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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Topic started by: noland01 on Wednesday 22 January 25 12:53 GMT (UK)
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Hi all
Just wondering if anyone has came across the above person/ family in their research?
Am helping a person investigate a family story re a connection to the above person Mathew Byrne, later O Byrne
The supposed connection is that he was originally from south Carlow and served his time in Pierces of Wexford before going to Dublin.
Quick online google finds Mathew as a former Royal navy chief engineer although most articles seem to be a copy and paste.
We have found a few possibilities in census/ parish records and civil records along with one online tree but nothing concrete that makes sense with some of it contradictory
The connection may be too far back to be reliability researched.
I will post tonight what he has found and see if a fresh set of eyes helps.
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We need a timescale so can you include some dates please?
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We need a timescale so can you include some dates please?
Thanks for the reply.
Dates would help I agree !!
Just on phone so will update tonight with more information.
Didn't want to post too much irrelevant stuff.
Mathew Byrne we think was born c.1835 and dies 1916 in Dublin.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/05253/4456399.pdf
Article here would suggest that the above Mathew was not the founder if it began in 1840 rather a son to the first Mathew Byrne.
https://ssmaryandmichaels-garstang.org.uk/history/Bells/Bell%20Ringers%20World%20article.pdf
Son Mathew Byrne/OByrne born somewhere c.1870 but again not sure if he is a son of the above.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1925/05005/4366719.pdf
The foundry was going 1870 and closed i think in the 1960s. Again will check tonight.
I know census and even civil records are not gospel regarding dates etc but the more we look at it the more it confuses.
Find a Mathew Byrne an engineer born Carlow, living in Templeogue, Tallagh on 1911 census.
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Tallagh/Templeogue/86919/
On 1901 census this looks to likely be the same person although states married.Age is not mistranscribed as household return states 4 although assume someone forgot the 0 after the 4.
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Tallagh/Templeogue/1312557/
The Mathew Byrne born Dublin South 3rd December 1868 to Mathew and Eliza Furlong looks promising. Father an engineer.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03410/2250712.pdf
Not sure if this is the same family as that of a Christopher Byrne born 1874 James street Dublin to same named couple.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1874/03138/2150900.pdf
Found a marriage of a couple of that name marrying in Ferns, Wexford November 1859.
Possible son Thomas born Wexford June 1864.Occupation millwright.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1864/03603/2329097.pdf
Again apologies but the above from memory as on phone and will update tonight.
Edited with a few links.Looking back over it wonder if the Carlow born engineer is a different person to the Bell maker dying in 1925 ?Presume the Matthew Byrne below is the one on the census returns for Templeogue.
From the Carlow Nationalist dated January 5th 1929;
The late Matthew Byrne ,born Ballymurphy Carlow donates a bell to the local church in 1914 .He was apprenticed in Pierce's of Wexford and later had a business in Dublin
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Looking at it all written down now I think people were mixing up the two Matthew Byrne/OByrne.
Found the Matthew Byrne Bell maker on 1901 census in Dublin.
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Pembroke_East___Donnybrook/New_Grove_Avenue/1285513/
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When the Dominican Church Newbridge got it's new bell from the Fountain Head Bell Foundry in 1889 the foundry was represented by Mr M Byrne and his son Mr Frank F Byrne. Nationalist and Lenister Times July 1889.
Frank's name might prove useful.
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When the Dominican Church Newbridge got it's new bell from the Fountain Head Bell Foundry in 1889 the foundry was represented by Mr M Byrne and his son Mr Frank F Byrne. Nationalist and Lenister Times July 1889.
Frank's name might prove useful.
Thanks for that.
I half remember a Francis Furlong Byrne being mentioned in an online tree as a son of Matthew Byrne.
Looking through it all when its written down I think I have either 2 or 3 separate Byrne families.
Family 1; Matthew Byrne and his wife Elizabeth Furlong (?).He is the Bell maker in James Street Dublin with son Matthew William Byrne ,a Royal Navy engineer.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03410/2250712.pdf
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Pembroke_East___Donnybrook/New_Grove_Avenue/1285513/
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Clifton/Westland_Road/147354/
The 1925 death for Matthew Byrne engineer gives James Street as address so likely the above more than the below Matthew Byrne
Family 2; Matthew Byrne born Carlow c. 1870. Again an bell founder(?) living in Templeogue in 1901 and 1911 census an engineer .Wonder perhaps a relative of the Matthew Byrne owning the Fountain Head Bell Foundry ?
Confusion perhaps as the 81 year old foundry owner Matthew Byrne dying in 1916 is also living in Templeogue, Dublin .Address given as Bella Vista Templeogue on death entry.
Family 3 ?
