/09230/5340104.pdf (address 118 Urney St.)
See next post
6. John Henry Fullerton Boyd (20 July 1899 at 25 Matilda St.-aft.1911)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1899/02032/1778942.pdf (mother Brown)
7. David Boyd (c1903-12 Feb.1922)
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7995.6705
Belfast Newsletter, 13 Feb.1922: Sunday Disturbances … operating in the district. After the exchange of shots a young man named David Boyd, aged 18 years, and residing 118, Urney Street, was picked up on the corner of Hanover Street and Cavour Street. He was shot in the stomach, and was brought dead to the Mater Hospital …
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Thank you,
Only birth which isn’t correct is Samuel George Boyd’s as it’s not my grandads as he was born the April and his mother was Mary Brown
My grandad did marry Jessie not the other Samuel George
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The birth posted for Samuel George Boyd is your grandfather's. Have another look at the image and keep in mind that
1) the informant was a neighbour (midwife?) Sarah McDowell and she likely muddled up Mary's maiden name
2) the place of birth was 11 Donegore Street. A few months before, in July 1895, your Boyds were living at 19 Donegore Street when second Samuel died.
I'm wondering if Samuel George Boyd used a baptism date if he couldn't get a birth certificate. If he applied for his birth certificate saying mother was Mary Brown he could have been told the birth wasn't registered.
Not sure if this is Samuel George Boyd or his father-
Northern Whig, 26 June 1924: Beasts of Burden… best decorated donkey and cart- 1. Samuel Boyd, 118, Urney St.
children of Samuel & Jessie?
Mary born 4 Dec.1921, Robert born 16 Jan.1923 (both in Belfast, father- Boyd mother- McCullough)
Will save Mary/Minnie (Boyd) McClurg for next post.
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Mary Cowan “Minnie” Boyd (28 Dec.1888 Magherlane, Derryaghy (Dunmurry, Lisburn reg.dist.)-aft.1911) m.(30 Nov.1910 Belfast Registry Office) William McClurg (c1886-aft.1911)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1888/02531/1937627.pdf
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1910/09997/5635865.pdf (both at 89 Hopewell St.)
Northern Whig, 21 Sept.1917: Alleged Stabbing. … Elizabeth Laughlin was charged with stabbing and wounding Minnie M’Clurg, 118, Urney Street. It appeared from the evidence… M’Clurg that she went into Urney street where Laughlin …
1. Anna E McClurg (c1909-aft.1911)
2. Mary Agnes “Minnie” McClurg (29 Dec.1910 at 28 Hopewell St.-9 May 1913 at Rumford St. Infirmary)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1911/01542/1624398.pdf
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1913/05337/4486021.pdf (home-114 Urney St., inquest)
City Cemetery (Public Ground)- Minnie McClurg, 114 Urney St., age 2 4/12 yrs, d.9 May 1913, but.11 May 1913. https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7615.27445
3. Samuel Boyd McClurg (15 June 1913 at 114 Urney St.-aft.1942)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1913/01444/1590953.pdf
Aug.1942- Samuel B. McClurg of Urney St. sentenced to 3 months in prison for receiving a stolen bicycle, appealed Sept.1942.
4. Mary Agnes McClurg (20 Jan.1915 at 118 Urney St.)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1915/01389/1571445.pdf (father- soldier)
I can't find a birth for eldest daughter in 1911 census (Anna E. McClurg). 2nd daughter Mary Agnes born about four weeks after her parents married. I thought Anna might have been Minnie's daughter before she married but still couldn't find a birth registered.
Now, two other relatives I found but can't place (you might know who they were) but buried in the same family plot-
David Cowan Boyd (age 19): https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7029.13119
https://test.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/75470029/david-cowan-boyd/
Belfast Telegraph, 25 Oct.1939: BOYD- October 24, 1939, at Hospital, Palace Barracks, Holywood, … David … dearly beloved nephew of Minnie M’Clurg. Funeral from his late residence, 90 Urney Street, … to City Cemetery. He suffered …
Samuel Cowan Boyd (age 3 10/12): https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=6599.9313
Belfast Telegraph, 1 June 1936: ... far away. Where they laid my dearest cousin. Just one year ago today. ... the going down of the sun and in the morning I will remember thee.” Ever remembered by his sorrowing Cousin. Annie Henderson, 118 Urney Street. BOYD-In loving memory of Samuel Cowan … aged 3 years 10 months, called Home on the 10th[?] June, 1935, and was laid to rest in the City Cemetery. His little feet are travelling now On streets of shining gold…
Belfast Telegraph, 10 June 1937: … never will I. Till we meet again. Sadly missed and fondly remembered by his sorrowing Aunt Minnie and Cousin, Sammy M’Clurg, 111 Urney Street; also Daddy and Brother David.
Belfast Telegraph, 25 Oct.1939: BOYD- In treasured memories of my darling cousin, Samuel Cowan (wee Sammy), called …
Now, all looked perfectly normal until I found this-
Irish News and Belfast Morning News, 16 Oct.1911: Charge of Bigamy. William M’Clurg or was charged Nesbitt with having committed bigamy marrying the 30th November, 1910, Minnie Boyd, while his wife, Elizabeth Fitzpatrick, whom was married 1908, was still alive. A remand until Friday was granted.
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ahhh makes sense that's fab. thanks so much for this just glad we had the other children to double check all this.
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1908- William McClurg (under another name) married Elizabeth Fitzpatrick?
