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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Vickihuk on Monday 07 October 24 18:49 BST (UK)
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Hello
I am posting here again as last time you wonderful people helped me unlock some information about an ancestor - I would never have found it otherwise.
I am trying to find parentage of my 3xGrandfather. George Saunderson, born circa 1872 - I thought Liverpool but nothing is coming up at all. He married 3 times:
Elizabeth Ewanson (born Liverpool 1881, married 1899)
Eliza Ann Wise / Dainton (born Crewe, Cheshire 1874, married 1904)
Lillian May Woolfe (my 3 x Grandmother, born 1895, Sevenoaks, married 1915)
I have checked the first 2 x marriage certificates - both named William Saunderson as Father. The 2nd marriage certificate had Eliza Saunderson as a witness, so I wondered if that could be his Mother.
However, I have searched and searched and nothing makes sense.
Please can anyone offer any tips on how I could find out more?
Many thanks
Vicki
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Is this the first marriage? Father is named as James a soldier
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/2125627:2197
Name George Saunderson
Marriage Age 27
Birth Year abt 1872
Marriage Date 8 Oct 1899
Marriage Place Liverpool, St Philip, Lancashire, England
Father James Saunderson
Spouse Elizabeth Florence Ewanson
Cas
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What is his birthplace on the 1901 & 1911 censuses? Have you found him on the 1921?
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Hi Cas
Yes that was his first marriage. He also recorded James Saunderson, Soldier as his father in his 2nd marriage. But I am not finding any matches (birth, census etc) that relates.
Thanks
Vicki
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1901 shows him as 29 b Liverpool
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There is this birth registration:
SAUNDERSON, GEORGE HENRY mmn. HARDING
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 4
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What is his birthplace on the 1901 & 1911 censuses? Have you found him on the 1921?
Hi, he doesn’t show up in 1911 census and there is no 1921 census. I believe he was a Gunner in the RFA West Lancs Division - so I guess he will have been away at war at the time.
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There is this birth registration:
SAUNDERSON, GEORGE HENRY mmn. HARDING
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 4
I looked into this one and father is showing as John Taggart Saunderson - which goes against the marriage certificate!
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One of the witnesses to the 1899 marriage was William Rose Saunderson
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Did he die after 1939? If so - his full birthdate will be on the 1939 register
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Did he die after 1939? If so - his full birthdate will be on the 1939 register
Unfortunately, he died on 1924
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1921 census shows George Saunderson, b 1868, Toxteth Park
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In 1921 there is a George Saunderson (52.7) born Liverpool, wife Lilian (26.11) born Kent, and 5 children living in Toxteth Park Liverpool.
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1868 West Derby and Toxteth Park March quarter 8b 388
George Sanderson mmn Abbott
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In 1921 there is a George Saunderson (52.7) born Liverpool, wife Lilian (26.11) born Kent, and 5 children living in Toxteth Park Liverpool.
That’s the one I meant Alan, thanks. I have corrected it.
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1871 3810 /22/36
George Sanderson, 3 yrs with parents George and Ellen and siblings.
There is a William, 5 yrs.
Added
He is William Abbott Sanderson though - not William Rose.
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Just realised father is wrong too.
Oh heck!
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In 1921 there is a George Saunderson (52.7) born Liverpool, wife Lilian (26.11) born Kent, and 5 children living in Toxteth Park Liverpool.
That’s the one I meant Alan, thanks. I have corrected it.
This is definitely them, thank you and I’ve also found him on the 1901 census where he was living with 1st wife and mother in law - working as a railway porter. So now I know he was 100% born in Liverpool!
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1901 shows him as 29 b Liverpool
Found him on the 1901 census - thank you!
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His 1891 army attestation gives his NoK as mother Elizabeth and brother William, both in Norwich, Norfolk. He is also stated to be Roman Catholic.
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His 1891 army attestation gives his NoK as mother Elizabeth and brother William, both in Norwich, Norfolk. He is also stated to be Roman Catholic.
Oh really! Now that would make sense as there are rumours that there is Irish heritage on that side.
I am yet to venture into military records - I don’t really know where to start. Any tips?!
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A lot of the pre-WW1 military records on Ancestry are behind an additional pay-wall - Fold3. However if you have a sub to FindmyPast then they are included.
The amount of information can vary, but generally speaking you can expect more of an overview than any great amount of detail. There's often a physical description, and George is assessed as 19 years and 9 months old, 5ft 10 and 1/8th of an inch(!), 136lbs, chest min 36, max 38ins, fresh complexion, hazel eyes and black hair. Various moles, scars etc are also detailed.
