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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Blairvadach on Monday 01 January 24 16:47 GMT (UK)
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Hi folks
Happy New Year and Lang my your lum reek!!
I am looking for some help with clarifying some confusion/conflicting information about William Fullerton 1869-1928.
He married Susan Hart (1867-1905) 1/1.1891 in Busby, Renfrewshire. William and Susan had five children.
I have the 1891 and 1901 census’s living in Busby. William works in as a printfield worker.
William then married Grace McAdam 12 Jul 1907 Alexandria, Balloch, Dunbartonshire. They were both widowed, they got married at Grace’s family home and both shared the same occupation, ( printfield hand). They had one daughter (my grandmother) born 1910.
The family are living in Bonhill, Alexandria.
At some point the family moved to Edinburgh were Grace died in 1920 and William died in 1928. He was a rubber worker on these death certificates.
On his marriage to Grace McAdam William provided that Eliza Fullerton was his mother and no father was recorded….however, on his marriage to Susan Hart he stated the his parents were John Fullerton, Printfield Labourer and Jane Fullerton M/S McGaw. John Fullerton and Jane McGaw are also recorded as being his parents on his death certificate!!
One of his granddaughters has a middle name McGaw!!!
The census information states that he was born in Ireland.
I have found a birth document for William Fullerton born 17th January 1869 Antrim, Ireland
Parents are John Fullerton and Eliza Craig!!!
Was Eliza his mother or Jane???
Any hints on how I can narrow this down would be appreciated.
Regards Tam
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On the 1901 census I noticed this
Address Main Street Busby Renfrewshire
John Fullerton age 80 born Antrim Retired printfield worker
Jane McGaw Fullerton age 86 born Antrim
James Fullerton age 41 born Antrim printfield labourer
They can be found on the census records 1881/1891
There is a death for a Janet Fullerton other name McGaw 1903 Bonhill might be worth while looking at as William was in that area
Rosie
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Hi Rosie
Thanks for your help. This certainly is Janet McGaw and I have seen the address of her death before ( need to check my notes) I think it’s the McAdam side of my family.
I wonder if Williams parents John and Janet moved to Bonhill prior to William….he probably moved there and met Grace McAdam after the death of his first wife.
Dumbarton had a thriving print field industry back then.
Who was Eliza Fullerton then?????
I have found a few children born to a John Fullerton and Eliza Craig including a William.
I will need to find the census.
C
Thanks again Tam
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On the 2 marriage records for William, who are the witnesses?
___________
In case this is of use .....
These are two more children of John Fullerton and mother - McGaw living in Scotland
Both of these families are working in the calico / printfield industry and living around Busby area
Joseph FULLERTON b abt 1852 county Antrim; d. 1921 Busby (married 1875 Cathcart to Rachel McCURLY)
Children – Janet, John, Francis, Joseph, Robert, Wilson, Bessie
Elizabeth Mary FULLERTON (Moore) b. abt 1842-1844? Ireland; d. 1920 Bonhill (married Adam MOORE in 1877 Mearns)
Children – Letetia, David, Joseph
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Hi Neale
Do you mean Janet McGaw?
Cheers Tam
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Hello
My money is on William being the illegitimate son of a daughter of John and Janet - eg: Elizabeth?
Do you know who the Grandson is in their 1881 Census?
1881 CENSUS: Struthers Land, Busby RNF
Head: John Fullerton 60, b Ireland
Wife: Jane 68, b Ireland
Dau: Jane Fullerton 32, b Ireland
Son: James Fullerton 25, b Ireland
Son: John Fullerton 22, b Ireland
Grandson: William John Fullerton 15, b Ireland, Bleachhouse worker
Could this be your William?
Cheers
AMBLY
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My initial questions included:
> William: Census 1891, 1901, 1911, 1921 - Do they all only say born Ireland - anything more specific?
> What are the names and birth order (years) of William's children
> Who were the witness to both marriages
> Who informed of his death
> What is the address of Janet McGaw's death - and who informed?
added:
In the 1881 Census, Janet & John Fullerton's daughter now Mrs Adam Moore:
Enumerated as: Eliza Moore
She died: Elizabeth Moore or Fullerton, mms McGaw aged 70 - died 1920 Bonhill
Would be interesting to see who informed of her death?
Cheers
AMBLY
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Hi Neale
Do you mean Janet McGaw?