Matthew Byrne and Elizabeth Furlong. Marrying Ferns ,Wexford November 1859. SonThomas born The Faythe (I think) Wexford 1864 with occupation millwright.Another son Christopher born James Street Dublin 1874.
Any opinions ? They all seem somewhat intertwined but something not clicking for me.
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Did you have a Matthew married to an Emily
Irish Independent
Death notice for Emily O’Byrne died Jan 26 1952 widow of Matthew O’Byrne late of Bell Foundry, James St.
Her address 54 Northumberland Road.
Buried Glasnevin.
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Did you have a Matthew married to an Emily
Irish Independent
Death notice for Emily O’Byrne died Jan 26 1952 widow of Matthew O’Byrne late of Bell Foundry, James St.
Her address 54 Northumberland Road.
Buried Glasnevin.
Thanks.
Thats the Emily O Conor who was married to the Matthew Byrne on 1901 census living in Donnybrook and in Antrim in 1911 I think.
As far as i can find they married in Liverpool c.1897. One son Leo who died 1914 ( WW1 i assume)
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A Miss Mary Byrne wrote a latter to the newspaper, Irish Press, in 1940 saying the first official act of the late Archbishop was to bless a bell cast by her brother Matthew W Byrne at the Fountain Head Bell Foundry.
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Was sent an article tonight which is from Carlow Nationalist 27th March 1915 saying Matthew Byrne a native of Ballymurphy and now a bell maker in Dublin presented a bell to his home Parish church.It states he is elderly and was represented by his son at the ceremony.
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Had a look at Bella Vista on the map, it was a fairly big house.
The Matthew in Templeogue in 1901 and 1911 is living in a 1st class, 14 room house. He also owned several other properties of his neighbours. (House and Building Returns)
It doesn’t look like he filled in both forms himself, the hand writing is quite different, I think the 1911 one is the enumerators writing which may explain why he is listed as single.
Of course the ages on the census don’t come close to the age of 81on the death certificate but given the size of the house and other properties it must be the same man.
His estate was worth over £5000.
http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/reels/cwa/005014919/005014919_00688.pdf
Matthew W is his son, who must have gone into the family business at some point and there is a sister Mary going by the letter in the newspaper.
Which leaves Frank F, where did he go?
Does that sound correct?
The property in Templeogue would be worth looking at. See next reply.
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Number 78 O’Byrne to Murphy
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSK3-S3JY-2?cat=185720&i=209
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Had a look at Bella Vista on the map, it was a fairly big house.
The Matthew in Templeogue in 1901 and 1911 is living in a 1st class, 14 room house. He also owned several other properties of his neighbours. (House and Building Returns)
It doesn’t look like he filled in both forms himself, the hand writing is quite different, I think the 1911 one is the enumerators writing which may explain why he is listed as single.
Of course the ages on the census don’t come close to the age of 81on the death certificate but given the size of the house and other properties it must be the same man.
His estate was worth over £5000.
http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/reels/cwa/005014919/005014919_00688.pdf
Matthew W is his son, who must have gone into the family business at some point and there is a sister Mary going by the letter in the newspaper.
Which leaves Frank F, where did he go?
Does that sound correct?
The property in Templeogue would be worth looking at. See next reply.
Francis Byrne dies 27th February 1919 Malahide Road ,Clontarf, aged 57 and unmarried as reported by his brother Matthew Byrne of 42 James Street, Dublin.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1919/05162/4423541.pdf
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Did you have a Matthew married to an Emily
Irish Independent
Death notice for Emily O’Byrne died Jan 26 1952 widow of Matthew O’Byrne late of Bell Foundry, James St.
Her address 54 Northumberland Road.
Buried Glasnevin.
Don't seem to see that death on civil records site.
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Neither could I, couldn’t find her in Glasnevin either but the death appears in the Sunday Independent and Irish Press on the 27th and the Irish Independent on the 28th.
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Found a Thomas Byrne an annuiant dying in Dublin 1915 as reported by his widow Elizabeth. Correct age for Thomas byrne born 1864 in Wexford.
Its a long shot and will post link later but i think he is a possible son of Mathew Byrne.
Looking at what is found so far it looks likely that there is only a small possibility of any descendants as most of Mathew's children died unmarried or in infancy.
Have found a few possible baptisms in the Borris Parish register for Mathew Byrne born c.1835 but the two best ones have no address which would be a major help.
He supposedly came from a family of blacksmiths,went to Wexford to serve his time in Pierces and ended up in Dublin.
The lack of descendants would make a DNA connection harder whilst i cannot for definite connect this Mathew Byrne with the earliest known ancestor of the person searching for the link so kinda snookered so far on both ends.