He signed up with the Royal Artillery for 7 years 'with the colours' (ie regular army service) followed by 5 years in the reserves, joining at Liverpool on 7 Aug 1891, although he appears to have been transferred to the Royal Horse Artillery in Oct 1891.
Being in the reserves meant he could be recalled to service in the event of hostilities, which is exactly what happened in Oct 1899 (Boer Wars). He was recalled 7 Oct 1899 & posted on 9 Oct 1899... so it's probably not a coincidence that he married Elizabeth Florence Ewanson on 8 Oct 1899!
You should be able to see some medal records for him on Ancestry under service no. 85839. He was transferred back to the reserves in April 1902.
There is a pension record card for him on Fold3 giving the service number 690091 (Lillian was claiming as a widow). However, as there are no WW1 medals its probable that he didn't serve abroad during WW1.
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Wow I am super impressed with that level of detail - thank you ever so much, I appreciate the time you have taken to find that information for me. I will now continue with my research!
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His 1891 army attestation gives his NoK as mother Elizabeth and brother William, both in Norwich, Norfolk. He is also stated to be Roman Catholic.
It is odd that Elizabeth and William are not showing in Norwich or Liverpool in 1891.
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His 1891 army attestation gives his NoK as mother Elizabeth and brother William, both in Norwich, Norfolk. He is also stated to be Roman Catholic.
It is odd that Elizabeth and William are not showing in Norwich or Liverpool in 1891.
Yes, I can’t find anything on the family with those names, ages, and locations. I must be missing something…
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Vicki,
Have you seen the burials of George and Elizabeth’s babies?
March 30th 1901 George Leslie Saunderson, 1 yr
May 11th 1903 Louisa Ruth Saunderson, 17 days
Both from 1a Balm Street and buried West Derby Cemetery - as is Elizabeth Florence.
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Also another daughter
SAUNDERSON, ELVINA WINIFRED mmn EWANSON
GRO Reference: 1901 D Quarter in WEST DERBY Volume 08B Page 610
Can be found at Wavertree in 1911 as niece to Plaiston family. Jane Ewanson also with family.
1911 https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/23663388%3A2352
RC baptism (1 Balm Street)
Helaina Winefred Saunderson
Age 0
Birth Date 24 Nov 1901
Baptism Date 11 Dec 1901
Baptism Place Kensington, Christ Church, Lancashire, England
Father George Saunderson, lab
Mother Elizabeth Saunderson
Added: George a Soldier on her marriage in 1927 to Ernest Jump. Image online.
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/93123961%3A2197
Cas
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Yes thank you - I know about all the children and his later life. It’s the earlier part of his life I am struggling with - making it difficult to go further up the family tree 😀
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Also another daughter
SAUNDERSON, ELVINA WINIFRED mmn EWANSON
GRO Reference: 1901 D Quarter in WEST DERBY Volume 08B Page 610
Can be found at Wavertree in 1911 as niece to Plaiston family. Jane Ewanson also with family.
1911 https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/23663388%3A2352
RC baptism (1 Balm Street)
Helaina Winefred Saunderson
Age 0
Birth Date 24 Nov 1901
Baptism Date 11 Dec 1901
Baptism Place Kensington, Christ Church, Lancashire, England
Father George Saunderson, lab
Mother Elizabeth Saunderson
Added: George a Soldier on her marriage in 1927 to Ernest Jump. Image online.
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/93123961%3A2197
Cas
Hi
I am going to throw this in the mix.
It seems the Mother in Law has gained 10 years by 1911?
1911
Louisa Plaistow, Wife, married, 35, born Liverpool.
...
Jane Ewanson, Mother-in-Law, 68, Widow, Lerwick, Shetland Isle.
Elvina Winifred Saunderson, Neice, 9, Lancs, Liverpool.
There is a Ewanson family (Snr) look to be born in the Shetland Islands and there is a child called Elvina, too.
1881
Arthur Ewanson, Head, Mar, 45, Shetland Islands.
Jane Ewanson, Wife, Mar, 29, Shetland Islands.
Elvina Ewanson, 7, Liverpool.
Louisa Ewanson, 4, Liverpool.
Christiana Ewanson, 2, Liverpool.
My initial thought might be wrong and you may have considered Shetland or Scotland connection already?