Cheers Tam
Yes, Sorry, I have corrected the post. Their death certificates show mother as mcGaw.
Can you post the names of the witnesses to William's marriages?
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My money is on William being the illegitimate son of a daughter of John and Janet - eg: Elizabeth?
Do you know who the Grandson is in their 1881 Census?
I tend to agree with this theory.
a/ It looks as if the children of Fullerton and Mcgaw are born 1840s-1850s.
b/ Jane McGaw born abt 1813. Still having children in 1869??! Seems unlikely.
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I tend to agree with this theory.
b/ Jane McGaw born abt 1813. Still having children in 1869??! Seems unlikely.
I agree - and add, there can surely be little to no doubt, that Jane/t and John in the Census living near, on same street, or with William & his family - are the parents referred to in William's 1891 Marriage. ie: making Jane/t far to old to be William's biological mother. They very possibly raised him and he saw them in a parental light - that happened a lot (still does actually, I have a cousin today with that exact scenario: grandparents raised her, she considers them 100% as her parents, and her aunts and uncles as her siblings)
cheers
AMBLY
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On William’s second marriage in 1907, David Moore is a witness.
I think this will be David, born 1879, the son of Eliza Fullerton and Adam Moore, and potentially a half-brother to William Fullerton.
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William’s age on marriages and at least four census records suggest a birth year around 1865-66, and not 1869 as per your opening post.
1881 census – age 15 (born 1866)
1 Jan 1891 marriage – age 25 (born 1865)
1891 census – age 25 (born 1866)
1907 marriage – age 40 (1867)
1911 census – age 46 (born 1865)
1921 census - age 56 (born 1865)
1928 death – age 62 (born 1866)
With the information we have now, I think you have to discard (as incorrect) the William born 1869 Antrim to parents John Fullerton and Eliza Craig.
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I have been looking for birth registrations for William Fullerton around 1865-66. I have not found any, but there is this possibility …
A birth registered in 1865 Galgorm / Balymeena (Antrim) for a William John ALLEN
– mother is Eliza Mary FULLERTON
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03565/2313180.pdf
(There is a corresponding baptism in Galgorm for this birth. Cannot yet find anything more than a transcription for the baptism.)
This birth interested me for a number of reasons:-
• Both the first two names of child William John (as on 1881 census) and mother’s names Eliza Mary FULLERTON are an exact match.
• Also I can see no further children born to these same parents, and no marriage for them.
• Also there is a marriage for who I believe is the same William John ALLAN in Ballymena in Nov 1866 to Matilda Foster.
• Birth place for this William John born 1865 is “Connor”. This is the same place that we have as birth place for Jane McGaw and for her son James Fullerton (see 1901 Mearns census)
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oooh! Neale1961 ;D how exciting! I think you may have cracked it! I was unable to find any Birth registration under Fullerton at https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie - but I was in the same place, concentrating on Ballymena DO due to the PoB Connor:
I was looking at Griffiths Valuation - 1862
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01swd/
Tullynamullan, Connor, Ballymena, Antrim
Occupier: John Fullerton, House & small Garden
Immediate Lessor: Jane Agnew
a) https://www.townlands.ie/antrim/toome-upper/connor/kells/tullynamullan/
b) https://www.rootschat.com/links/01swc/
On the historical map, Tullynamullan is thru where the two red rectangles intersect on the right - comparing the border shape in link a) to that in link b)
Cheers
AMBLY
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I had also earlier found this - interesting, considering William's daughter of his 2nd marriage was same name - and now more so intereasting , given the Tullynamullan place of Birth for William John Allen
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1867/11508/8232280.pdf
Letitia Fullerton, spinster full age, of Tullinamullan. Father: John Fullerton, Weaver
married on 11 Dec 1867 Ballymena
James McKee, Bachelor, full age, Soldier, of Tullinamullan. Father: John McKee Weaver
Witness: William Carlisle. Anna Fullerton.
Possible daughter of John & Jane - aunt of William?
Cheers
AMBLY
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AMBLY, Good information from Griffiths Valuation 1862 – Isn’t it great when it all starts to fit together!
I also looked at the 1867 marriage of Letitia, because I reckoned it might be a family name, but had not made any connection.
Now you have the information re John Fullerton at “Tullynamullan”, it makes a link more likely. The witness Anna Fullerton possibly another in the family.
