RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Shropshire => England => Shropshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Aquitaine on Friday 10 January 25 17:56 GMT (UK)
-
Hello everyone
I am trying to sort out this family,
Would anyone be able to look up in Fourth Quarter at Oswestry a transcript for marriage of
Richard Roberts to Jane Ann Jones nee Roberts
they lived also at Llanfllyin
Thank you if anyone can help
-
You will probably need to buy a copy of the Marriage Certificate.
Unless someone has access to Parish Registers?
-
To look up a marriage in parish records you need to know which church it took place in. If it was a civil marriage (registry office) it can't be looked up
These are all the areas contained within the Oswestry RD
https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/oswestry.html
-
Many thanks to those that replied I decided to get the certificate. I am awaiting the marriage certificate next week so hopefully can make progress with the Jones and Roberts families.
Is anyone familiar with Lancashire burials around Whitworth please ? The family came from Wales to Lancashire.
I have checked Rochdale Cemetery Whitworth and Bacup for a burial of Richard Roberts of Shawforth railway porter died 7th April 1946 of Market Street Shawforth. Is there somewhere else nearby that I am missing? His wife died and is buried at Bacup Cemetery 20 Feb 1932.
Many thanks again.
-
I've just checked the register and find that I've looked at this entry before so it could be a relative of mine or a previous look up.
I'll see what I can find.
Gadget
-
Hello friends I would be greatful for some help,
I received the certificate from the GRO recently but I would not have found this as the event was at the Register Office!
Both sides of this family have Roberts in them (an extended line of mine not direct) I thought I would be away and researching great! One family of Roberts is around Llanfyllin Montgomeryshire and I have a good lineage with that and the other was supposed to be Newtown or Llanfair Caereinion Montgomeryshire.
I cannot find this man on a census prior to 1921. With family at Llanllwchaiarn, Montgomeryshire, Wales
I have 1939 register at Whitworth nr Rochdale gives birth date 7 Jan 1879
I have his wife's death and burial (widow of Samuel Jones) Jane Ann Jones nee Roberts in 1932 at Whitworth cemetery
I have his death in 1946 at Shawforth nr Rochdale - no mention in Rochdale Observer tried Whitworth cemetery, Rochdale cemetery - burials only.
The marriage was on 5 October 1925 Oswestry Richard Roberts was born 7 Jan 1879 the 1921 census has birth place as Llanfair-Coereinion. This morning I tried the GRO for two entries there isnt one in 1st Quarter 1879 around these places one to a father Robert Roberts and the other one is illegitimate. And there are so many Richard Roberts. I tried 1881 census as he would be 2 yrs old with father Richard Roberts but I cant be certain it is the same person.
Richard Roberts born 1879 has a father Richard Roberts who was a "farm bailiff" and deceased in 1925 I tried typing "farm bailiff" in the census to see if any entries?
Are there any parish or chapel registers for 1879 available that could help to pick up his parents?
Any help would be appreciated. Thank you again.
-
Would anyone be able to look up in Fourth Quarter at Oswestry a transcript for marriage of
Richard Roberts to Jane Ann Jones nee Roberts
You could have checked on Shropshire BMD
https://www.shropshirebmd.info/
ROBERTS Richard
JONES Jane A
Year 1925
Church / Register Office - Oswestry Register Office or Registrar Attended
Registers At Shrewsbury
Reference RO-OS/28/116
-
Deaths Mar 1932
Roberts Jane A 54 Rochdale 8e 99
the 1921 census has birth place as Llanfair-Coereinion
He was b Llanfair Caereinion
He didn't marry Jane until 1925 but they are shown as married in 1921
I have 1939 register at Whitworth nr Rochdale gives birth date 7 Jan 1879
The age + months on the 1921 census do not support an 1879 birthyear - more like 1878
https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/llanfyllin.html
There is no Richard Roberts birth in that RD in either the March qtr 1878 or 1879 except one in the June qtr which is a bit late if he was b 7/1. All others have middle names
-
Thank you to all that responded I will have to have a re think.
-
Hi all here I go again, I havent done any Welsh research bordering on Shropshire so struggling with place names.
The marriage took place at the Register Office Oswestry Shropshire 5 Oct 1925 and I have the certificate.
I am interested in finding Richard Roberts born abt 1878/79 he gave date of birth on 1939 register as 4 Jan 1879 then on 1921 place of birth was Llanfair-Caereinion, Montgomeryshire, Wales living 43 Bryn St, Newtown. His father was named as also Richard Roberts a farm bailiff. His wife Jane Ann Jones nee Roberts was wife/widow of Samuel Jones who was living further down the same street in 1921. Richard Roberts was cremated I found out at Rochdale. The earliest known census is the 1921. I am happy with Jane Ann Jones nee Roberts tree up to now.
I have checked GRO for a birth of Richard Roberts in 1st Q 1879 without success there are some in later quarters ?! So I dont know if the birth date is wrong etc. or not registered. I have looked at some census but feel I am going round in circles, with Jones, Roberts and Roberts on the other side.
I wondered if anyone could help. Thank you in advance.
-
Was Richard shown as a bachelor or a widower on the marriage cert? He was around 47 in 1925 if he was b 1878
-
Maybe a red herring but there is this bapt. Could the father be made up?