Perhaps Elizabeth Ewanson / Saunderson was visiting in Scotland when the Census was taken? Not in E & W.
Added:
1891 Army Record - Perhaps the N of K Elisabeth and Brother William, were on a Scottish jolly when the Census was taken?
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Elizabeth Florence Saunderson died in 1903 and George married in 1904.
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Can be found at Wavertree in 1911 as niece to Plaiston family. Jane Ewanson also with family.
Original image shows the surname as PLAISTOW.
RC baptism (1 Balm Street)
Helaina Winefred Saunderson
Age 0
Birth Date 24 Nov 1901
Baptism Date 11 Dec 1901
Baptism Place Kensington, Christ Church, Lancashire, England
Father George Saunderson, lab
Mother Elizabeth Saunderson
Original image shows the first name as Elvina.
Debra :)
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Can be found at Wavertree in 1911 as niece to Plaiston family. Jane Ewanson also with family.
Original image shows the surname as PLAISTOW.
RC baptism (1 Balm Street)
Helaina Winefred Saunderson
Age 0
Birth Date 24 Nov 1901
Baptism Date 11 Dec 1901
Baptism Place Kensington, Christ Church, Lancashire, England
Father George Saunderson, lab
Mother Elizabeth Saunderson
Original image shows the first name as Elvina.
Debra :)
Debra, I wonder if that is a Catholic tradition adding a H and/or variation?
I came across it the other day with the Mother's surname Ansell (Catholic Baptism), it drove me crackers, until the penny dropped. The Mother M.S. was Hansell.
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Also another daughter
SAUNDERSON, ELVINA WINIFRED mmn EWANSON
GRO Reference: 1901 D Quarter in WEST DERBY Volume 08B Page 610
Can be found at Wavertree in 1911 as niece to Plaiston family. Jane Ewanson also with family.
1911 https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/23663388%3A2352
RC baptism (1 Balm Street)
Helaina Winefred Saunderson
Age 0
Birth Date 24 Nov 1901
Baptism Date 11 Dec 1901
Baptism Place Kensington, Christ Church, Lancashire, England
Father George Saunderson, lab
Mother Elizabeth Saunderson
Added: George a Soldier on her marriage in 1927 to Ernest Jump. Image online.
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/93123961%3A2197
Cas
Hi
I am going to throw this in the mix.
1911
Louisa Plaistow, Wife, married, 35, born Liverpool.
...
Jane Ewanson, Mother-in-Law, 68, Widow, Lerwick, Shetland, Isle.
Elvina Winifred Saunderson, Neice, 9, Lancs, Liverpool.
There is a Ewanson family (Snr) look to be born in the Shetland Islands and there is a child called Elvina, too.
1881
Arthur Ewanson, Head, Mar, 45, Shetland Islands.
Jane Ewanson, Wife, Mar, 29, Shetland Islands.
Elvina Ewanson, 7, Liverpool.
Louisa Ewanson, 4, Liverpool.
Christiana Ewanson, 2, Liverpool.
My initial thought might be wrong and you may have considered Shetland or Scotland connection already?
Perhaps Elizabeth Ewanson / Saunderson was visiting in Scotland when the Census was taken? Not in E & W.
Added:
1891 Army Record - Perhaps the N of K Elisabeth and Brother William, were on a Scottish jolly when the Census was taken?
I know the story here :)
Elizabeth Ewanson was George Saunderson’s first wife. They had 3 x children - unfortunately, 2 of them died and Elizabeth died very soon after Louisa, circa 1904. Elvina went to live with her Aunt Plaistow.
George then went onto marry Eliza very soon after, but she died of tuberculosis.
Very soon after, he remarried Lillian Woolfe and they went on to have children - one of them being my Great Grandfather George Leslie. There is a family story that the younger siblings were told to cross the road when they saw the older siblings - how terrible is that? You can just imagine the family dramas though can’t you! ;D
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I'm wondering about the 72 y/o Eliza Saunderson who in 1921 is living at 71 Solway Street, West Derby/Toxteth Park with her nephew Jeremiah Connor aged 42 born Liverpool, plus Jeremiah's sister Annie (Hughes) and family. Could this be George's mother?
In 1921 George Saunderson & family are at Maynard Street, West Derby/Toxteth Park, which is just a few streets away.
https://historic-liverpool.co.uk/old-streets-liverpool/#15/53.4000/-2.9800
In 1901 Jeremiah Connor is living with his mother and siblings at 73 Solway Street, and visiting them is William Saunderson aged 20, Sheet Metal Worker born Liverpool.