There are certainly lots of Fullerton families in the Ballymena area.
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Death certs available on ScotlandsPeople They certainly lived long lives!
FULLERTON JOHN age 81 Mother:- MCMILLAN
1902 493 / 2 BONHILL
FULLERTON JANET age 90 Mother:- WHITE
1903 493 / 105 BONHILL
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This might be the death of the other son who is aged 41 and unmarried in the 1901 census.
FULLERTON JAMES age 58
1919 493 / 149 BONHILL
I would expect James to be the informant for his parents' deaths.
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Well done Neale and Ambly looks like you have solved the mystery :)
Rosie
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Hi Neale, Ambly and Rosie.
I have just caught up with your recent posts and need to get my head around this information!!
Thank you so much for your help in solving this puzzle!
I should have known that John and Janet were Williams grandparents……it was good that he left us an obvious clue about who his birth mother was!
I now have Janet’s death certificate…father Joseph McGaw (farmer) and mother Elizabeth White.
Thanks again.
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Hi Neale, Ambly and Rosie
Spent this afternoon looking into the information that you provided and found out that…..
Elizabeth Mary Fullerton, 35, spinster married Adam Moore 42 years old, widow on 27.4.1877 in Busby.
They had four children.
1. Letitia Moore1878
2. David Galbraith Moore 1879 and he died 1957 in Bonhill
3.Kate Moore and died in infancy 1881
4. Joseph McGaw Moore born 1882 and died 1961 in Bonhill
Adam Moore died in 1884
Elizabeth died in 1920 as per your information.
I have Johns DC
I also have the 1911 census Elizabeth in 40 Mitchell Street with sons David and Joseph ( both men were sewing machine workers and the only place they could be working at is the famous Singer factory in Clydebank ( my home town)
It’s interesting that the parents were still in Renfrewshire in the 1901 census and probably moved to Bonhill to be looked after.
Thanks again for your help.
Cheers Tam
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That's good Tam it's all fitted in to place with the information given to you
The singer factory was a very popular place all changed now in Clydebank I'm not far from there ( Helensburgh)
Rosie
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That's good Tam it's all fitted in to place with the information given to you
The singer factory was a very popular place all changed now in Clydebank I'm not far from there ( Helensburgh)
Rosie
Absolutely 💯
My mother’s middle name was Fullerton!
Cheers Tam
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Lovely to see “LETITIA” as a family name. Mother of John FULLERTON (1821-1902) was named Letitia McMillan.
Letitia FULLERTON (daughter of John F and Janet McGaw) born abt 1846; died 1917 Belfast
- Married James McKee in 1867 Ballymena
- Children: Mary Jane 1872, Martha 1874, James 1877, Joseph 1879, Sarah 1880, Letitia 1883
- 1901 census (Chief Street, Shankill Ward, Antrim) https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Shankill_Ward/Chief_Street/984329/
- 1911 census (Kells) https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Kells/Ballee/121588/
Letitia MOORE (daughter of Eliza Mary F and Adam Moore)
- Married William McLaughlan in 1899 Busby
- Children born in Busby and Aston, Cheshire: Elizabeth Mary, Agnes Orr, Janet Letitia Fullerton, Eleanor Nixon
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Lovely to see “LETITIA” as a family name. Mother of John FULLERTON (1821-1902) was named Letitia McMillan.
Letitia FULLERTON (daughter of John F and Janet McGaw) born abt 1846; died 1917 Belfast
- Married James McKee in 1867 Ballymena
- Children: Mary Jane 1872, Martha 1874, James 1877, Joseph 1879, Sarah 1880, Letitia 1883
- 1901 census (Chief Street, Shankill Ward, Antrim) https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Shankill_Ward/Chief_Street/984329/
- 1911 census (Kells) https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Kells/Ballee/121588/
Letitia MOORE (daughter of Eliza Mary F and Adam Moore)
- Married William McLaughlan in 1899 Busby
- Children born in Busby and Aston, Cheshire: Elizabeth Mary, Agnes Orr, Janet Letitia Fullerton, Eleanor Nixon
Hi Neale
I saw the information about Letitia marriage to William McLaughlan on Ancestry.
Thanks for the other information.
Ps I am still working on the Milligan/Buckley tree project and you kindly sent me some information about.
