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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Durham => Topic started by: aidansrest on Saturday 09 March 24 15:16 GMT (UK)
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Hi
Looking to confirm the parents of James Edward Tulloch, born in Sunderland on the 10th April 1916 (mother's maiden name is 'Burns', and his brother, Thomas, born in Sunderland on the 16th September 1917, (mother's maiden name given as 'Burns.')
No record of a Tulloch/Burns marriage in Sunderland (or anywhere that I can see), however, the 1921 census (I just have very limited access), appear to find the family living in Southwick.
Both James and Thomas are given the correct year of birth (no place of birth listed), and they are listed with 'parents' James W Tulloch born 1875 Sunderland, and Elisa (Eliza) Jane born 1884 (no place of birth given).
Cannot find the family in 1939, but their son, James Edward, married Ivy Simpson in Sunderland in 1940.
James W Tulloch appears to have married Eliza J Butler in Sunderland in 1915, but both the boys mother's maiden name is definitely given as 'Burns.'
James W Tulloch is easy to trace backwards - surname spelt as 'Tullock' but who was Eliza Jane Burns/Butler?
Thanks
Sue
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If it helps in 1939 James W Tulloch is transcribed as Jane W Tullock b 1877 on F M P with wife Eliza in Sunderland and her birth date is listed as 1 Jan 1882
Kay
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It sounds as if the mother had been married before?
So a marriage would be in her previous married name.
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On Ancestry:
Elizabetha Jane Burns
Female
Birth Date 1 Jan 1882
Baptism Date 2 Feb 1882
Baptism Place St. Marys, Sunderland, Durham, England
Father
Joannis Burns
Mother
Elizabeth Kane Burns
Maureen
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Typically found James and Eliza in 1939 after I posted, although neither son is with them.
I did think that Eliza may have married previously too, but no trace, as far as I can see.
Sue
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Goodness!! That looks like her!!
Thanks so much, I'll try and locate her on the census!
Sue
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Marriage Sept qtr 1915
Sunderland Registration District Vol 10a, page 1436
Tulloch, James W
Butler, Eliza J
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I wonder if it was her mother that married again?
She seems to appear on the 1901 census as Eliza Butler - mother Elizabeth Ann, father James
Sue
Found her marriage to James and Eliza J Butler, but no sign of her previous marriage for her.
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James W Tulloch appears to have married Eliza J Butler in Sunderland in 1915
That marriage certificate could be useful and confirm her fathers surname.
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I Know!
However, I checked to see when James Butler married Elizabeth (Eliza's mother), and he did so in Sunderland in 1884, two years after his Eliza's birth.
Elizabeth married as Elizabeth Keeling - their first child, John, born in 1885, has mother's maiden name of 'Keeling.'
Sue
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You don't have to be married to have a baby. If Elizabeth married as KEELING then she probably wasn't married to John BURNS.
Debra :)
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Elizabeth Keeling in 1881 living in Sunderland with John Burns and another daughter??
John Burns 25 Head b Newcastle
Elizabeth Burns 19 Wife b Sunderland
Mary A. Burns 1 Daughter b Sunderland
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I saw that too and wondered 🤔
Can't find the family again...but can't see a marriage either
Sue
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There is this possible, with another couple on page
Marriages Mar Q 1880
Burn John George Sunderland 10a 658
Felling Elizabeth Ann Sunderland 10a 658
Tree on ancestry for the Butler children states has birth certs and MMN is Keelan. Seems a lot of errors when name is transcribed.
Added: there is also a marriage in 1882 for John George Burn, with likely family in 1881, so looks like not same person?
Cas
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There is this possible, with another couple on page
Marriages Mar Q 1880
Burn John George Sunderland 10a 658
Felling Elizabeth Ann Sunderland 10a 658
Cas
There is this possible son's birth for the couple
BURN, WILLIAM FELLING
GRO Reference: 1880 J Quarter in SUNDERLAND Volume 10A Page 691
and possibly the family in 1881 living in Monkwearmouth Shore
John Burn 20
Elizabeth Burn 18
William Burn 1
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Thanks everyone for all your help - I'm convinced that Eliza Jane Butler was born Elizabeth Jane Burns and has 'assumed' her stepfather's name, but still struggling to comfirm.
Thanks
Sue
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Ok...so got copy marriage certificate between James William Tulloch and Eliza Jane Butler (Burns). She named her father as being James Butler (deceased - he was, dying in 1901), a glass maker. One of the witnesses was a Peter Butler, her half brother.
James Butler was her stepfather, her mother married him in 1884.
So, I'm guessing she was born as 'Burns' but has assumed her stepfather's surname, but used her original surname when registering her children's births!
So confusing!!
Sue