William is also with them in 1911, aged 30 and still single.
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Debra, I wonder if that is a Catholic tradition adding a H and/or variation?
No, they started to write H, crossed it out and wrote Elvina.
Debra :)
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Added: I don't think this will help, because it is George Saunderson, that you are after.
Liverpool, Feb 1893
Extensive Robbery from a Pawn Shop
Ship's Steward Henry Barley, 24, of Spekeland St, Edgehill, was charged on remand ...
... Mrs Jane Ewanson, the prisoner's mother-in-law
17th April 1892
Harry Barley, 23, Bachelor, Mariner, Samuel Barley, Photographer.
Elvina Lillian Ewanson, 18, Spinster, Father Arthur Ewanson, Mariner.
Present: H Rylands ; Louisa Ewanson
Residence at Time of Marriage Both of 42 Liffey Street
In 1881 South Toxteth, Liverpool
Elvina Ewanson, 7, with parents Arthur & Jane.
Christiana Ewanson, 2
1879 GRO Index
Reg'n District, West Derby & Toxteth Park
Christina Creighton Ewanson
Mother's Maiden Surname: Henry
1882
Elizabeth Florence Ewanson
Reg'n District, Toxteth Park
Mother's Maiden Surname: Henry
Added: Just read your first post again and you are after the parentage of George Saunderson
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I'm wondering about the 72 y/o Eliza Saunderson who in 1921 is living at 71 Solway Street, West Derby/Toxteth Park with her nephew Jeremiah Connor aged 42 born Liverpool, plus Jeremiah's sister Annie (Hughes) and family. Could this be George's mother?
In 1921 George Saunderson & family are at Maynard Street, West Derby/Toxteth Park, which is just a few streets away.
https://historic-liverpool.co.uk/old-streets-liverpool/#15/53.4000/-2.9800
In 1901 Jeremiah Connor is living with his mother and siblings at 73 Solway Street, and visiting them is William Saunderson aged 20, Sheet Metal Worker born Liverpool.
William is also with them in 1911, aged 30 and still single.
That has to be them surely - George’s witness to his marriage was Eliza Saunderson so I did assume that was his mother. It makes sense.
Does that mean that Eliza’s maiden name was Connor??
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Good find Jomot.
It looks as though Jeremiah Connor’s mother was Bridget Duggan (Connor).
I noticed this marriage earlier but couldn’t find anything further and it may be another red herring.
1877 - Everton
James Sloane, widower and Eliza Saunderson, 30 yrs.
Her father - Edward Saunderson, deceased - Lieutenant in the Army
Address for both 53, Stonewall Street
I couldn't spot them in 1881. There is a possible James Slone in Salford who is a widower.
At first I thought that she may have combined James, husband, and father - army to give a father’s name for George.
Just my supposition a couple of days ago but the Connors might change all that now!
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1881 - a Sloane family are living at 53 Stonewall Street so presumably the couple gave a relative’s address on marriage.
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I have been searching and searching for any Eliza’s with surname Duggan or Connor - can’t find anything at all. I can’t help but think I am missing something glaringly obvious!
The weird thing is I can’t find any birth registrations that make sense for George or William - which makes me think I’m barking up the wrong tree. I’ve been questioning whether they were born Saunderson, or under a different name.
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Yes I have been searching all sorts of ways but nothing!
There are no obvious births.
Is this correct?
No sign in censuses of Eliza/Elizabeth until 1921.
No sign of George until - army in 1891 and 1901 onwards.
No sign of William until 1899 x George’s marriage, then 1901/11
William signs himself William Rose Saunderson - I wonder how ‘Rose’ is significant
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I think that is a pretty good summary - and thank you for searching also 😀
I have also searched on the Rose element - nothing!!
A very mysterious family it seems - probably had lots of twists and secrets
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1881 - a Sloane family are living at 53 Stonewall Street so presumably the couple gave a relative’s address on marriage.
That family head is James Sloanes brother. The nephews and niece are children from James's 1867 marriage to Elizabeth Miller. In 1871 James, Eliza and children are at 45 Warwick st, Birkenhead with the Miller family. Elizabeth died 4Q 1875 Birkenhead.
James Sloane (bus driver) & Eliza Sloane nee Saunderson seem to vanish after their 1877 wedding. Newspaper announcement of the marriage gives the names as James Sloane and Eliza Beatrice Saunderson but no other info.