Cheers Tam
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In 1905 Susan Hart died on 16th August 1905. She died of cardiac arrest and seems she had a heart condition for two years. Her address was 40 Mitchell Street,Alexandria and this is the same address for my grandmother who was born in 1910……. this is the same address that was registered for John and Janet when they died….so William must have taken them in to look after them before they died ❤️
Sometime between the 1901 census and Susan’s death the family move to Bonhill. This move is likely due to work. We know that Renfrewshire is well known for cotton and the famous Paisley pattern!!! Aexandria is also very well know for it’s Calico print works….
In the 1911 Census William and his family are now living at 42 Random Street, Bonhill, Alexandria
William Fullerton 46 Cloth worker at Calico print works.
Grace 38
James 16 Cloth worker at Calico print works.
Janet 14
Lizzie 12
Margaret 11
Grace 6
William 3
Helen 1
Cheers Tam
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In 1891 census for John Fullerton and Janet McGaw, there is a James Fullerton, age 6 recorded as a nephew.
I was curious about who he was. Now, I think he was actually a grand-nephew.
He was James Love FULLERTON born 3 Jan 1885 "Thorny Bank" (sic), Eastwood; died 1965 in Pennsylvania USA.
He was the son of James FULLERTON and Sophia LOVE.
James Fullerton - Sophia Love marriage in 1881 Eastwood
Mother - Sophia (Love) FULLERTON born 1857 Scotland, died 1933 USA
Father – James FULLERTON born 14 May 1856 Ballymena, Ireland. Died 1924 USA
James Fullerton was a Printfield labourer, Eastwood in 1881-1901 Scotland census.
He and his family emigrated to Delaware County, Pennsylvania in dribs ‘n’ drabs between abt 1906 – 1910.
James Fullarton’s USA death and his marriage record show he was the son of Alexander Fullerton and Agnes Rae.
Continued in next post
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Alexander FULLERTON married Agnes REA in 1848 Ballymena
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1848/09342/5382441.pdf
Alexander Fullerton Death in 1879 Ballymena (age 53) ie born abt 1826
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1879/06509/4874457.pdf
I believe Agnes (“Nancy”) age 54 is in the 1881 census at 63 Herriot St Pollokshaws, with her son James and family.
She remarried in 1884 Ballymena to Samuel TELFORD, and she died in Ballymena in 1903.
Continued in next post
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So if I’m thinking clearly, possibly Alexander Fullerton and your John Fullerton were brothers, both the sons of James Fullerton and Letitia McMillan.
I believe there was another brother named James Fullerton (born abt 1820) who was also a weaver and married to Margaret Thompson.
He died in late Dec 1878. https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1879/06531/4881913.pdf
His marriage in 1849 also shows his father as James , a schoolmaster
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1849/09362/5390143.pdf
Alexander and James seem to be linked to Tullygarley in Ballymena, and are also in the weaving trade.
Continued in next post
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Looking a bit more closely at the family of Alexander Fullerton and Agnes Rae/Rea.
Children that I can see:
• Elizabeth Fullerton b.1849 (Married John Gordon 1864. Emigrated to Michigan, USA 1874)
• Joseph Fullerton b.1851 (Married Matilda McMaster 1867, & Mary Boyd in 1880; died Ballymena 1902)
• James Fullerton b.1856 (Married 1880 Eastwood to Sophia Love; Emigrated to USA; died 1924 Delaware)
• Alexander R Fullerton b.1860 (Also emigrated to USA; married Sarah Quinn 1883 Philadelphia, died 1951 Delaware)
• William J Fullerton b.1861 (Also emigrated to USA; married Eliza Jane Bowles 1899 Delaware; died 1929 Delaware)
• Robert A Fullerton b.1862 (Also emigrated to USA; married Emma Butler 1889 Delaware; died 1941 Delaware)
• Hugh Fullerton b.1865 (Married 1887 Ballymena to Sarah Campbell; Also emigrated to USA; died 1894 Delaware)
• Nancy Fullerton b.1868 died as baby
• McKane Fullerton b.1871 died age 4
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In 1891 census for John Fullerton and Janet McGaw, there is a James Fullerton, age 6 recorded as a nephew.
I was curious about who he was. Now, I think he was actually a grand-nephew.
He was James Love FULLERTON born 3 Jan 1885 Thorny Bank, Eastwood; died 1965 in Pennsylvania USA.
