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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Canada Lookup Request => Topic started by: FionaRC on Friday 19 April 24 16:10 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I am looking for an Alan Edward Elton, born: 17 Feb 1877, Montreal. His father was William Mills Elton and was an insurance agent. I don't have any other info about William other than by 1920 he was deceased.
Alan was in the Boer War and then stayed in South Africa- I have a pretty good idea of his movements from then until he died in SA in 1929- but can't find any record of either Alan or William in Montreal, or anywhere else before around 1900.
The info I do have comes from his record while he was in the SA police and his marriage certificate to my great grandmother from 1920.
If anyone can find any record of him in Montreal, that would be really helpful.
Fiona
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Have you any idea who his mother was?
I can see him on a passenger list to the UK in 1920 with a Jane Elton but he should be on a passenger list from Canada if he went to S Africa
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Unfortunately I have no idea who his mother was.
Can I ask what passenger list you found him on? I haven't come across a Jane Elton yet. I have him on a passenger list between South Africa and the UK iin 1920 (during this trip he married my great grandmother and then returned to South Africa alone a few weeks later). But haven't managed to find him on any passenger lists to or from Canada.
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His Boer War service record would seem to be available so am wondering if you have them -- not seeing a reference to William unless it's on the marriage record in 1920.
Interestingly, there was a William Elton, an actor, who appeared in various plays including being in Montreal in 1881 (from newspapers.com).
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I have some info on his time in the boar war (everything i can find). We have his medal, I know what regiment he was in etc. What I can’t find is when and where he signed up.
After the boar war he served in the SA police in Durban and we have managed to find his records from there, and he lists his next of kin as WM Elton in Montreal.
On the marriage certificate to my great grandmother in 1920 (a marriage that nobody in my family was aware had happened until we found the record!) He states his fathers name as William Mills Elton (deceased), and his occupation as an insurance agent. Which unfortunately rules out William Elton the performer, which is a shame!
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Occupation rules out William Elton in the Montreal directories for 1875/76. Occupation was shoe maker. R 177 Panet. Montreal
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After the boar war he served in the SA police in Durban and we have managed to find his records from there, and he lists his next of kin as WM Elton in Montreal.
What's the date on the document where he names Wm Elton in Montreal as next of kin?
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From Wikipedia, this suggests he would have joined his regiment in Johannesburg:
The Imperial Light Horse was raised by the British in Johannesburg on 21 September 1899 for service in the Second Boer War. Its initial strength was 444 officers and men. It was informally known as the "Reformers Regiment" as many of its officers served on the Reform Committee, or more commonly the Uitlander Regiment by the Transvaal Government and the Boer Commandos.[1][2]
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A very tiny bit more info:
His service number when he first enlisted was 2859. It is also attached to a second service number of 39399.
The 39399 has him mistranscribed as surname "Etton". The index for his reenlistment (at Green Point, which is by Cape Town) in Dec 1901, (had been discharged from 2859), says he was Canadian, a planter, and NOK was his brother, D. Etton, residing Montreal. Sadly no address, just GPO Montreal.
So possibly the Wm Elton, his first NOK, was his father?
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Well done bbart. Unfortunately, I'm not seeing either name in the Montreal directories of the time.
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I'm also seeing a John Elton, also a trooper in the Imperial Light Horse, Service #1586, also references services #40755 which links to a William Johnson which must be a mistake.
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I'm also seeing a John Elton, also a trooper in the Imperial Light Horse, Service #1586, also references services #40755 which links to a William Johnson which must be a mistake.
Found your John Elton..... he was also transcribed as an Etton, but no change to his service number on the index I am looking at. He's British, NOK a stepmother, Mrs S Flint, in Tonbridge.
Or maybe this is his first enlistment? Getting confused here!
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBM%2FWO126%2FLAFEF%2FABW%2F040925
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Thanks everyone for looking into this for me- it's really appreciated.
A very tiny bit more info:
His service number when he first enlisted was 2859. It is also attached to a second service number of 39399.
The 39399 has him mistranscribed as surname "Etton". The index for his reenlistment (at Green Point, which is by Cape Town) in Dec 1901, (had been discharged from 2859), says he was Canadian, a planter, and NOK was his brother, D. Etton, residing Montreal. Sadly no address, just GPO Montreal.
So possibly the Wm Elton, his first NOK, was his father?
Does anyone happen to know what a 'planter' would do?
also can I ask the best place to look at boar war records? I tried to search for service number 39399 on 'find my past' and got someone else entirely!
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Ignore that last part! I managed to find him under 39399 when I tried again. Thanks for this hint. Very interesting- although I can't find any evidence of a D Elton in Montreal either unfortunatley.
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Not sure if there is any connection between AE Elton and this passenger (Miss Elton) --
Passenger Lists Leaving UK 1890-1960
Title Miss
First name(s) -
Last name Elton
Birth year 1882
Occupation Civil servant
Departure year 1914
Departure port London
Ship destination port South Africa
I mention the above because AE Elton's occupation is "Civil Servant" when he travels from Southampton to Durban in 1912 and 1922.
Some other UK to SA passenger records for him:
1901 - occupation is "Planter"
1914 - occupation is "Police"
1920 - occupation is "Police"
1925 - occupation is "Pensioner"
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Seems to travel quite a lot between South Africa and UK but nothing so far for Canada...........
Information you probably already have but it sometimes helps others looking.
Doesn't help but...........
Started trying to fathom who the Isabel Campbell was mentioned in his will .........