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Thank you. Doesn’t seem to be the right lady then.
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In 1921 George Saunderson & family are at Maynard Street, West Derby/Toxteth Park, which is just a few streets away.
Electoral Registers
1921 - George Saunderson - 5 in 7 Court, Maynard Street (this means house number 5 in Court number 7)
In 1918 and 1919 - George Donald Saunderson - same address
After George’s death, Lilian is shown there
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Electoral Registers 1924
83 Solway Street
Eliza Saunderson with James Allen Pearson and Catherine Pearson. She is perhaps lodging with them.
This is the only entry I can see and fits with the street from the 1921 census.
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Electoral Registers 1924
83 Solway Street
Eliza Saunderson with James Allen Pearson and Catherine Pearson. She is perhaps lodging with them.
This is the only entry I can see and fits with the street from the 1921 census.
This has to be her, surely?
Another one I was looking at was 1887-1888 Eliza Saunderson at 36 Mozart Street, and 1890-1891 at 127 Mozart Street. According to the 'Old Streets of Liverpool' link I posted previously, this is just 7-streets down from Solway Street and is roughly where Mozart Close now stands.
The 1891 census shows No. 127 Mozart Street as unoccupied ::)
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Also a catholic burial on 23 Dec 1932 at Ford Cemetery, Elizabeth Saunderson aged 83 of 126 Smithdown Road.
This may not be her, but Smithdown Road is again in the same general area, running along Toxteth Park Cemetery.
Might be worth a £3 punt on the death certificate?
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Yes I meant to post that as a possible but wanted to check re the name Eliza/Elizabeth.
However, I think that Smithdown Road address was the workhouse/hospital.
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Adding these births to the mix
HIGGINS, GEORGE SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: —
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in WEST DERBY AND TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 405
ROSE, WILLIAM SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: HIGGINS
GRO Reference: 1882 M Quarter in TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 202
A baptism indexed for Guilelmus Rose born 1881 at Liverpool, Our Lady of Mount Carmel in 1882
Parents Gulielmi + Elisabeth nee Higgins? (I don't have access to it)
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SS
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Well done, SS. And baptized in 1881, not in 1882 (sorry!)
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HIGGINS, GEORGE SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: —
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in WEST DERBY AND TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 405
Possibly found him in 1881 as a visitor to the Byrne Family 43 Mozart St, Toxteth. No Parents & enumerated as George H Sanderson age 8 b Liverpool
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HIGGINS, GEORGE SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: —
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in WEST DERBY AND TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 405
Possibly found him in 1881 as a visitor to the Byrne Family 43 Mozart St, Toxteth. No Parents & enumerated as George H Sanderson age 8 b Liverpool
Thats George in 1881, note address on brothers birth registration.
SS
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Well done - super finds. :)
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Baptism 10th November 1872 - birth 1st Nov 1872
St Michael’s Liverpool
George Saunders , son of James and Eliza Saunders nee Higgins
Godparents Thomas Feeney and Elizabeth McGlynn
(Transcribed as ‘Riggins’ on Anc.)
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Further research required folks, I have to go out but pretty sure this is George's brother and mother :)
1921 address 71, Solway Street, Toxteth Park, Lancashire, England (Eliza Saunderson b 1849)
1911 address 71 Solway St Liverpool, Toxteth Park, Lancashire, England (William Saunderson)
1901 address 73, Solway Street, Toxteth Park, Lancashire, England (William Saunderson)
SS
added
Deaths Dec 1932
Saunderson Elizabeth aged 83 Liverpool 8b 193 (= 1849)
sorry info previously found
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Those are the ones that have been found, SS, so it looks as though we are getting closer.
His 1891 army record mentioned mother and brother in Norwich apparently. Not found yet though.
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Those are the ones that have been found, SS, so it looks as though we are getting closer.
His 1891 army record mentioned mother and brother in Norwich apparently. Not found yet though.
Must have missed that in previous posts
SS
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Oh I just thought you were emphasising them, sorry :)
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Hello
I am posting here again as last time you wonderful people helped me unlock some information about an ancestor - I would never have found it otherwise.
I am trying to find parentage of my 3xGrandfather. George Saunderson, born circa 1872 - I thought Liverpool but nothing is coming up at all. He married 3 times:
Elizabeth Ewanson (born Liverpool 1881, married 1899)
Eliza Ann Wise / Dainton (born Crewe, Cheshire 1874, married 1904)
Lillian May Woolfe (my 3 x Grandmother, born 1895, Sevenoaks, married 1915)
I have checked the first 2 x marriage certificates - both named William Saunderson as Father. The 2nd marriage certificate had Eliza Saunderson as a witness, so I wondered if that could be his Mother.