He was the son of James FULLERTON and Sophia LOVE.
James Fullerton - Sophia Love marriage in 1881 Eastwood
Mother - Sophia (Love) FULLERTON born 1857 Scotland, died 1933 USA
Father – James FULLERTON born 14 May 1856 Ballymena, Ireland. Died 1924 USA
James Fullerton was a Printfield labourer, Eastwood in 1881-1901 Scotland census.
He and his family emigrated to Delaware County, Pennsylvania in dribs ‘n’ drabs between abt 1906 – 1910.
James Fullarton’s USA death and his marriage record show he was the son of Alexander Fullerton and Agnes Rae.
Continued in next post
Hi Neale
That’s fantastic!
I have been digging into this family (on Ancestry) and going by this information it matches perfectly with what you have described. There’s a wealth of evidence to back this up.
The occupations in the printfield industry is to the fore in the Fullerton and extend families!!!
Thanks again for your help.
Cheers Tam
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So if I’m thinking clearly, possibly Alexander Fullerton and your John Fullerton were brothers, both the sons of James Fullerton and Letitia McMillan.
I believe there was another brother named James Fullerton (born abt 1820) who was also a weaver and married to Margaret Thompson.
He died in late Dec 1878. https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1879/06531/4881913.pdf
His marriage in 1849 also shows his father as James , a schoolmaster
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1849/09362/5390143.pdf
Alexander and James seem to be linked to Tullygarley in Ballymena, and are also in the weaving trade.
Continued in next post
Hi Neale
If you are correct about Alexander and James being the brothers of John then I strongly believe that they had a sister Agnes/Nancy Fullerton!!!
She married William Orr 3 Oct 1846 Ballymena, Antrim, Ireland Ballymena First Presbyterian Church. Both age 26 from Tullaghgarley. William's occupation: weaver. Fathers: James Orr, weaver, and James Fullerton, schoolmaster. See attachment.
I believe that they had four children and their daughter Agnes married Samuel Johnstone and guess what……,they settled in Renfrewshire and worked in the calico print business!!!
Agnes died in 1908, Eastwood.
Agnes and Samuel must have moved to Scotland soon after the eldest child was born as the next child was born in Renfrewshire.
Cheers Tam
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HI Tom, your last post has sent me off down a very deep rabbit hole today – hope the next few posts are of use, and you can understand my scribblings! ….
Unfortunately the marriage for your John Fullerton was before the registration of marriages started in 1845. It was probably around 1840-1841. However, I wonder if your John might have been born earlier than 1820 (as per census). His wife was born abt 1813, and if they married around 1840, John would not have been of full age unless born around 1818 or earlier.
When you look at all the Fullerton records for the relevant time period in Ballymena, there is only one James Fullerton who has children marrying. He is the schoolmaster.
The fact that all his children seem to be weavers, makes me wonder if James was initially a weaver too, but perhaps became the schoolmaster in later life as he was one of the few in the parish who was literate. Just me speculating.
There were possibly other children of James Fullerton the schoolmaster who were married before 1845, so we don’t know them because we have no records.
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These 6 are all definitely the same family- children of James Fullerton (schoolmaster) from Tullygarley in Ballymena.
Does your John fit in here as one of the younger sons in the family? :)
• Robert John Fullerton born abt 1815, died 1873 (weaver); married 1847 Ballymena to Margaret Connolly. Note: his marriage record gives name of father as James Moore Fullerton, schoolmaster.
– links to Renfrewshire, a son named James born abt 1853 married 1881 Eastwood to Margaret Mailey at 36 Herriott St Pollockshaws. He is in Eastwood in 1891 census, and died Eastwood 1904. Another child Mary Ann Fullerton born abt 1852 is in Herriot St Pollockshaws in 1881 census with her sister Margaret (Fullerton) Gault born abt 1860.
• Mary Fullerton born abt 1818; married 1850 Ballymena to William Stewart (weaver) - marriage witnessed by William Orr and Alexander Fullerton
• Agnes / Nancy Fullerton abt 1820 -1875; married 1846 Ballymena to William Orr (weaver).
Robert J Fullerton is a witness on the marriage
– links to Renfrewshire and calico printing through daughter Agnes Johnstone (as per your post)
There is also a son named James Orr (1847) who is in Dumbartonshire in 1891-1901 census. He died 1928.