30 Nov.1910 William McClurg married (Belfast Registry Office) Minnie Boyd.
29 Dec.1910 daughter Mary Agnes McClurg born at 28 Hopewell St. (informant- mother)
Oct.1911 William McClurg charged with bigamy
Can't see outcome in papers
9 May 1913 daughter Mary Agnes McClurg died. Family living at 114 Urney St.
15 June 1913 son Samuel Boyd McClurg born at 114 Urney St. (informant- father)
20 Jan.1915 daughter Mary Agnes McClurg born at 118 Urney St. (informant- father, soldier)
1917 Minnie McClurg, 118 Urney St. (stabbing)
1938 cousin (to Samuel Cowan Boyd) Annie Henderson, 118 Urney St.
1939 Minnie McClurg aunt of David Cowan Boyd
Unanswered questions-
1) birth registration of Anna E. McClurg (daughter of Minnie?, was she later Annie Henderson?)
2) bigamy charge- was William found guilty or innocent? jailed? what happened to him after birth of daughter in 1915 when he's listed as soldier?
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Also found a Margaret McClurg from 118 Urney St. died 1944-
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7069.815
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William McClurg was killed in action in 1915 Minnie them remarried a James Young
Bigamy that’s a shock
My Grandads daughter Ann from his second marriage married my grandads sisters grandson William McClurg
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Belfast directories- 118 Urney St. (off Shankill Rd.):
1918- Minnie McClurg https://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/tuvcomplete1918.htm
1924- Thos McClurg labourer https://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/tuvcomplete1924.htm
1932- Minnie McClurg https://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/tuvcomplete1932.htm
1939- Mrs. Minnie McClurg https://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/tuvcomplete1939.htm
1943- vacant https://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/tuvcomplete1943.htm
William McClurg was killed in action in 1915 Minnie them remarried a James Young
Are you sure about that? no sign of his death in CWGC website- only McClurg d.1915 I can find is Thomas-
https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/856580/thomas-mcclurg/
Added- James Young married Minnie (Boyd) McClurg in 1918-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1918/09699/5518337.pdf
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Mary Young of 90 Urney St. died 1949-
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7123.4908
in same plot-
Also found a Margaret McClurg from 118 Urney St. died 1944-
https://online.belfastcity.gov.uk/find-burial-records/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=7069.815
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Worth keeping in mind?
Hugh Boyd m.(1852) Mary Cowan, daughter of Samuel Cowan-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1852/09428/5415480.pdf
Samuel listed as Samuel Cowan Boyd in one of the records for his children and eldest daughter named Mary Cowan Boyd.
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Was wondering if they were related further back
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Hoping this link works
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61588/records/21362287?ssrc=pt&tid=110258998&pid=340079651319
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That link was to the war death record for William McClurg
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The David Cowan Boyd and other child you couldn't place were the children who died from my Grandad first marriage to Jessie
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Hoping this link works
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61588/records/21362287?ssrc=pt&tid=110258998&pid=340079651319
Can't see that record because I don't have a subscription. Minnie McClurg got stabbed in January 1918 but didn't find anything in papers for William's death.
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Ahh i see. its the death pension record for William McClurg created after the war
Royal Irish Rifles died 25th Sept 1915
Minnie is listed on it as Minnie Young and remarried and all the kids are listed
just notice Annies DOB is on it as 20th Feb 1909
thanks for all your help
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Searched two different Belfast districts manually (page by page) but still no sign of Annie/Anna. Never found David's birth (c1903) either.
No match for William McClurg in CWGC database (I search just 'McClurg' and there aren't that many). No mention of an alias in pension record?
Which brings me back to Annie's birth. I think Army would have wanted proof that the wife was actually his wife and children were his children before paying out a pension. I have seen similar cases where children were listed then crossed out as they were step-children, etc. Minnie could, if needed, have submitted her marriage lines (we don't know outcome of bigamy allegation) but Annie was born in 1909 which is before the marriage in 1910.
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I tried to find David’s birth and couldn’t at start we didn’t know my grandad had a first wife and who he was but ancestry linked us with the grandchildren of my grandads other children from first marriage which joined that dot.
Let me download the pension record again I just have a screenshot I took some time back but didn’t see anything on it
My mum remembers her Aunt Minnie and Aunty Annie visiting Scotland but can’t remember her surname I have asked
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No alias just William McClurg on pension record
Minnie re married received a remarriage payment
Children’s pensions
Anne Eliza Boyd DOB 20th feb 1909 until 20th Feb 25
Samuel Boyd DOB 14th June until 29
Mary Agnes DOB 20th Jan 15 until 31
Pension award date 19th June 16
Who knows how the got away with it if that’s the rules :(
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Something I hadn’t noted before Williams Date of birth 7th Deb 1888
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Found the case result of the bigamy trial he was let off to get his own judgement when called. Judge referred to Minnie having a baby in her arms in court and any punishment would be passed to her and.
No mention of the fact he used two names though
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Found this
Annie McClurg alias Henderson she was accused of stealing money 20th October 1937
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Found Annie’s birth certificate registered Eliza Anne correct date of birth mother and father down as McClurg mothers maiden name Boyd
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Ah, Indexed as Mc Clurg rather than McClurg!
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1909/01628/1651744.pdf
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Do you know if you can search by army regimental number have one for William and second husband James young?
William: 5/5511
James Young is listed on Williams pension as same unit 5813 I think it’s a 3
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James Young is listed on Williams pension as same unit 5813 I think it’s a 3
Could it read 9/583?
(You can search by reg number on FindMyPast)
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Fantastic thank you