However, I have searched and searched and nothing makes sense.
Please can anyone offer any tips on how I could find out more?
Many thanks
Vicki
Is this the first marriage? Father is named as James a soldier
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/2125627:2197
Name George Saunderson
Marriage Age 27
Birth Year abt 1872
Marriage Date 8 Oct 1899
Marriage Place Liverpool, St Philip, Lancashire, England
Father James Saunderson
Spouse Elizabeth Florence Ewanson
Cas
One of the witnesses to the 1899 marriage was William Rose Saunderson
Adding these births to the mix
HIGGINS, GEORGE SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: —
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in WEST DERBY AND TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 405
ROSE, WILLIAM SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: HIGGINS
GRO Reference: 1882 M Quarter in TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 202
A baptism indexed for Guilelmus Rose born 1881 at Liverpool, Our Lady of Mount Carmel in 1882
Parents Gulielmi + Elisabeth nee Higgins? (I don't have access to it)
SS
HIGGINS, GEORGE SAUNDERSON
Mother's Maiden Surname: —
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in WEST DERBY AND TOXTETH PARK Volume 08B Page 405
Possibly found him in 1881 as a visitor to the Byrne Family 43 Mozart St, Toxteth. No Parents & enumerated as George H Sanderson age 8 b Liverpool
Thats George in 1881, note address on brothers birth registration.
SS
William Rose Saunderson turned up as a Marriage witness in 1899, see Ancestry link (quote above & 1st Attachment).
Birth Attachment in Softly Softly reply mention William Rose as the Father of William Saunderson.
Added:
Interesting, that the Mother the Informant, Eliza Rose, gives her address as 43 Mozart Street, Toxteth Park (see quote above, noted by SS)
Could Saunderson and surname Rose be an aka, e.g., Rose also known as (aka) Saunderson?
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Apologies for the late reply everyone, I’ve not had chance to look at everyone’s replies for the past couple of days.
Thank you all so much for the research and the clues - I really appreciate it.
Quite a lot of info to go through here and piece together - so think I will have an interesting weekend!
I look forward to sharing more info with you soon, and thanks once again
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I have viewed the birth registrations for both George and William.
George Saunderson
HIGGINS
1st Nov 1872
(Looks like) Aygeia Street, Everton
No father named
Mother - mark of Eliza Higgins
William Saunderson
ROSE
7th Dec 1881
43 Mozart St, Liverpool
Father: William Rose - Butcher
Mother: Mark of Eliza Rose, formerly Higgins
So my feeling was correct - the brothers
Were not born Saunderson - that was their given name but clearly they adopted it is a surname, but why??? And, indeed they were only half brothers.
This is where my head is going… Eliza had George with (James) Saunderson but couldn’t name him as the father as they weren’t married. She married James Saunderson later, hence Eliza/Elizabeth Saunderson. James died and she went on to marry William Rose, and had son William. To keep the same name for the brothers, they also gave him Saunderson as a middle name. The weird thing is though - why would William go on to call himself Saunderson even though his fathers name was Rose?!
The plot thickens….
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Baptism 10th November 1872 - birth 1st Nov 1872
St Michael’s Liverpool
George Saunders , son of James and Eliza Saunders nee Higgins
Godparents Thomas Feeney and Elizabeth McGlynn
(Transcribed as ‘Riggins’ on Anc.)
Great find thank you!
Bit strange that on George’s birth certificate, there was no father named and Eliza was named as Higgins, but 9 days later, Eliza is named as Saunders!
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Respectability for the priest?
Sorry, I might have missed this - do you have the civil birth certificate for George with mother as Eliza Higgins?
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Yes - here it is
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Also a catholic burial on 23 Dec 1932 at Ford Cemetery, Elizabeth Saunderson aged 83 of 126 Smithdown Road.
This may not be her, but Smithdown Road is again in the same general area, running along Toxteth Park Cemetery.
Might be worth a £3 punt on the death certificate?
This doesn’t give much away unfortunately…
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Also a catholic burial on 23 Dec 1932 at Ford Cemetery, Elizabeth Saunderson aged 83 of 126 Smithdown Road.
126 Smithdown Rd = Toxteth Workhouse and Infirmary