• James Fullerton abt 1822- 1878 (weaver) married 1849 Ballymena to Margaret /Martha Thompson. William Orr witness to the marriage
• Alexander Fullerton abt 1825-1879 (weaver) married 1848 Ballymena to Agnes Rea
– links to Renfrewshire and calico printing through his son, and his 6yr old grand-son who is with your John Fullerton in the 1891 census.
• Sarah Fullerton (born abt 1826 - 1904) married 1848 Ballymena to John McMeekin (bleacher/ dyer) who died 1883 Eastwood.
This couple are in Thornliebank Eastwood, Renfrewshire as early as 1871 census, working in the textile indsutry.
https://www.freecen.org.uk/search_records/5b91a7d7f4040b176c900761/sarah-mcmeekin-1871-renfrewshire-eastwood-1832-?locale=en
Looks as if Sarah (Fullerton) McMeekin died in Eastwood in 1904 – on death index her mother’s name shows as “Miller”. Not McMillan :-\, but name may not have been remembered correctly by whoever was the informant. The other possibility is that her father James had more than one wife. First wife Letitia McMillan and second wife Sarah Miller. This might explain why the name Letitia is not present in offspring of all family lines – this is the only aspect that gives me some cause for reservation.
[Sarah’s death rego might be useful to see what it says about parents. It might support or cancel my theory about 2 wives for James F]
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One gets the impression that James Fullerton schoolmaster may still have been alive at the time of some of those marriages in the 1840s, but then he must have died well before death registration started in 1864.
Griffiths valuations showing in the parish of Connor:
3 Fullerton lease holders at Tullaghgar.
James F, Alexander F, and Sarah F.
We can identify James (junior) and Alexander, but I wonder if Sarah might be the widow of James F (senior), a second wife ? - Sarah Miller? No death found for her either, so before 1864.
Your John Fullerton lease holder at Tullynamullan
Robert John Fullerton (as above) lease holder at Ballee
A couple of other Fullertons in the same parish may be part of the extended family.
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One gets the impression that James Fullerton schoolmaster may still have been alive at the time of some of those marriages in the 1840s, but then he must have died well before death registration started in 1864.
Griffiths valuations showing in the parish of Connor:
3 Fullerton lease holders at Tullaghgar.
James F, Alexander F, and Sarah F.
We can identify James (junior) and Alexander, but I wonder if Sarah might be the widow of James F (senior), a second wife ? - Sarah Miller? No death found for her either, so before 1864.
Your John Fullerton lease holder at Tullynamullan
Robert John Fullerton (as above) lease holder at Ballee
A couple of other Fullertons in the same parish may be part of the extended family.
Hi Neale
Found the Griffiths valuation.
Does the fact that she has a house and garden mean anything?
She attached DC for Sarah and John
States father was a farm labourer…..on my Johns he’s a labourer!!
Sarah and John lived less than 4 miles away from each other!!! I don’t think that is coincidental do you?
Another interesting fact is that Nancy Rea d 1903 in buried alongside her first husband Alexander at Tullygarley….
Thanks again for all your help and support.
Cheers Tam
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I don't know too much about the Griffiths Valuations except it gives the names of leaseholders, who you would expect to be the the head of the house. Seeing a woman named, I assumed the lease would have been passed to a widow from a deceased husband. I can't imagine that a young single woman would be a lease holder. That is why I speculated that "Sarah Fullerton" might be the widow of James the schoolmaster.
Regarding the posted death certs - the images posted are too small to read on the screen, and I think it might be a copyright infringement to post the whole thing anyway. It is always a good idea to look at who the informant was, to see how accurate their knowledge and recording of details might be.
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I don't know too much about the Griffiths Valuations except it gives the names of leaseholders, who you would expect to be the the head of the house. Seeing a woman named, I assumed the lease would have been passed to a widow from a deceased husband. I can't imagine that a young single woman would be a lease holder. That is why I speculated that "Sarah Fullerton" might be the widow of James the schoolmaster.
Regarding the posted death certs - the images posted are too small to read on the screen, and I think it might be a copyright infringement to post the whole thing anyway. It is always a good idea to look at who the informant was, to see how accurate their knowledge and recording of details might be.
I believe there’s doubt that your hypothesis is correct regarding Sarah.
I have achieved my initial request in finding out who was the mother of John and much much more and everything else is a bonus.