So the Isabel M Campbell whom Alan E Elton married ( registered September 1920 St Giles London 1b 1404 )
must be the same Mrs Isabel Campbell who lived in Perthshire, Scotland and was mentioned in his will - stranger in blood, in terms of the will of the deceased.
(Strangers in blood: Persons who have no tie between them by blood or
valid marriage) Intriguing, hadn't heard that expression before.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QLR2-Y51X
Arrived on UK incoming passenger list in 9 December 1914 - Isabel Campbell - aged 29 years - teacher - Cautley Doncaster England written in red underneath
Think she was under Miss J M Campbell on the outward passenger list 11 July 1914 - - teacher - aged 30 years -
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They weren't married for long as he was on the next ship (almost) back to SA in 1920. Fiona's online tree indicates that Isabel Campbell (nee Cameron) had been married before whose husband died in 1914. She remarried again in 1943 to a John Stewart.
There seems to be a site (Anglo Boer War) which may have the records, but it's currently offline.
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Isabel Campbell is my great grandmother. My great grandfather died in SA not long after Isabel's arrival and she was pregnant with my grandfather when she returned to the UK in December.
We only know that Alan existed because we have his medals alongside my great grandfather's (a civilian boar war medal). Him being married to my great grandmother came as quite a shock to my family. I can’t find any divorce records, so I presume they must have stayed married until he died? Despite neither of them seemingly saying anything and living on different continents.
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Alan was mistranscribed as Etton. So was John Elton. Were the errors on the original forms?
Is there a possibility that his name was actually Etton?
I wonder if he was trying to hide something and fibbed about Montreal?
Another possibility, was the family actually from a small town somewhat near Montreal?
Alan married when he was in his 40’s. I wonder if that was his first marriage and if not was he still married to someone else?
Isabel Campbell is my great grandmother. My great grandfather died in SA not long after Isabel's arrival and she was pregnant with my grandfather when she returned to the UK in December.
We only know that Alan existed because we have his medals alongside my great grandfather's (a civilian boar war medal). Him being married to my great grandmother came as quite a shock to my family. I can’t find any divorce records, so I presume they must have stayed married until he died? Despite neither of them seemingly saying anything and living on different continents.
Was the marriage a secret due to Alan possibly having another family - possibly in SA, Alan hiding something from his past, due to private reasons (that she didn’t want to tell her family) by Isabel, or for some other reason? Having posed the questions, I would still bet that your great grandfather was a respectable man and quite possibly we just haven’t yet found Canadian documents.
Added: perhaps Alan wanted Isabel to remain with him but she missed “home” yet didn’t want a divorce, hence their separate lives.
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Perhaps I missed it, but was his religious affiliation mentioned? I’m sure someone will advise if I am incorrect, but I think there are more (Quebec) Roman Catholic records available online than for other religions.
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He was Church of England (Anglican) based on enlistment record I've seen. Quebec's BMDs were recorded only by the churches up until quite recently (last 20 years). And the records are all online for the timeframe in which he was born altho' the transcriptions are often not the best.
My theory goes like this. Isobel met Alan in South Africa and he followed her back to the UK where they had a relationship and he finally married her in 1920. Doesn't explain why he left shortly afterwards or why she maintained the use of her first married name. It is possible that the marriage was annulled for some reason.
Have you found Isobel on the 1921 Census in England or Scotland?
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Isabella is living in the school she works in 1921 with her mother and my six year old gradfather in rural perthshire. I am pretty certain she never lived with Alan. And can't find a record of Alan returning to the uk between 1914 and 1920. I I think the reason they married secretly might remain a mystery!
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There seem to be a couple of Facebook groups that deal specifically with the Boer War which may help you track down the service records. If he was indeed born in Canada, why didn't he join a Canadian regiment? How did he get to South Africa?
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I'm seeing an A. Elton, aged 24, planter leaving the UK bound for the Cape, aboard the SS German, on 9 November 1901 which would be just before he re-enlists (or enlists) in December 1901.
I'm also seeing him coming back into the UK July 27, 1922 aboard the Walmer Castle.
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Thanks. That's really helpful.
Seems like there is lots of records of him travelling between the UK and South Africa since 1901, but no evidence of him ever being in Canada!
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From Wikipedia, this suggests he would have joined his regiment in Johannesburg:
The Imperial Light Horse was raised by the British in Johannesburg on 21 September 1899 for service in the Second Boer War. Its initial strength was 444 officers and men. It was informally known as the "Reformers Regiment" as many of its officers served on the Reform Committee, or more commonly the Uitlander Regiment by the Transvaal Government and the Boer Commandos.[1][2]
Has the exact date been mentioned for Alan’s first military sign up? Apologies if this doesn’t fit his enrollment date…
Canada “footed the bill” for an all-volunteer force - Canada paid for recruitment and transportation to South Africa. The first contingent arrived in South Africa in November 1899.
https://www.warmuseum.ca/learn/dispatches/for-queen-and-country-canadians-and-the-south-african-war-1899-1902/#tabs
If Alan did sail from Canada c1899, perhaps he sailed with the contingent and that is why we have not found him leaving Canada? ???
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The service record for Canadians serving in the Boer War is online and searchable and I haven't found him there.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/982306?availability=Family%20History%20Library
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I’ve been using Anc*try and I haven’t found him there, either.
My grandfather was in the military c1914 but I’ve not been able to find his papers. I thought there might be a possibility that Alan’s aren’t available as well. :-\
Thank you for your earlier answer re COE - I should had acknowledged it before now.
Added: and for including your theory.