RootsChat.Com
Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Spinelli on Monday 10 June 24 21:31 BST (UK)
-
The couple is Alexander Macrae and Margaret McLean (although her surname is not listed). Instead, there's this word at the end of the record - Heille?
Can I get a consensus on this, and does anyone know what this might mean?
This couple had at least one son in 1803, so I guess it's fairly unusual to have such a long wait until they were married. They lived in Bracadale on the Isle of Skye.
-
Heille is a surname, although a rare one. Why can't it be her surname?
-
I think it was the name of a village in the Bracadale area:
The name "Heilla", also used in 'Cnoc Dubh Heilla' adjacent to this hill, refers to the village of Heille, which was between Fernilea and Portnalong but no longer exists, having been cleared by the Talisker Estate owners in their second wave of clearances, overseen by Hugh MacAskill, the founder of Talisker Distillery.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiskavaig
Monica
-
The surname
is looks like MACKAE not MACRAE. There are are other events in Bracadale recorded as MACKAY so probably unlikely that their surname would be spelt differently. Perhaps this one is also MACRAE.....
Possibly a son baptised also in 1818.
MACKAE, ANGUS
ALEXANDER MAC KAE MARGT. MAC NIEL FR 25 (FR25)
17/09/1818
109 10/17
Bracadale
Debra :)
-
I agree with Monica. Heille is a place name.
-
Hi Anna, I have Margaret's death certificate, both her father and her mother were McLeans (her mother's maiden name is also listed as McLean).
Monica - thank you! This seems very likely and is very interesting. The records i've been finding from my Skye family seem to be better than most at including place names (including croft names) so next time i'm in the area i'll have to have a wee wander.
Debra - thank you for this - the family name is definitely McRae/MacRae, but I will expand my search to include MacKae as i've not been looking at any of them :) . Ancestry.com suggests Angus is indeed a son, but judging by your findings the surname would have to have been misreported as MacNeil rather than McLean.
Thanks all for your help, it's proven very valuable :)
-
I haven't seen the whole page, but I don't think it would be impossible for the MacRae/Heille couple to be the witnesses of the Campbell-Campbell marriage.
Note the surnames in the left hand margin: is there anything similar showing MacRae & Heille?
A lot depends on what immediately follows this extract (and the format of the other entries on the page). Marriage entries normally have a place and a date, so if these are absent for MacRae-Heille, that suggests that this isn't a record of their marriage. There are usually witnesses as well, which is why I think that could be their role in this entry.
-
I haven't seen the whole page, but I don't think it would be impossible for the MacRae/Heille couple to be the witnesses of the Campbell-Campbell marriage.
This is how I read it also - they are the witnesses.
-
This is how I read it also - they are the witnesses.
And I think this would make it more likely that Heille is a location. You wouldn't really marry someone without knowing their name, and although you probably ought to know a witness's name, it's a bit less crucial. The gap could indicate that the surname was unknown, then their abode was given.
-
Hi all, I do think Heille looks like the place name and not a surname. I've attached a larger portion of the marriage register.
Margaret died after 1855 and as such has more information on her death certificate, which states her parents as James McLean and Grace McLean (nee. McLean).
-
I think there was an error in the way that the marriage has been entered. As illustrated by the rest of the entries on the page of register, witnesses' names were not included here.
Normally when witnesses are listed, the entry starts with the word (witnesses) abreviated or in full and then the name of each witness and where they came from.
The fact that Margaret's maiden name has been left off is also unusual given how important women's maiden names are in Scotland. It is almost like the clerk started to write the entry in the register and then got called away....never to return to it in this case ;)
Monica
-
Margaret died after 1855 and as such has more information on her death certificate, which states her parents as James McLean and Grace McLean (nee. McLean).
Spinelli, take some care on mother Grace's maiden name. Best to be open minded on this for now. It may be that it was not known to the informant at the time of Margaret's death in 1855. A pain when it happens, but errors do creep into registrations.
What was her birth place on the 1851 census? Added - just found it I think, Lochbroom, R&C?
Monica
-
I think there was an error in the way that the marriage has been entered. As illustrated by the rest of the entries on the page of register, witnesses' names were not included here.
Normally when witnesses are listed, the entry starts with the word (witnesses) abreviated or in full and then the name of each witness and where they came from.....
I see what you mean - and something else has now occurred to me. Compared to the other entries, this one looks rather faint. Could it be that the clerk started to write the entry, realised it was a mistake, and then erased it as best he could?
One possible reason that occurred to me was that he was recording a baptism, and realised he'd started to enter it in the wrong book. I was going to suggest looking to see if there might be a baptism that would fit with this explanation, and then noticed that Debra had already suggested one:
The surname is looks like MACKAE not MACRAE. There are are other events in Bracadale recorded as MACKAY so probably unlikely that their surname would be spelt differently. Perhaps this one is also MACRAE.....
Possibly a son baptised also in 1818.
MACKAE, ANGUS
ALEXANDER MAC KAE MARGT. MAC NIEL FR 25 (FR25)
17/09/1818
109 10/17
Bracadale
Debra :)