Name Richard Roberts
Baptism Age 0
Record Type Baptism
Birth Date 1879
Baptism Date 19 Feb 1879
Baptism Place Garthbeibio, Montgomeryshire, Wales
Mother Ellen
Page number 73
About 9 miles to Llanfair
https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/MGY/Garthbeibio
Cas
-
Not locating any with father Richard that is a farm bailiff.
He must have been enlisted for WW1. Which may give a next of kin.
Possibles..no access to Fold 3
Name Richard Roberts
Rank Private
Record Type Military
Birth Date 1877
Residence Place Newtown Mon (Newtown is in Montgomeryshire) also area in 1921 census)
Military Service Region Wales
Military Country Wales
Discharge Date 24 Apr 1918
Service Number 265242
Corps, Regiment or Unit LABOUR CORPS
Service Branch Military (Army)
Title WWI Pension Record Cards and Ledgers
Description Pension Record Ledger
Reference Number 5/Mr/319
Name Richard Roberts
Military Date 1914-1920
Military Place England, Wales, Scotland, Ireland, United Kingdom
Regiment or Corps The Royal Welsh (Welch) Fusiliers, Labour Corps
Regimental Number 36538, 265242
Cas
-
Hi there, thank you to Carole W and Cas,
I will try to follow up on your messages, apologies if I spelt any Welsh names incorrectly!
I think Richard is giving me the run around.
I got a birth certificate GRO which is not the one: 16 Feb 1879 Richard son of Robert Roberts mother Mary Roberts formerly Jones - father a labourer -at Tainewyddion Pennant - discounted as father incorrect...you can see why I am getting mixed up with the Jones and Roberts!
and another birth record 2 June 1879 at Pistiladdan Manafon Richard no father listed mother Mary Roberts.
Here is the transcript of the marriage certificate 5 October 1925 at Register Office Oswestry Salops
Richard Roberts 46 years bachelor - Insurance Agent - 66 Salop Road Oswestry - his father Richard Roberts (deceased) - Farm Bailiff married to: Jane Anne Jones 47 years widow - 66 Salop Road Oswestry her father Evan Roberts (deceased) - General labourer both signed the register Witnesses:
Alice Gwilt and ??? Howell. I cannot make out the first name it seems unusual and a middle name letter. Not a J ??? I've got a line with Jane Anne Jones nee Roberts on Ancestry so happy there.
-
There is this marriage, so could be a possible sister to Robert
Marriages Jun Q 1912
GWILT Joseph - Roberts Oswestry 6a 1602
Roberts Alice - Gwilt Oswestry 6a 1602
-
1911 for Jane Ann Jones & husband Samuel has Alice Roberts down as Sis in Law.
Going by 1921 Alice Gwilt b 1881 Shropshire, with husband it looks like same Alice. So likely on the Jane Ann side.
-
I have done a check on Alice Gwilt and husband Joseph they were buried at Chirk Denbeighshire.
I found them on 1939 Register at 13 Bron-Y-Waen Chirk. Alice left a will probate to husband Joseph Gwilt 1955 both buried Chirk.
I have found an Alice Roberts registered 4Q Llanfyllin I was going to order, but as you say it may be the other side of family!
I feel I am going astray abit with these families.
-
Can you do a screenshot snippet of the other witness name? Many are good at deciphering.
Other than that I don't know what to suggest, but would look at the enlistments, check for others, as am sure he would have been called up.
No access to Fold 3 but some on the military board are more knowledgeable
-
Was also looking at this possible yesterday.
Name Richard Roberts
Enlistment Age 21
Birth Date abt 1880
Birth Place Leanfair Mortgemeryshire (Llanfair?)
Enlistment Year 1901
Regiment Shropshire L . I.
Regimental Number 6826
Attestation Paper Yes
It looks like the first daughter is adopted. Not finding a birth reg, also has parents unknown in 1921. William Maurice Roberts b 1903 Birkenhead in 1911 is illegitimate, possible mother Jane. No children to couple/ Samuel in 1911. Looks like Elsie is the couples daughter, registered Mar Q 1921..so couple at least met around 1918 - 1920 so must have been same area, possibly Shropshire or Montgomeryshire.
Difficult with just one census to pin down earlier, and some things like father Richard, farm bailiff, etc don't seem to add up
Cas
-
Hi all I have managed to do a scan in and clip for screenshot from the marriage document about the first name I cannot read. Thank you for your continued help but when I tried to upload it wont as its a specific forum board. Is there another way ?
Yes thats correct about the adopted daughter I got the birth certificates...it is William Maurice Roberts that is the link downwards on this family.
-
Look up boards are disabled from attachments. You could try the decipher board
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/handwriting-deciphering-recognition/
-
Hi Cas and all what a learning curve, here I have had to post the clip from the marriage certificate of Richard Roberts the witnesses .... something Howell it is clear writing ...the other I know is Alice Gwilt
This is the link page I put it on! Phew.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=370538.new
-
1921
(Taliesin) Old Welsh name - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taliesin
Talisin Thomas Howell age 40 Years 4 Months Head living Owestry b Aberavon, Glamorgan
Possible friend, does not look like family connection.
-
He is in Oswestry on the 1939. Born 1991
Add - T is for Thomas - see 1921 census.
Sorry Cas - when I first looked you'd just put up his name - no other details :-\
-
Thank you Cas and others, I wouldnt have guessed thanks
-
He is in Oswestry on the 1939. Born 1991
Add - T is for Thomas - see 1921 census.
Sorry Cas - when I first looked you'd just put up his name - no other details :-\
No worries Gadget, hope your feeling better