I have collated most of this thread on my tree on Ancestry!!
As you will be well aware “facts” can change!!!!
Thanks again for your time and effort.
Cheers Tam
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It would be something if John Fullerton had any links to this Alexander Fullerton!!
http://www.ballintoy.connor.anglican.org/ballintoychurch.html
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We have the schoolmaster’s full name James Moore Fullerton from the marriage of his son Robert Fullerton in 1847. (I am guessing his mother was a Moore.)
Newspaper report of his death:
FULLERTON: [Belfast Newsletter, 21 Aug 1827]
On 5th August, after a two days illness, aged 44, at Tullygarley, near Ballymena, JAMES MOORE FULLERTON, Orange District Master. Members of 27 lodges attended his funeral, & thousands of others.
So that puts his birth around 1783.
It fits with a marriage about 1810 and first children of that marriage being born around 1810-13.
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Added - a very old post related to this family.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=8285.0
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We have the schoolmaster’s full name James Moore Fullerton from the marriage of his son Robert Fullerton in 1847. (I am guessing his mother was a Moore.)
Newspaper report of his death:
FULLERTON: [Belfast Newsletter, 21 Aug 1827]
On 5th August, after a two days illness, aged 44, at Tullygarley, near Ballymena, JAMES MOORE FULLERTON, Orange District Master. Members of 27 lodges attended his funeral, & thousands of others.
So that puts his birth around 1783.
It fits with a marriage about 1810 and first children of that marriage being born around 1810-13.
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Added - a very old post related to this family.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=8285.0
That’s absolutely brilliant!!
I had seen some information about him being a Freemason on Ancestry.
You are never going to believe this but I messaged one of the contributors on this old post and within an hour he had messaged me back ( he’s on holiday and going to get back to me next week),
His line is through the Orr/ Fullerton marriage….he wrote this on the old post so fingers crossed!!
“Your William Orr was my 2nd g grandfather. To make it real, his daughter was my father's grandmother. I have photos of her with my father and of her sisters. And there's plenty more... I hope your message isn't too old now and you still check in. I think we can exchange quite a bit of information”.
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I don’t believe the Orange Order is the same as Freemasonry.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange_Order
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I don’t believe the Orange Order is the same as Freemasonry.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange_Order
Hi Neale
It’s not but you can be in both!!! |)
Cheers Tam
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Filling in a couple of gaps re the children of John Fullerton and Janet McGaw:
John Fullerton (Blacksmith) b abt 1859 Ireland; died 1900 Kelvin
Married Annie Monroe in 1886 in Belfast
Children:
Janet Fullerton - 1887 Belfast
George Fullerton - 1889 Belfast
John Fullerton - 1890 Belfast
James Fullerton - 1895 Govan (died as baby)
Isabella Fullerton - 1898 Govan (died age 2)
Elizabeth Fullerton - 1900 Govan
Jane Fullerton (printfield worker) b abt 1849 Ireland; died 1881 Mearns (not married)
James Fullerton (printfield worker) b abt 1856 Ireland; possible death 1919 Bonhill
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John Fullerton (Blacksmith) b abt 1859 Ireland; died 1900 Kelvin
Married Annie Monroe in 1886 in Belfast
Neale,
He married Annie MUNRO on 20 November 1886.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1886/10848/5960667.pdf
KG
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Neale,
He married Annie MUNRO on 20 November 1886.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1886/10848/5960667.pdf
KG
That’s correct! Marriage record was sighted, just didn’t post a link.
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Neale1961 - As I'm getting my head around some of the information in this post, I'll add a wee bit of expansion to one of your comments concerning Agnes/Nancy Fullarton, my great-great-grandmother.
She and William Orr had 7 children, all born in Tullygarley
James (1847-1928) Helensburgh (my great-grandfather)
Agnes (1848-1908) Pollockshaws
Margaret (1851-1889) Ballymena
Mary (b. 1853)
Jane (1856-1912)
William John (1858-bef 1861) Infant death
William John (1861-1953) Sydney
I have letters written by William Orr (who was also a joiner), describing wife Nancy Fullarton's illness and death, at home in Tullygarley.
Alistair
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I am sure Tom will be happy to receive any additional information.
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I am sure Tom will be happy to receive any additional information.
He will be Neale.
Cheers
Jack Gee