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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: snowybeatle on Monday 23 December 24 14:02 GMT (UK)
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Hi all
Is anyone able to help with the deciphering of this old text from an ancestor's wedding record, dated 1677?
Any help will be much appreciated.
Thanks.
Steve
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I've made a start. Is there a standard form for recording a marriage in this community?
It's obviously not standard C of E wording. If there is a standard form it should help with the difficulties presented by parts of the text.
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In the yeare 1677
This is to Certifie the truth to all people that Richard
Snowball of Espersheills and Ann [Nill?son] of
the same place, haveing Intention of Mariage According to the [ordi?]
of god and gods Joyneing they did lay it before the mens and [womens?]
Meetings before whom theire mariage being propounded then [th?]
Meettings [desireings?] them to [?ice] a time and soe they [makeing?] [en?] [?]
the time whether the man is free from any other woman & she free from any other
man...
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Hello horselydown86
Thank you and a wonderful start.
It's certainly not standard C of E wording, which probably is not overly helpful.
My research shows the marriage is likely to be to Ann Wilkinson.
I've no idea about how this community records a marriage. I thought the forum had closed, so only by chance have I noticed today that it's still running.
Steve
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It's certainly not standard C of E wording, which probably is not overly helpful.
With all those witnesses, it must surely be a Quaker marriage.
ADDED
Yes, it is ...
Name Richard Snowball
Event Type Marriage
Gender Male
Spouse Ann Willkinson
Marriage Date 23 May 1677
Marriage Place Durham, England
Meeting Monthly Meeting of Newcastle Upon Tyne, Benfieldside
Piece Description Piece 1252: Monthly Meeting of Newcastle Upon Tyne, Benfieldside (1653-1820)
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Interesting. Quakerism had only been in existence since 1642, so this was a relatively early Quaker marriage. It adds an interesting perspective to my research.
Thanks Bookbox
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The image on Ancestry is a bit clearer (if you have access) ...
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/7097/images/41815_b0153574-00040
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Bookbox
A lot better! Confirms the suspected Quaker marriage, too.
Thanks
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I have done almost as far as the witnesses but wasn't aware that things had moved on while I was working.
Here's what I have, using the posted source (for whatever it's worth).
I have to finish now.
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...see [?ond] time they comeing before the mens and womens meetings all
things being found Cleare, a metting of the people of god was [Apointed?]
in the house of ? ?: where they [tooke?] one Another in the p(re)sence of god and
in the presence of his people the 23d day of the 3 month ? ?:
According to the Law of god and the practice of the holy men of god in the
Scriptures of [truth?] promiseing to live faithfully together man & wife
as long as they lived to which they both [?t] theire names...
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horselydown86
Brilliant! Thank you very much. I'm really grateful for your input.
I think your effort hasn't been hampered by any other progress made. It just confirms the non-C of E format, to what is essentially a Quaker wedding.
Steve
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Some background to the Benfieldside Meeting is here ...
https://cameofamilyhistory.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Annexes.pdf
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Bookbox
Fascinating! Thanks for the link
Steve
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I have tidied up the text from the Ancestry image:
...haveing Intention of Mariage According to the [ordinance?]
of god and gods Joyneing they did lay it before the mens and womens
Meetings before whom theire mariage being propounded then they
Meettings desireings them to waite a time and soe they makeing enquire betwixt
the time whether the man is free from any other woman & she free from any other
man soe A second time they comeing before the mens and womens meetings all
things being found Cleare, a metting of the people of god was Apointed
in the house of J C: where they tooke one Another in the p(re)sence of god and
in the presence of his people the 23d day of the 3d month [&? G?]:
According to the Law of god and the practice of the holy men of god in the
Scriptures of truth promiseing to live faithfully together man & wife
as long as they lived to which they both seet theire names [&?] we are
wittnesses of the Same; whose names are hereto Subscribed the day and
yeare aforesaide
The witness surnames in order and omitting duplicates are:
Orsbey, Hopper, [Brantingim?], Lighton, [Wheatlah or Wheatlak], Hunter, Browne, Mallum, [March or Marck]
(Lighton is Cuthbert.)
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horselydown86
Brilliant! Thanks for your persistence and accurate deciphering of this script.
It's clearly the Quaker oath, with reference to the marriage banns being called prior to the wedding.
Save for one anomaly, which I'm working on, Richard Snowball is my 8th paternal great grandfather. I've tried to get some background context to all of the ancestors in my family tree (rather than a mere collection of dates) so it's been a most useful exercise and finding early Quaker roots is interesting.
Much appreciated and Happy Christmas. :)
Steve